Rogue

Last season we had Nathan Brown playing down forward because we didn't have any other small forwards. I think two in a list of 40-odd wouldn't go astray.

How did he show up ND?

I agree - he should be one of the guys we try and get games into this season. I'm not convinced he can't make it at AFL level (unlike Rhino Richards etc), but we need to give him game time this season and see if he's worth keeping. He's currently got more upside than many players on our list. We can't keep carrying someone because we think he might be alright, regardless of his bad luck with injury, but he might turn out to be handy - even as depth. It's not like we'll be struggling to find guys we should delist come end of the year, and he's only 22.

He's always seemed pretty reluctant to kick at all, let alone have a shot. I think it was pre-season '06 when he was actually seemed to have some confidence with the boot, but then played in the backline and was in and out of the team.

No one as bad as Grgic =)

He might well become a good player, but I don't think it will be as a ruckman. That just leaves us with White and Jamar

For me, the biggest thing I've noticed when watching Sylvia has been his lack of awareness - he seems to have trouble finding the right spots to wait for a ball outside a pack etc, where other guys seem like footy naturals in terms of positioning, reading of the play, etc. If you don't have the best footy smarts it's going to make you look even slower.

I thought that the TV replay might have made him look a bit worse than it was. Those at the ground probably have a better idea. Anyhow, Bell would be one guy I'd pretty much play all season.

Interesting - I can remember back to 2000 and before and my opinion that ND was not a great coach... What I'm surprised about is that people would change their minds on ND based on the first four weeks of this season, considering most games we've had limited bench strength (with injuries mid-game) as well as a limited squad from which to choose from. I understand some supporters get really emotional, but a question to those who have changed their mind recently - what has changed so much in the past month re: ND that you haven't already seen in the past decade?

Good game today, no doubt. However, one game don't maketh a season. Where you stand on Yze might have a little to do with whether you're as good as your last game or whether form in the last couple of years counts for more =) I like to see Yze out there (and doing well), but I can also see why people have become pretty frustrated.

That was YM's point - that he felt sorry for Sylvia because it would be frustrating that he didn't get an opportunity in the 7-8 minutes that he was at FF. I also imagine he was disappointed Sylvia didn't get the chance to show something at FF so he could bump his thread

Doesn't mean Watson was referring to the last couple of weeks. Dunn's been in and out of the team in the past, and I agree that he should be getting a gig basically every game this year. I've been saying a similar thing for a while. Regardless of where Miller is written down on the team sheet, his primary role seems to be to provide a 'push up' leading target. If he works hard and can do that effectively, he's doing his job. Other guys - like Dunn - will be staying at home around the 50 to kick the bags. I'm not sure Miller is going to be a consistently good AFL player, but to require him to be a power forward or think he's wasting space out there seems a little silly. It's not like he's keeping out a plethora of guys who can perform at AFL level as key forwards... I see your point. I also think that the fact we had 1/2 our best 22 out or sitting on the bench injured (resulting is us effectively playing the match short, YET AGAIN this year) needs to be taken into consideration.

Today on the TV replay he said 'hopefully this week, if not then the next' or something along those lines. I assume he means next week or the week after that.

We're not Adelaide. Adelaide have been a consistently well-performed side in recent years, something we're not.

Not sure I agree with you, but fair point. You're going to make it very tough for Dunn to excel if Miller isn't there to take a backman. Agreed. Neitz and Robertson are still injured. It's to the detriment of the team for Dunn to be our #1 key forward and apart from Miller there's not much else except for more young kids. Others would say you can't persist with Miller in a position where he's only had a couple of great games (v Barry Hall and Pavlich in '06 at the 'G if you want to count that as 'great'. I think he's not been as good as we or he'd like to have been, period. So you think there's a similarity between Miller and Lynch, who turned out to be a handy forward - yet this is somehow entwined in your case for making Miller a backman? ;o I'm not sure why playing him in the forward line means he needs to be a great 'contested mark' power forward. If he can lead up the ground and can work on providing a 'push-up' target as well as kicking the occassional goal or three that's fine for me. He doesn't need to be Carey to play in the forward line imho. Looking at the long term we have Neitz and Robertson both in the latter stages of their career. We're probably going to be short KPP's at both ends of the ground so it's more about where Miller is going to be a better contributor. I agree that Miller doesn't seem to have the forward smarts of Dunn, but just because he may not be a power forward doesn't mean he doesn't have a role to play in our forward line.

