sylvinator

My BEST 22 + entire squad! Garland Frawley ??? Cross McDonald Grimes Trengove Jones Watts Howe Dawes Toumpas ??? Clark Hogan Jamar Vince Viney Int: Tyson, Michie, Gawn, Fitzpatrick Players who need to lift to claim the flanker positions: Salem, Blease, Strauss, Evans, Tapscott, Kent, Clisby, Riley, Barry, Hunt, Kennedy-Harris Depth: Dunn, Byrnes, Spenser, Pederson, McKenzie, Matt Jones, Bail, Terlich, Nicholson Rookies: Harmes, King, Georgiou, Jetta

Gumbleton would make a lot of sense. He would not be expensive and wouldn't have to give much for him. He'd be a great 2nd tall target we DESPERATELY need, because he's super tall (198cm) and his strength is overhead marking. As a 2nd big tall he would compliment Clark. It would also allow Fitzpatrick to develop at a steady pace, because if he's expected to dominate from round 1 2013 it's not going to happen. We need to throw the big money at a midfielder. Wellingham the obvious choice for me. Young, tough, skillful, has played in a successful environment. Would make an immediate impact. If cloke signs he is not going to be given a big contract, so offer him $600k, we have no one else to pay, so why not!

Agreed. Watts is an average player struggling to maintain a spot in the worst team in the afl. NicNat is a star and has HUGE influence on a finals team, probably will be all australian this year. If anyone wants proof why stats are meaningless with NicNat, look at the video on afl.com.au "Cox chalks up 250". His 13 possessions and 20 taps can have a huge influence on games. The scary thing is that he's shown this year that he is capable of getting 25 possessions and 35 taps, where he's the BOG by a mile. Our recruiting is the reason we are in the hole we're in. Tell me we wouldn't be in a totally different situation if we had done the following (all realistic choices at the time): NicNat > Watts Darling > Cook Lewis Jetta/Dangerfield/Rioli > Morton

Look, if Travis Cloke is in the picture, we should really be going for him. We need a 2nd big forward desperately, he's one of the best in the game, pay him $1.2 million a season, we have no other players than deserve to be on serious money, so why not! Carlton are obviously front runners, but we have the money to pay him and we have the picks to satisfy Collingwood. We're a chance in the same way we were a chance for Mitch Clark. - Trade Pick 4 + Petterd or Gysberts for Cloke. - Use pick 3 and 13 on the best midfielders available. - Pick 23 is Viney. - Try to get Pearce and Byrnes as free agents, we are crying out for some goal-kicking ability and outside run. Suddenly we SLOWLY start to take shape to a team that can compete properly at AFL level. McDonald Frawley Strauss Grimes Rivers Garland Trengove Sylvia Pearce Howe Cloke Watts Blease Clark Byrnes Jamar Jones Viney Interchange: McKenzie, Tapscott, Pick 3, pick 13. Maybe Taggert and Fitzpatrick can show something. If we don't bring in 2-3 quality senior players who can play from the get-go we are going to struggle to win a game next season. our supporter base can't take much more of this

I think we should have traded Petterd years ago. Definitely trade him this year. He will have trade value. Definitely second round pick, maybe end of first round. Teams going for finals will see him as a player who could slot right in and kick 40 goals (ala Josh Hill style role). Fact is, Petterd is not a great player. He is a terrible kick and most importantly he's lazy as hell. He has talent and it will probably serve another team very well.

I agree that we've drafted VERY poorly, but it would be totally ignorant to think development doesn't play a pivotal role. If anyone doesn't think that Gysberts wouldn't be better developed at Geelong or Adelaide they are kidding themselves. Look at the Geelong kids. Do you honestly think every pick just happens to appear amazing. No, there are two big factors at play. 1. It is far easier for a skinny kid to play well and develop strongly when he has 12 champion big-bodied senior players protecting him, so that he plays a small role in the team and has good role models. 2. These clubs develop their players better than we do. That's why we haven't developed one champion in the last 40 years (except maybe Flower who I never saw play). It's why Scott Thompson becomes a star at Adelaide and why Sylvia becomes only a very good player, just like a long line of players that should have been champions- Yze, White, Woewoden, Green, Bruce etc.

