binman

Or perhaps they should - some resilience training. I believe it was part of frosty, omac and nibblas training regime.

Is that you JimmyG?

Fair call, he Waa clunking them better, which suggests it's not a technique thing. I predict after another preseason the days of jvr being underrated will be well gone. If Jefferson can fulfil his potential (which would free up petts to go back or play as a swingman) talk of needing to bring in another key forward will also be gone.

Hello Steve the Man Jordan, aka Jimmy Gadson, aka middle aged Demon. Weed delisted, and likely stranded on 76 AFL games (can't see another club picking him up, though stranger things have happened). Meanwhile, my boy Omac, keeps keeping on, and with a bit of luck with injury will play his 100th game of AFL footy next season.

It's funny you should say that, the one knock on JVR is he's not always a one grabber (though much better than weed in that regard - and i reckon having to ruck is a factor as he'soften gassed) And Jackson isn't a one grabber either. Hopefully Jefferson breaks the trend of our young key forwards not clunking their marks.

Good points, well made. But I think you have misinterpreted what I was saying. I wasn't making a case for the clarry situation all being a media creation, or that the mongers are the big bad wolf. As I have previously noted, I don't blame the mongers for their nonsense, I blame the collective us - they are simply giving us what we want. A demand and supply equation. I never suggested there wasn't some veracity to the monger's gossip, or their narrative was created out of whole cloth. And because i didn't mention the club or the players doesn't mean I don't think they have contributed to the palaver. They have. Like you, i don't discount what the mongers say. Their is clearly some stuff to sort out. But what that stuff is, where the truth lies, who is the problem etc etc isn't the point I was making. My point was about the Heisenberg observer effect's ("the act of observing a system will influence what is being observed") relevance for how dramas in footy is covered. Perhaps it is a stretch, but the analogy I'm making is the mongers 'observe' a scenario or situation, like clarry's, and influence what is being observed - ie create a narrative. Pull together theories, supposition and hearsay and bind them with some facts (eg clarry met with the cats). Footy fans 'observe' that narrative, but always want more (just look at how the tracc and clarry threads exploded and grew as evidence of that). And the mongers, keen for clicks are happy to give then more - even if it means less facts and more supposition and 'my sources say'. So the fans influence what is being observed. And that feedback loop keeps looping. For example "Pert unilaterally shopped clarry". True or false? Who knows. But a monger suggests it is true, fans accept it and amplify it all over the place. It soon becomes accepted as fact, when there is zero hard evidence it happened (which doesn't mean it didn't of course). Conjecture has matatisised into fact. Perception is reality. "Oliver hurt he was shopped and wants out" True or false? Who knows. But lets say its true - logic suggests all the white noise would have played a part in clarry wanting out. The observers have influenced what is being observed. And we end up with a story that feels much bigger than in reality it actually is. I mean the proof is in the pudding - the bloke is staying.

Was thinking something very similar. I wondered if claz needed another rocket, perhaps after some backsliding (eg brownlow night carry on), similar to the threats to trade him last year, but needed a new bad cop.

I read an interesting article about how the so called Heisenberg observer effect impacts the efficacy of polling: "[E]very attempt to study how people think and act has the potential to influence how they think and act, thus changing what is being recorded, either in self-fulfilling or self-negating ways. The results of any poll on a particular issue are liable to change how people think about that issue, just as any poll showing a candidate’s popularity is liable to influence that candidate’s popularity." I reckon the same effect is at work with the feedback loop between the gossip churned out by McClure, Morris, Barrett, Cornes (collective noun - mongers) etc etc and supporters. The media's current narrative about Oliver wanting out (and before that tracc and koz) is the perfect example of what I mean: As most acknowledge, the mongers goal is to create a story that generates engagement (as measured by clicks, opens, retweets, ratings etc etc) - ideally a story that has a long shelf life so they can wring every last click out of it. That's the starting point The mongers know what will drive engagement, ie what the punters want - angst, division, rumour, conflict, gossip, crisis, confirmation of biases etc etc. And craft the initial story, and subsequent stories, accordingly. Football fans consume the stories, most uncritically and accept supposition as fact ('where there's smoke!!!!!'). Football forums, social media, comment sections, group text groups and sports radio is flooded with fans parroting amd amplifying the monger's narrative. The monger's editors know they're on a winner and tell the mongers to keep producing content about Oliver, particularly given the paucity of real news in the trade period. And the cycle continues. After a relatively short period it is accepted fact that Pert shopped Oliver, that claz desperately wanted to get to the cats and, absurdly, there was actually a reasonable chance claz got to the cats (I mean, for all manner of reasons, the chances were vanishingly small of oliver leaving given how late in the year this played out - ditto tracc) But suprise, suprise, the breathless group think proves to be nonsense- claz is staying. Yet the mongers know there's still plenty of juice left in the lemon. In fact, there's at least another 12 months worth of self reinforcing feedback loops and where there's smoke click bait content to be had A feedback loop where even a story about clarry saying he is keen to get going, looking forward to next year, pumping up tracc, pumping up our chances etc etc is interpreted by some as supporting the monger's narrative ('what else is he going to say?' 'Read between the lines' blah blah blah). The beauty of the monger's approach is that even in the face of contradictory evidence (eg clarry is staying) their narrative remains unchanged, unchallenged and uncriticised - even by many dees fans. Like doomsday day cults always extending the date the world is going to end, the narrative now seamlessly shifts to claz leaving at the end of the 2025 season (ditto tracc and koz). The other genius thing about the monger's method is many people who bought into the claz is gone narrative will, despite it having just been proven wrong, continue to parrot and amplify the monger's messaging. A great irony is some of will accuse those who dont buy into the monger's narrative of being naive pollyannas who, unlike them, are not realists or critical thinkers.