It was always going to be tough considering we already had injuries, brought in a few guys who haven't had much footy, and then had even more injuries (Bell, Wheatley, Jones) as the game went on.

Agreed. No doubt he'd be there if we didn't have 1/3 of our best team out injured. Well said. I'm not sure about that, but it's certainly tough to write him off already.

Ah yeah, I do remember that. I thought it was the best young list though, and mentioned guys like Moloney, McLean, Sylvia, Bell, Bate, CJ, etc.

St. Kilda were overrated IMHO. I also don't see why successful coaches at VFL affiliate level are only 'okay' at best. The principles (managing football department staff, getting the best out of your players, building a list, and making match-day moves) are the same. I would imagine that having some 'Head Coach' credentials at an affiliate would be more helpful than being an AFL assistant Coach in many ways.

Why can't he be serious? ND has been Coach for ~10 years - plenty of time to get a feel for what he's like and see his performance over a long period of time. If Melbourne pull a Steven Bradbury it won't transform ND into a better or worse Coach. St. Kilda were overrated IMHO. I also don't see why successful coaches at VFL affiliate level are only 'okay' at best. The principles (managing football department staff, getting the best out of your players, building a list, and making match-day moves) are the same. I would imagine that having some 'Head Coach' credentials at an affiliate would be more helpful than being an AFL assistant Coach in many ways.

How are they not 'showing their hand'? Any Club who elects to take another club's FS would nominate the round that they would give for him. If the FS Club was willing to match that, they'd win the prize. If not, another Club would take the player. If a FS player is that great then there's nothing wrong with Geelong being forced to pay a first round pick. That comment was in direct response to your assertion that Clubs would somehow do shady deals to try and force a FS Club to pay more than market value - that simply won't happen because the Club that bidded too high would then be stuck with that player. The FS Club would be able to match the highest bidder or lose him to one of the other Clubs who bidded higher. Pretty simple. Every club wouldn't need to nominate a F/S player - only those who wanted to draft him, and perhaps only those that wanted to draft him at a higher round pick than the F/S Club. Anyhow, the principles of both solutions are the same - let the market dictate value. I don't see what kind of 'shady backroom' deals are going to happen tbh. It's extremely unlike any Club is going to be willing to jeapordise their future by paying [in draft picks] more than what they think a player is worth simply to screw another Club. If a Club bids higher than what a player is worth (eg. rd1 for CJ) then they end up with CJ in return for their round 1 pick. They may have presented another Club from getting him, but at substantial cost to themselves. I can't see how that could be justified to the Board, members, or even agreed upon by the footy department. Agreed. How would another Club pay less than market value for a superstar? 'Market value' is set by the market - if other Clubs didn't want to offer a high-round pick for the player then his market value is not that high. If the kid was rated highly it'd need a high draft pick to secure him. I'm all for the F/S tradition to continue, but Clubs giving up third round picks for kids that would go in the first round is not good for the game.

I don't know - I certainly didn't say that.

No thanks. A value decided on by the market is much better. I don't see how Clubs can subvert the system. If a rogue Club 'bids' a high draft pick in an attempt to force the father/son Club into paying too high a price, the rogue Club will simply be left carrying the can. Eg. Cats attempt to force Melbourne to use a round 1 draft pick on CJ. Melbourne decline, and the Cats are obliged to take CJ with their round 1 draft pick. I can't see any Club jeapordising their future to try and screw another another. The system reminds me of a land tax system used in medieval(?) times whereby land owners would pay X amount of tax based on their own valuation of their land. To prevent owners from under-valuing their land [in order to pay less tax] the Crown had the option of buying the land at the value set by the owner.

When we played Freo at the 'G last year Miller played on Pavlich. At the risk of repeating myself (maybe earlier in this thread?), Miller did a pretty good job. Most of Pav's possessions were miles away from goal and out wide. White also did a good job in pushing back to crowd the lead straight up the ground, as did the rest of our players.

GL trying to get them to stop sending you members emails in future years! :|