Nasher

The 'counterfactual' is not Melbourne still having Howe, so how Howe went at Collingwood is irrelevant. He was gone regardless.

I don't care about Casey either per se, but I do care about the players who have busted their arses all year, several of whom have given a lot to the MFC over the years. They deserve this reward for effort and I really hope they get it. If you have little or no vested interest in this game, I'm not sure why you're in this thread raining on everyone else's parade.

Isn't it stating the obvious to say the players who have been in the VFL all year might not be AFL grade? It's our 23rd-44th ranked players playing in this game. I'm not sure what people are expecting.

Brayshaw, Petracca, Salem etc? Most of our young talent is already in the seniors. I suppose you mean in the context of those playing in this game, although I didn't read it that way.

Not much to get excited about for the future? Righto then.

It had to be unequal unless the AFL wanted to create a team that was uncompetitive for a decade. Even with the concessions, they wouldn't be where they are without being well-run, though, and that's what everyone is envious about.

Don't think those GWS boys were thinking "oh well, we're just a franchise". Brisbane, Adelaide and West Coast were all clubs created out of thin air in the same way GWS and GCS were, but I don't see anyone wailing about the success they've had. The vitriol towards GWS is based on nothing but envy and I reckon it's childish.

Sorted. Dogs by 6.

Shit yes. Tension is killing me. No matter who wins, it'd be hard to argue that they didn't deserve to be there. Cracking.

Wow, this game is red hot. CARN THE DOGS

Great to see Zak Jones play himself in to a Grand Final. Excellent game.

Taping him up and trying to get him back on apparently.

Far out, game over already. I really feel for Geelong. BWAHAHAHAHA. Gosh, I can't say it with a straight face.

Summed up my feelings on the matter as well. I won't refer to them as "drug cheats" - I don't think their intention was to cheat. I think they cocked up majorly and attempted to cover their arses by lying, so the penalty was in the vicinity of fair, but I don't think their initial intent, when participating in the supplements program, was malicious. Others will disagree, but I'm not going to debate it any further. I'll leave that for those who are passionate on the subject.

He was joking.

There are six VFL seniors regulars on that extended bench - four Casey listed and two MFC listed. Two players are going to be super unlucky.

How old was Vince when we got him (for pick 20)? The Bummers, like us with Vince, will be wanting a few players who increase their competitiveness immediately. I wouldn't dismiss the trade purely because of his age.

If there's anything particularly off or inappropriate, make sure to report it please. Can't speak for other moderators, but I generally don't read this thread.

I am assuming this is some obscure attempt at humour that has gone way over my head.

Yep - no dispute there. It's only the degree of "more confidence" that I'm arguing. I love arguing grey positions :-) I would love to see Wiz Jr running around in MFC colours (assuming his son is the same sort of player!) Probably my favourite player through my teenage years.

Fair enough. I wouldn't base a life decision such as moving thousands of kilometres away to somewhere where I didn't know anyone, when I could do the same job without moving 100 metres, based on the footy team my father barracked for. But I accept others might. I shall agree to disagree.

It's why I went for "barely relevent" instead of "totally irrelevant". The kid has grown up in WA, I think his desire to stay home (or otherwise) will vastly outweigh any other factor, including pressing from his father. I'm just not sure that most 18 year olds, given the option, would move to the other side of the country when given they don't have to. Don't get me wrong - I'm happy for the Wiz to push him in our direction, but I think people are overvaluing the weight of that pushing. He's his own person who will make his own decision.

Whichever club his son chooses (on the assumption he is up to the grade), it won't be up to the Wiz, so his opinion is barely relevant.

The old "I don't really get it, so I'll make up a high salary and attribute it to that" trick.

I'd be really disappointed if the club lobbied not to play a big game, most probably at our home ground, because we were afraid of losing. Bring on the Bummers I reckon.