The only players we need to pay decent wage to is Grimes and Sylvia. Everyone else would be your basic average AFL wage

Guys have you actually looked at our list recently. Moloney gone. Davy wouldn't be on big money anymore. We literally have no one to pay. If we don't land a big fish this trade period, guys like Garland will be paid $800k just to pay somebody to get to 92%

Reasons to be optimistic: 1. The late season form of Grimes and Trengove. In 3 years time they'll be experienced leaders and players, will be great dual captains. 2. The emergence of Watts, Blease, Howe and McDonald as 4 guys with the skills to be long-term above average great players 3. The form of Jones and Clark (until injured) showing that they are both great players, genuinely up there with the top players at other clubs Future reason to optimistic... sylvinator's post-season moves: - Trade pick 12 (Compo) and Gysberts for Cloke and 3rd rounder - Trade pick 4 to GWS for Jesse Hogan -17-year old 194cm strong pack-busting forward, big talent. Even the best KPPs usually take 3 years to develop anyway, so getting him as a 17 year old, in an elite program, playing VFL will help his development. - Manage to bluff GWS into letting Viney through to the second round. Will GWS risk losing Whitfield to Gold Coast or Melbourne by bidding on Viney, i don't think so! - Use pick 3 for Jimmy Toumpas. South Australian GUN midfielder we are looking for. Outcome- In: Cloke (195cm beast CHF), Hogan (17 year old elite talent, 194cm strong KPP), Toumpas (elite midfield talent), Viney (leadership personified!) Team for 2013/2014: McDonald , Frawley , Strauss Watts , Rivers , Garland Trengove , Jones , Grimes Howe , Cloke , Sylvia Jurrah , Clark , Blease Jamar , McKenzie , Viney Int: Toumpas, Hogan, Taggert, Nicholson, Morton, Moloney, Martin, Gawn Tell me that team doesn't make finals!!!

Unfortunately, as much as it pains me to say, Watts over Naitanui was a HOWLER. I've been watching Naitanui a lot recently, he's a genuine star. His ruck work is something to behold and the way he can take games by the scruff of the neck, it unbelievable. I've never seen anything like the things he does. And he actually does it consistently. His development at only 22 of whatever is crazy. Watts may become a very good player. he may become average. the jury is still out. But even at the time, most clubs would have taken Naitanui. We went for needs (KPF) and you NEVER should do that with a number 1 pick (even though I know Watts was considered a top 3 prospect, Naitanui was a clear number 1). And now it looks like Watts isn't even a KPF... depressing

Look at their heights! 86kg is a decent size for 187cm. Weight is always relative to height. To not get knocked off the ball , and in order to impose on the contest, you need to be a solid build for your height. I'm sure if Coleman was 196cm, he wouldn't be 86kg, he'd be more like 95kg

The guy clearly has good kicking skills, can take a mark and kick a goal. He's great height for KPF. He also seems to read the play particularly well, which gives him time and space to kick well and find the best target. Plus we're in desperate need for a 2nd tall to compliment Mitch Clark. So really he has everything going for him, he just needs to grasp the opportunity. Last year his development was stifled a little by Fevola, but this year he has made improvements due to being able to play large parts of the season as the primary tall target or at least 2nd tall target. Unfortunately, KPPs take time. If he's serious about becoming a good AFL player, he'd want to get to 95kg asap (within 1-2 years if possible), with the aim of getting to 100+kg by the time he's 23 and in his prime. He cannot compete at AFL level at 88kg...

Has anyone else noticed that the last few weeks, Misson on melbournefc.com.au speaks through every injury on our list, but for last few weeks the only player not spoken about is Jurrah. Have to think there's something wrong there. have a feeling they're keeping him out until court case is over

I thought Gysberts and Martin showed AFL quality today. Gysberts in particular could add something to the midfield rotation. Youngsters in Davis, Sheahan, Cook, Tynan, Williams all pretty far off AFL level. Spencer was beaten in the ruck, especially in the around-the-groun throw-ins. i'd be seriously scared if we had to rely on him at AFL level. Petterd and Bennell showed glimpses of class, but it just hasn't clicked with those 2. May not have a future at the club if they don't lift to another level.

