Rhino Richards

Jones, Bate and Sylvia all play based on their form. They are each easily good enough to justify their position on their own terms. I dont believe any of the three are challenging for each others spot.

Byron is still some way away folks. http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/com...5E19742,00.html

Given the game is littered these days with cheap meaningless disposals I cant see anything meaningful drawing conclusions about the reasons for the outcome of a game by looking at total disposals. I am at a further loss why you keep on about it as it establishes nothing and your attempts to draw some semblance of a insightful conclusion is naive and perilous at best. We did not use the ball effectively for reasons I gave and it does not imply your case that the forward line was issue. Start looking at stats that actually give you some insight into the game. Total disposals per game aint it. F50s 53 to 33. Scoring shots......The end result flattered us. We should have been beaten by 10 goals if they kicked straight. The game was played on their terms after the first 15 minutes not ours. Its got little to do with forward line as it has where the game was mainly played in the midfield and on our half back line. I' ll leave it at that. Geez I tried to make some headway with you but honestly you really struggle it. Thats not a false accusation. Its a my valid observation and seemingly that of others too. Good luck with whatever it is you think is happening out there .

There is nothing anymore complicated about Run and Carry than other strategies. With players of the ability we are talking about it is a matter of comfort,composure and confidence. The same as it is for any strategy.

If Miller can play elsewhere I wish they would play him there. He is lost at CHF. Its telling that he got 3 B'low votes at FB. Its the only place IMO where he has a chance of an AFL career. I thought he was a little harsh on Neitz. I reckon he is spot on about Robbo. His lack of ball winning ability at ground level and his limited mobilty means he has to create opportunities in the F50 through marking and he must make every post a winner. He cant do this and like the end of last year his spot was in jeopardy.

I would not underestimate Matthew Clarke. IMO he is far better pick up than the flaky and injured Gardiner. I was really disappointed with White's work around the ground and this failed to make up for his poor performance in the centre. A couple of things........ 1. Run and Carry is not the "handball" game. What we executed was not R & C but gameplan borne of the reasons I stated above. 2. Modern footballers these days a readily adept at both hand and foot skills especially midfielders who would have such skills at the higher end in either foot and/or hand skills. While many may favour one over the other, all should be competent to execute such skills under game pressure. Christ that is what they train and do 11 months of the year. I disagree with your separation of players based on those who "kick" and those that "handball" due to strength. Players like West and Black are handballing because they are inside players in contested traffic who win the hard ball and dish off by handball to teammates in close proximity. They dont have the luxury of being a freeloader like Yze that gets soft possessions on the receive and gets more kicks playing outside. BTW, Miller handballs because he's a flaky kick and when he does get the ball (6 to 8 times a game) he is usually running from goal and it may (may not) be the best option to move the ball. I would not label it a strength. 3. If a team is going to seriously challenge for top 4 and hopefully a flag it is expected that they can be a variety of oppositions, on a variety of surfaces in a vareity of conditions. What works some weeks with some sides does not work with others. Over the past two to three years, MFC have been blown away in Adeliade and WA where the grounds are long and narrow. If we are going to be successful at the highest level, we must be able to win at these grounds. Over the years when we played a visually aesthetic style of corridor football it was successful for a short period until oppositions began to develop other tactics to combat this (eg flooding). When it did not work the "know - alls" on the site cried "Daniher has no plan B". We successfully introduced tempo football into our game plan to break the flood and ensure more judicious entry in the F50 than just bombing it long to a contested situation. Remember that tempo football also took a couple of weeks to get right and provide us with worthy tactical support. The success of Run and Carry is squarely on Daniher. His future clearly rests on it. But I am not going to throw the baby out with the bath water after one week. The same as last year. But he and his cohorts have a lot of work. 4. Let me see MFC have Rivers, McLean, Bruce, Green, Neitz, Robinson, McDonald, Whelan, White, Bate, Jones, Sylvia, Pickett, Moloney for starters and you dont believe they are capable of executing a game plan? On that basis, we dont have the calibre of player to compete at the highest level and it is pipedream to think we are a flag opporunity in the next couple of years. What were we all thinking?? I think you are going off the trail. I think there is definitely time to address these issues. Do the sums on the age profile and experience of MFC? They are entering the stage that if they are good enough they should be seriously challenging for the flag. Not everyone is Matthew Bate's age!

Bravo. Bollocks. If you not getting the ball......you're not getting it......you're not getting possession of it.....the opposition are getting it...{I let you fill in the blanks). We controlled less of the ball than St Kilda and when we did have it we squandered it with poor implementation of the plan (note: Coaches responsibility), lack of leadership (Bruce, Green and White), lack of preparedness to run make space, tackle shepherd. Inability to execute basic foot skills across the ground. Opposition pressure of players. Lack of willingness of MFC players to make a contest and do the harder things left too many players unprotected and one out. Lack of confidence in what they were doing. Inability to create effective movement of the ball from defence to the back line Team possessed a couple of armchair passengers who cheated their teammates by not running and doing the 1%s. Losing ruck gave St Kilda first clean use of the ball.