Goldy is pure G&D. Live the way she plays - her attack on the ball is relentless. Was a big factor in the win.

Sorry, can't agree. Which is a pretty sad indictment on McClure!

Leaving aside the petty sledge by an AFL employee (i mean an afl employee calling a club a mess? really?), the reality is once we got pick 5 we weren't going after Houston. And nor should we. Pick 5 is gold. On his Houston sledge, it is a classic example of the eye watering lack of self awareness by the media. Media endelessly bangs on about tracc, oliver, koz and issues at the club. All stay. Petracca apparently 'desperate' to leave - but no so desperate that he ensured it was not possible by not being open to being traded to a club with top 5 draft picks to offer as part of a trade Player says Oh, my decision to come to the dees influenced by all the noise about the club. Where there's smoke. Media - we're just reporting the facts. We're neutral. What a joke.

You worked in an ice cream shop as a kid?

Interesting idea. If it pans out that way, would perhaps explain langers spending a big chunk of the second half of the season at HFF given they would have known nibbla was leaving.

Not gospel, but only because his info is by definition second hand. But totes agree on twomey is on of the better AFL jounos - in large part because of his expertise and deep knowledge about the draft environment. Knowledge he has been developing and building for many years. Like a proper journalist. Take note third rate gossip mongers like Morris et al.

Yep. Some absolutely trash posting. Playing the person not the ball. And of course it's all the usual suspects. Makes the site bordering unreadable. Embarrassing really as I presume such posts are from adults.

Strong men, with tears in their eyes.....

Much Ado About Nothing

Go hard or go home.

That's his been crying for his mummy for hours face. Cheer up H, to badly paraphrase Neil Diamond, you'll be a demon soon.

Was clarry there?

https://au.sports.yahoo.com/harley-reids-sad-admission-about-emotional-toll-of-maiden-afl-season-as-west-coast-contract-decision-looms-043257166.html

Hello, Sam McMorris Barrett here, head AFL writer for yahoo sports From my article today: 'It is expected that Harley Reid will stay at West Coast in the immediate future. However, earlier this year Reid admitted his 19th birthday was the worst he's ever had due to him being away from his family in Victoria'. Sources tell me Reid wants out of the Eagles and wants to come home to mummy. My sources suggest that in an ironic twist, the Dees, who lost the Unicorn to the the world's most boring city and his mummy, is Harley's preferred destination.

Pro tip cranky - stick to the unintentional comedy.

Cranky doesn't do irony. Eg, "i won't even mention this year's debacles against West Coast & Freo" Do they think they're writing in invisible pixels? I won't even mention how hilarious i find their posts. Pure comedy gold.

Whilst I agree our comms around tracc and claz has been poor, the length of the two threads has very little to do with the clubs comms and management. The threads might be partly ABOUT those issues, but their length is predominantly a result of posters allowing themselves to dance to the tune of the media. And I don't blame the media in that dynamic. Click bait is demand driven. What ever happened to just waiting to see how things play out, and as much information as is feasible is in the public domain, before making assessments, let alone over the top, hair on fire, where there's smoke henny penny the sky is falling declarations. I wish people would just chill a bit. Like I said about the tracc scenario better to deal with agreed facts than rumours, second hand information and the click bait peanuts like Morris want us to swallow and amplify. And some key agreed facts include: - mutiple players, including young guns and senior leaders, have extended their contracts in the last few months - barring an October surprise, tracc, koz and clarry are playing for the dees in 2025 - unlike several other clubs, only ONE key best 22 player, nibbla, is leaving, and for genuine family reasons at that (unlike say noble leaving the pies, Kennedy wanting out of the blues, the battle drama at the dsaints, pearling leaving gws and Houston leaving port) - Wade Derkson has nominated us as his preferred destination These facts don't mean there aren't issues that need resolution, or there aren't improvements that need to be made. But amplifying the media's club in crisis narrative, or taking the opportunity to pot (insert favorite scapegoat here) is part of the problem not part of the solution. And only hurts the club - a club we all love or else we wouldn't spend so much energy discussing it here.