Very true. The only hope is that next year and beyond we can add: Viney, Gysberts, Pick 4 PP and pick 12 PP to the rotation. 4 added pure midfielders could make a huge difference

What we really need to do is bloody hell NAIL pick 4 and pick 12 and get the best 2 midfielders available! how bloody hard is it to nail such high picks, it beggers belief that we have stuffed so many first rounders

No one in their right mind would trade pick 1 for pick 4 and 13. Past pick 4s have included Morton, Fiora, Ray. Past pick 13s have included Matthew Bate, Tom Lynch (x-Stkilda), Mitch Brown (geelong nothing player). Pick 1 is a lock great player (or should be at least). Scully will be a star. 100%. We'll have to get really lucky with pick 4 and pick 13. Let's hope we do. but people are kidding themselves if they think we did better off. There is a reason we declined pick 5 and pick 9 for pick 2 that year.

Can people please get real for a second. Morton shouldn't be dropped because of one turnover. He's a confidence player. He needs to play some consistent footy. He played some good footy today minus turnovers. Couch will NOT be put into the team unless one of Moloney, Magner or McKenzie are dropped. We can't have too many averaged-paced inside mids. Magner possibility to be dropped/rested. Cook will NOT be put into the team until he has the requisite fitness to play out a full game. At the moment, he's young and coming off injuries so clearly only can play a half at full tilt. Until that fitness comes, let him develop nicely at Casey's number one target at full forward! Davey, Bail and Bartram are strong and only chances to return after the bye I would have thought.

Morton was far from our worst today. he needs to clean up the turnovers and he'll be a good player. a lot of talent is obvious

Not our worst player today. There's definitely potential there. just needs to clean up the turnovers and he'll be a good player.

Mids are easier to attract from other clubs and are MUCH quicker to develop. If we got Cloke, we'd have our talls SET and locked away for the next 10 years. Tall forwards: Cloke & Clarke as the main 2 targets. Cook developing. Jamar/Martin/Gawn as tall targets when we need to stretch the defence. Tall Defenders: Frawley, Garland and Rivers. Tom McDonald, Davis and Sheehan developing. This gives the likes of Watts the flexibility to develop into a utility- forward, midfield and defence. No more pressure on Watts needing to become a bulky pack-busting KPF, when we all know he isn't that naturally and that role doesn't play to his strengths. Once we've got the talls in order, we can focus on midfielders, which is easier because midfielders develop much quicker rate. People need to remember we've still got Gysberts, Taggert and Viney to come in to the current midfield rotation. And Trengove and Blease clearly have a lot of upside and haven't even come close to reaching their potential.

But i thought everybody thought he was useless because he isn't dominating AFL as a 19 year old 196cm KP forward?

All the Watts critics can go eat a turd! http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/137779/default.aspx Jack's coming on just as expected. still only 21 years old and almost 50 games. Just wait till he's 24 years old, 196cm, 100kg, with his pace and agility and skill. Will be unstoppable!

I'd be throwing $1m+ at Cloke. We can afford it at this point in time. Clarke was paid more than $1m this year and will be ony $500k the rest of his contract. We could do something similar with Cloke. Would net us immediate results. Would set up our forward line for the next decade. We have the picks to satisfy Collingwood. Pick 4 (Compo) and pick 12 (compo) should get the job done! Well worth it, he's the best contested marking player in the AFL, he's perfect age, in his prime, could average 60+ goals a year for next 8 years

Second in charge at Collingwood would be a great get surely. Been at a great system, especially good at talent identification. Need good people involved for this year. Maybe look at Rendell. The way he's put together the Adelaide list is unbelievable, considering he hasn't had even 1 top 10 draft deal with. And his high pick he nailed in Dangerfield, when all the know-it-all armchair recruiters said he should've picked Ebert