...

I agree with you totally WJ. I am very wary when people begin with the sentence, "I'm not racist, but......"

The long history of antipathy towards our own indigenous people is deeply ingrained in the culture. It will take a long re-education and and openness of heart for it to dissipate. Hopefully in time it will be no more than a trace-element in our national psyche. As Pauline Hanson and John Howard discovered to their electoral benefit, it's very easy to pick the scab, and having done that, there are many out there who can't resist the scratching. Anti-aboriginal sentiment is still out there and still has it's own momentum. It's not difficult to find anti-semitism either. Both of these racist sentiments have a long history.

For the record, I do sip cafe latte, chardonnay, and could be described by those wishing to give vent to their racist feelings, as a bleeding-heart lefty and a prisoner of political correctness. I do, on the other hand, also very much enjoy tea, beer, shiraz, pinot noir, water and have been known to make jokes which are not "PC".

It's easier for those who like to make racial generalisations to also generalise about those who might take issue with their statements, by labelling them with such pejorative terms as "politically correct". Maybe "political correctness" had very noble beginnings. The term has been hijacked by those who use it as an all-purpose tool to devalue a view they don't agree with.

PS. We all harbour racist feelings at times. It's the tribal nature of the human animal. It's whether we recognise them when they arise and how we deal with them that is the measure of our moral and social development. - End of Sermon

Fair enough. BUT, once again, my statements are linked to anti-semitism (HTF?). Seriously, you guys are projecting, and it's hard to believe it's not for a purpose unrelated to my post. The anti-aborigine sentiment that you talk about is also being ascribed to my post by you. FGS. It's fine to say the Irish drink too much grog, the English are whiners, and the Yanks are all stupid, but pigeon-hole four guys at our football club who are way under par at the moment, and put the kibosh on two others who will add nothing more - god help you. Now you're a Hitler supporter, and now you endorse the treatment of Aborigines by the 'white man' on their arrival 200 years ago. Jesus, I'm pretty sure WJ also linked me to the Bosnian Moslem's massacre.

Is there any chance that the comments I made could be taken for what they were? Probably not, it's just too tasty a treat for people to pass up.

Rubbish.

What more than the qualities that these guys give our football club did I comment on?

What's racist is this comment from you .... Nice argument, except Lance Franklin's from Pakistan. And they're no good either!

I notice you've deleted your profile name Barry. Out of shame?

Well done RR. Like that was serious. It was an initial attempt to settle people down who decided my post was racist. You've managed to make even that obvious (and let's be honest, it's bloody obvious) attempt at humour a stage for you to let everyone know how politically correct you are.

I deleted my name as a prelude to the obvious banning from this site I'm about to get. I leave with regrets, as I liked being a part of this site, but with nowhere near the shame as you should have for being such a fraud.

Indeed.

By singling out four individual players at the club, pinpointing perceived deficiencies in the way they play and linking them by their race, Barry Dawson is guilty of racial sterotyping of the worst order. It's offensive and unacceptable anywhere.

In the normal course, I would discuss a sanction against Barry Dawson with the other mods which would involve at the very least, the removal of his posts (which are an embarrassment to me and to the site), but I thought it might be better to retain them as an example of the sheer ignorance that racist talk entails.

In the last century, we saw several instances of what happens when racist stereotyping is accepted and becomes rife within society.

In the extreme cases, it led to the deaths of millions of Jews, Gypsies and others who were not to the liking of a pathological murderer in Europe, a million and a half in Cambodia in the 70s, a similar number of Armenians at the hands of the Turks almost 100 years ago and close to a million in Rwanda in the 90s.

And we never seem to learn because fifty years after Hitler, the massacre took place on European soil of more than 8,000 Bosnian Muslims in and around the town of Srebrenica in Bosnia and Herzegovina. Today, there are parts of modern, liberal Europe where the old hatred of Jews thrives and there are countless parts of the globe where the killing and rape of innocents on the basis of racial and/or religious differences go on unabated.

Our own Indigenous people suffered similarly when the white man turned up here and the killing began and went on until they were utterly decimated. Our former prime minister issued an apology for what our forebears did but it seems that it passed over some people's heads and that bigotry is still alive and healthy even here.

But racism at the Barry Dawson level, whilst it might not kill or injure physically, is often deeply hurtful to individuals in a society - it's a cowardly form of bullying that we don't have to accept from anyone these days - certainly not here.

