Rhino Richards

In fact that is what you have been doing. You put a set of statistics here showing ND's win loss record against each side up to a set point in time. You ascerted that your statistics suggest a "trend" that "suggests there is a failure to learn and/or to change." I questioned how you could arrive at that and you head off in another direction that the other teams have won a premiership. In addition you slag off about not playing the kids on other sites when evidence has been put to you to the contrary Then when challeged say "Are you happy with the current situation?" as some misguided invitation for you to continually launch into a hyperbolic rant often about issues you reflect little knowledge off. You have been a consistent and perpetual whinger on this site about MFC and its officers You allege your MFC support then makes criticisms about the Club that have little or on foundation. And before you take the tack "Oh I should say everything is perfect..lol", constructive and factual criticism is valid. Some of the withc burning that you and others have carried on with isnt. I am clearly not happy about MFC situation. No one is. But I dont stoop so low as to use a public forum to carte blanche berate and abuse public figures. This year has been disappointing. Equally disapppointing is the woe merchants on this site that for self serving reasons feel a need to proclaim all is lost.. its a disaster. Its pathetic and does little to focus on the some of problems that clubs MFC have.

Who was to say other clubs would want an OP stricken unproven player? Was MFC putting him on the table? Weakens our midfield rotation which is already painfully dependent on McLean and Jones. What would Collingwood want Pick 8 plus Medhurst or pick 46 and Sylvia? No deal. Collingwood would get screwed over it. See its alot harder than you think. And each deal involves some cost to get the benefit.

So how does winning cups at points in the 10 year cycle determine them as power teams and therefore your conclusion about Melbourne? Sorry about the facts just wrecks a bloated opinion every time.

Power teams have changed over the course of 10 years. Essendon, Port Adelaide, Adelaide, WCE and Brisbane have all won flags during ND's reign and all have had down periods and years. There has been no truly consistent "power" sides. And during that time MFC have risen and fallen so relative to who they play and when determines whether the win or loss could have been expected or was a turn up. A % drawn over that period of time alone does not give you any insight in the weakness of MFC against power teams When I asked you what of any substance it tells you, I receive a whole lot of hyperbole back which further confuses and diminishes your point. Try actually substanting your opinion with facts that support it. Its not that hard.

No. Things are not good but that does not justify making unsubstantiated and uninformed comments. By the following was a statement not a question.....its a fact not opinion. "he is reluctant to play the kids !!! he has only ever done so by circumstances of adversity...he is unlike Malthouse or Sheedy or Mathews who make this a feather in their repsective bows. He doesnt do it when he can balance it better , he is simplisticly REACTIVE...has no understanding of being PROACTIVE.... ". Pasky Facts,...heh?

I have addressed the question in respone to run and carry. If you really want another answer go to training and actually learn what goes on rather than making assessments that reflect that you have not and you dont understand. I am not surprised you dont see the irony. Its like a lot of things that are missed.

Its such a stupid and ill thought question from a person that has not shown anything more than ignorant cynicism and a penchant for pushing a series of uninformed agendas which lack any basic modicum of football nous or knowledge. I have addressed the issues of run and carry ad nauseam on this site as have others. You have not shown even an inkling of understanding what's going on beyond the narrow and contracting confines of your view of football. And the irony of it all is that you have bagged the conservative thinkers within the FD. Unbelievable.

That's garbage Bub. Have a look at this thread and post 27. Another case of venting an ill iinformed opinion without the facts.

Bub, I dont think the results against the individual teams tells you anything of note whatsover. Over the 10 years, teams have ebbed and flowed like MFC has. And a win against the Roos in 1999 may be more meritorious than one in 2006. But what does it tell you of any substance? Very little. Further you have taken a measure at one point in time and tried imply a trend that is not there. Great for pushing your opinion but as usual without any facts to back them up.

Thanks for your analysis. We should sign him up on another contract.

But it was not exactly a bad game then!

Sorry, both Ferg and Bizzell have been tried often and have come up short. Bizzell was a member of the leadership group fro many years and especially was given plenty, plenty of opportunity during 2005 when he put together a strong of shockers. We limped into the 2005 finals minus Neitz and a number of players and Bizzell could not even scratch the form at Sandy to get up. We know what we can get from them and its not good enough. FWIW, White and Yze have played far better football than Bizz and Ferg over the past three years and they dont compete for positions with Bizz and Ferg. Holland last year showed what Ferg could not do...play body on body defence. Brown and Godfrey again dont compete with Ferg and Bizzell for positions. Ward got a break last year and made the best fist of it. He's in the same basket as Bizz. Wheatley has been injury riddled. At this point in time what many of them do have in common with Ferg and Bizz is they are not good enough. Whether ND survives as Coach is a moot point. If he does succeed it will be by getting the skilled players who have been injured and out not by recycling player who had continual and proven faults that leave them short as AFL players.