Let me see he turned 19 in December and has played 15 AFL games. He is athletic 192 cm /90kgs. Rising Star nominee in Rd 18 last year. He is young and down on confidence and shots are being fired. Nasher is right- What a crock. If MFC is going to make the big step he is definitely part of our best 22. We need him and other firing. Criticism of him is churlish at best given some of the handbag performances by more estabished players. Point the gun at them not Bate.

Excluding the obvious its hard to pick them. You are right about the focus on the midfield. It gets missed by some

Good call Fan.

Settle down DD. I blame the education system not the person. I agree that Miller may be our best short term option but he is struggling and has for some time. Who are the people who dont want him to succeed?

Hang on guys. He is just returning from a fair lay off from OP. A couple of weeks ago he would be ready for Round 4. What's changed to rush him ahead of schedule at risk to his fitness? I dont see him as a replacement for Brock. If he fit he would be replacing Yze immediately up forward.

They were meant to be serious observations about your style. I note you dont want to address the issue of what happens before they get the ball. Just bursts the balloon and does not help a misguided cause. Ca la vie!

That's exactly how I feel when I or others try and discuss basic football concepts with you. You havent got a clue. It would be amusing if you were taking the p!$$. But you are seriously miss the wood for the trees. The cart is miles ahead often no where near the horse I glad you enjoy going to the football. Heavens knows how much more you would get out of it if you actually understood what was happening. For starters, rather than focussing on what happens before they kick the ball, focus on what is happening on who gets the ball first (a little clue: after the first 15 minutes it wasn't us) and why the opposition got it more than us what they did with it and what they were doing when they did not have it and we did. Amazing how you can continually condemn football strategies and yet repeatedly fail to grasp basic concepts.

Our midfield got massacred because the Saints got more possessions than us and did more with the ball when they had it. After the first 15 minutes, we were beaten at the contests and beaten at the centre bounces. When the Saints did not have the ball they pressured our players relentlessly denying us freedom to utilise the ball efectively. Put simply they got the ball more than us. They used the ball better than we did. When they did not have it they pressured our players consistently. MFC did not help itself with its sloppy execution by hand and foot leading to repeated turnovers and its faliure to exert any pressure on the St Kilda players when they had the ball. Your inside 50s come primarily from your midfield or HBL breaking opposition lines not from an apparent lack of a half forward line.

I think there is every justification to test out Franklin's mettle. As a footballer his very silky and talented on the downhill stuff. He needs to physically challenged in the contest. Loads of ability but not convinced on his toughness of character and strength of application.

The Age have McLean at 2 to 4 weeks subject to CAT scan. Its potentially a better outcome than what was feared. But horrible to have him out none the less.

Exactly. Priceless

I've already addressed my views on the game plan on this site. Go read them. Its like talking to a parrot that continually asks the same question.

I am glad the Kangas can justifiable rant and rave that the Umpire lost them the game. Gutless and spineless. What a joke.

1. I have already said the coaches have lot to do in the next nine days after that effort. You do miss alot 2. I have no problem with have space for two key forwards where the players do execute the plan properly. They did not and when they did have the ball the disposal was often appalling. But the game was lost before the ball crossed our forward 50. 3. The main issue we got beaten was we were flogged (especially in the midfield) by a more disciplined team that were more prepared to contest, commit to their plan and work hard.

It should have been a redundant issue for the following reasons: 1. A 200 game premiership former AA player should never miss a shot from 15 metres. Never 2. How can a team that controlled the game kick 19 behinds and half as many goals? I would say the same thing about MFC. Collingwood should never, repeat never have got a sniff of a win. Back Neitz $100 to kick from 15 metres every time. Nothing like blaming the umpire for an error in the final seconds of the game when you have proceeded to stuff up the match over the previous four quarters.

THere is no evidence that we would have kicked anymore goals nor is there a linear association with the number of players you have up forward. Many of those inside 50s were plain horrible and with perfoming deadwood like Yze, Miller, Davey its unlikely they would have turned it around. Entries in the forward 50 are a function of possession and disposals by the midfield and to an extent the HBF. Given the triteness and sheer wastefulness of many of the MFC possesions especially the overuse of handball. I cant think of more meaningless statistic. A more meaningful statistic to start with is the score after we were 3.2 to 0.2 St Kilda 13.13 to MFC 6.7. 26 scoring shots plus a couple on the full to 13 scoring shots (some of those in junk time). DD is right. We got slaughtered in the midfield and that together with poor execution of the game plan (not coaches responsbility even more than the players), some truly [censored] poor performance from some senior players and excruciating disposal. If St Kilda had kicked straight we could have been beaten by 10 goals. And the main reason.......the forward line....Its beggars belief Bravo.

Are you sure? No. I will repeat what I said before. "My biggest concern was the failure of the players to implement the game plan with any confidence or skill. The coaching panel have a lot to do over the next 9 days." The lack of skill and confidence of the players falls in the lap of the coaches. The ball is in the coaches corner to turn it around. Well and truly. However to exonerate the poor performance of the players is naive and misleading.

Cut it out Bub. Shannon Grant a 200 game premiership footballer. Stands 15 metres out. Hardly an angle and hits the post and he is not to blame....Hmmmm. The Kangas robbed themselves by kicking another 18 behinds earlier in the game. They had the Pies on toast and let them off on the scoreboard. Grant just epitomised the Kangas on the day. Wasteful.