You can criticise any individual player as much as you like on this site as long as you do so constructively but if you associate that criticism with the person's race or religion, you cross the line into an area that is grossly offensive and unacceptable and won't be tolerated.

A ridiculous over-reaction with the aim of grandstanding yourself as politically correct. Bringing Hitler into the thread to incite your Jewish mates is pathetic. My comments were entirely about the style of football played by our indigenous contingent, and nothing more. You and several others here have decided that's racist. Well good on you. As previously stated, I think Aaron Davey is fantastic, and I hope he has a better year with a real role and a game plan. I hope Jurrah does the same. I also got stuck into Sylvia's behaviour, but he obviously doesn't fit the indigenous group, which doesn't fit your racist argument, so that hasn't been mentioned. Convenient for you.

Edit: By the way... Trying to tie my comments to the mistreatment of aborigines by the 'white man' (of whom I'll guess you're a part) is also a disgraceful twisting of my comments. Who do you think you are? You've made so much more out of my original post than I ever intended, and you've done so to make yourself look good.

I don't want him at the club. Most others here don't want him either. Our coaching staff and recruiters don't want him.

At least I have the balls to say why.

What was that about boganesque behaviour?

It was about being [censored] up and driving a car and then leaving the scene of an accident the night before an international representative training day.

I presume though, you're intimating that my criticism of some of our indigenous players doesn't fit with the latte-sipping pseudo-intellects here who have no experience with the topic. Hooray for you. They're saved!

Nice. Pigeon holing an entire race. Your assertion that the issue is purely down to players being indigenous is offensive. These boys aren't alone in underachieving. Underachievment has been a blight on our club for years and has nothing to do with cultural difference. A culture of indifference has been a bigger problem. A culture that has accepted mediocrity has been a bigger problem.

What about the indigenous talent we didn't draft, but were in a position to do so? Were we correct in passing on Adam Goodes? Michael O'Loughlin? Cyril? Did we get those right?

If Lance Franklin were a free agent and listed Melbourne as his preferred club, would you suggest we give him a miss? I'm not saying the boys you've singled out don't deserve a spray, but your focus is far too narrow. Far more players than you've named have been mollycoddled and given more leeway than they should have.

Nice argument, except Lance Franklin's from Pakistan. And they're no good either!

The last thing this club needs is another flashy, undisciplined, skinny player to whom we are obliged to show the greatest empathy and support every time he wants to p!ss off home because the big mean coaches at MFC are trying to get him to be accountable defensively.

Would not last a heartbeat under our new coaching regime.

I went down to training for a while. Only stayed for the running part.

Bate is looking strong and may have even slimmed down a touch. Very fit. Maybe someone has had a word in his ear about the midfield role as others here have suggested. Good luck Bater!

Agree with others on Blease and Gys; I don't think people are having a whinge or expressing surprise - It's just an observation. They are both really struggling with the running. Gysberts does seem to recover and do okay in the ball work sessions once the running is finished though, I think he's just not a great runner. I'm sure he'll improve though. I haven't watched Blease as closely.

Watts looks very fit and is doing the running pretty easily. Maybe a wing or a flank for him this year?

Trengove looks to have added a bit of muscle, and is also getting through the running sessions well.

Everything else I saw has been mentioned by others or myself in the last training thread.

I'm happy about picking up this big fella. Good luck to him.

I read in full, the draft meeting article on the MFC website. At one point, it was reported that Neeld asked Turnbull about a mature age player - "so will he be ready to go in round one against Brisbane?".

They must have been referring to Sellar. Surely...

That says to me that Neeld is going to alter our game plan and outlook significantly. He is stacking our forward line with size.

It also says that the young bloke we picked at 52 was rated (as much as a pick 52 can be) by our footy department.

Great stuff.

He concedes that the Giants franchise comes in with a big advantage but he also believes that the proof will be in the pudding and much will depend on how recruits are brought into the system, how the transition from junior football to an elite club is made and how well they are coached and mentored.

Thanks for that summary WJ. I agree strongly with the line I have quoted you on above. To go a step further, I have some hope that we have players already in our team who will surprise us with their improvement next year for the same reason. If Neeld and co are as good as we hope they are, we may already have the team that can take us to a premiership. We won't die wondering if we had enough good draft picks to build it.

I went today - first time ever...

The running session was brutal. Believe me I know - I used to be a 400m runner. Punishing session.