Clever trading should involve a net benefit to your list. Great you go into the market for a second round pick (For Melbourne that would be pick 30) for either Tarrant or Polak. Polak went to Richmond for pick# 8. Tarrant went to Freo for pick# 8 plus Medhurst. So who is your bunny, BBP? Hardly a clever trade offer to be taken seriously. Now to get Tarrant or Polak, our best pick was pick 12 Frawley. They may not be enough. So who would you trade off from MFC to get pick # 8 on our list and who would realistically pay for it? I think your comments lack a bit of analysis of the reality of the situation.

Thanks I suspected so.

How often do you see them train?

Gouga what do you expect to see from Bizz and Ferg that they have not shown in the past 5 years? Neither are up to it. And its not appropriate to just to judge it on one game against Freo. Even if the supporters arent too sure of where they stand, the FD certainly have a close review of them. They are fringe players who are neither here nor there in the critical issues we need to address. One of them will be gone at year end and the other a strong possibility to be likewise.

I take it your in the trade for trade sake camp. Akermanis has been injured. Tarrant has done little. Everitt has been ordinary. Polak still has the jury out. Getting in Richmond's best is hardly vindication of much. So tell me would you have been happy to trade Frawley and Petterd for any of them? And what would they have provided us this year? You know what, we were ruthless.... in not trading for other people's damaged goods. Overall, trading is overrated because no side will readily trades their youth, their future for flawed footballers. Its amazing how so many people list underperforming MFC players for a trade when no Club could be that stupid to contemplate it.

Great post Maurie and hits a few issues right on the head. I am not so sure Warnock is up to it.

Its not necessarily the game plan but the manner in which it is implemented. And some of those implementation issues (eg skills and commitment of players) is showing through.

Good points Redleg and Fan. I think your analysis Fan is spot on and I have yet to see any analysis from the "ND does not play the kids" faction. I guess if one person states a misguided opinion often enough it get adopted as fact by those that dont care to do the analysis.

BB, I think your question is a perceptive one. There is alot of talk of gameplan on this site and much of it has been misguided. In round 1, we implemented our game plan poorly and together will poor skills got blown away. Yeah I know Brock got injured that day but what interested me was the period up to Brocks injury especially from 10 minutes into the first quarter. However as the injuries have set in particularly in the midfield, MFC have been smashed in the centre clearances and have been in little or no position to dictate a game plan on the opposition. And when you are predominantly playing the game in the oppositions quarter we are showing none of the skill, application or teamwork to wrestle back the initiative. Since we have had the injuries in Round 1, it is clear we sort to undertake a more direct game of football but lack of centre clearances, poor skills and inadequate pressuring of the opposition just cruels us. Until we can address those issues which hopefully will be lead by the return of our better players, the game plan issue is academic. While many have focussed on our point kick ins and the opposition kick ins, the key point is not only what we are doing but what the opposition does when they dont have the ball and when they get the ball. They run hard to receive and to pressure. We just dont do it. I am surprised at the veracity of the impact of a turnover. The number of times that the turnover goes from one end to the other and we have not touched or interrupted its flow. Disturbing.

I would agree Rogue. FWIW, I think it is very difficult for younger players like Bell, Bate and CJ to often make their way and get establish when the side is under siege as the current line up is. We are probably expecting as much from CJ as we are from other more established players and I dont think that is reasonable. Its a hard learning experience but I would hope an invaluable one that is useful as he gains more experience. Too true. FCS. Sylvia is still not free from OP yet. Godfrey is there to do a particular job. If he does it then fine. If we were seriously battling for Top 4 in September I am not sure I would want to have him in the line up. But given the lack of head down players we have given injuries, he has my full support.

Absolutely Maurie. Absolutely Choko's original e-mail suggested from his "converations" with CJ that CJ had no confidence because ND had no confidence in him when all the time its the poster's opinion of the matters. Both CJ and ND have been misrepresented here and the disclosure of such "conversations" had no bearing or relevance on the poster ultimately giving his opinion.

How have Brown, Godfrey, Jamar and Ward negatively impacted Newton's opportunities?

Amazing. Daniher is giving him significant game time. Hardly a vote of no confidence. BTW, would CJ be prepared to back your assessment of Daniher? Its no wonder some players are sheepish about talking to the public.