Observations on the running:

Trengove did really well. He's not a natural runner, but just gutsed his way in front of Bail on every rep. That kid has something inside him - I think it's captaincy material.

Bail was good too, as was Jones. Howe was excellent, he looks the most like a track athlete out of anyone at the club.

Martin has an inefficient running style but is so bloody strong and wilful that he easily makes up for it. Gysberts needs a heap of work. He is gutsy though. He was absolutely farked half way through the session but continued to push himself. He is going to improve out of sight under this new regime.

There were back slaps and bum taps flying all over the place between the rep 300s. Trengove and Nicholson (who also ran very well) were big talkers.

The groups:

Forwards: Watts, Martin, Dunn, Howe (who has endurance and speed that I think might belong on a wing), one of the Mc's (I can never remember them all - not Joel or Jordy though).

Rehab: Clark, Davey, Grimes, Jordy Mc, Tappy, Gawn, Fitzy, Neville

Mids: BATE!!! Gysberts, Trengove, Bartram (ran well too), Bail, Beamer, Jones

Backs: Other side of the ground - so presumably the rest.

The non-playing staff:

Neeld - spent most of the time where players were running having a kick of the footy with someone really short who I did not know. Once the ball exercises started though, he was all over them like a rash. Physically providing contests (to an extent), telling them to move move move, etc. Hands on coach. I like.

Misson - extremely organised and very clear to the players on what's required. Not hard-assed verbally; he let his program do the talking.

Garry Lyon - laconic, confident, happy, wearing thongs (on feet). Got around to a few supporters for a quick chat to each. In quick chat to me seemed happy we have the right things going on at the club, and aren't the boys working hard?!

Royal - merciless in the handball skill game. Told the group as a whole that some of the work they were doing was [censored]. Gave good instruction though.

All in all - enjoyed watching my first training session. We're going to have a different team to watch. I'm Big Kev!

I'm a bit bored now. Questions welcome, but it was a lot to take in.

where is the best place to park for sessions at Gosch's Paddock?

Directly over the road - $6.

Not Punt Road, the other one...

ring or email the club. Could be anywhere this time of year. Season proper is a bt more regimented.

Thanks Beeze,

Did that. Rang the club. You're right, all over the place. Apparently at this time of year we just have to watch the club website.

Hiya W_J

I posted this on Ology after viewing the first training run. It may be of interest to you and others.

##########################################

Sam looked buggered and without any real endurance. The drill was repetitive 300m-ish runs at good solid pace with a short 100m-ish recovery stroll/walk then off again. Sam needs to put a lot of k's into those legs!!

The fastest group, Jones, Bail & Maloney, were doing it in 1 min 4 secs. The group Sam was in did 1 min 14 with Sam repetitively doing it in 1 min 25 ish. We timed them a couple of times. There was another group that we didn't time cos of the staggered starts.

The purpose of the run seemed to be sort the fit from the not so fit. It did it's job it seemed.

######################################################

Thanks for that post.

If you want to put it into perspective; how many reps are we talking?

B/c if it's 10 - that's really poor. If it's 20 - that's really good.

Thanks for info again.

Edit: Really good = 1 min 4 sec group. Not the others. 1min 14 secs for a 300m is a canter. You'd want to be doing 30 reps to make that acceptable at this level of sport. 1 min 25 secs is a brisk walk. Not a good look.

Where/When is the next training session? Where do I get this info?

Thanks.

Hey rfpc, this thread is a bit out of character for you. You getting some lately? New GF? Love it though...

Haven't been able to listen to it yet, but here is the link to his interview with Neil Mitchell this morning:

http://www.3aw.com.a...1102-1muxo.html

Broke down watching this. Especially the last line "I know what I'm going to miss out on".

Does not deserve this. I hope a miracle occurs.

There's nothing that can really be said that does justice to this bloke and what he's going through.

Prayers every night that he beats it. Love to Jim and his family.

Fair comment. If we going to be critical of the class of 2004 and Newton was pick 46, I am more disappointed with Bate and Dunn who we blew first round draft picks on. Hopefully Neeld can turn around at least one of them.

I am not sure if there was issue with Newton's seven years. His resignings at the time were reasonable given the state of our list. And the last 3 years he was on minimum wages/rookie payments.

Disappointing Rhino.

They had 3 groups with roughly even numbers - someone had to be in each group - Morton was going very well consistently 3 wide in group 2.

There were 21 in the elite group, no-one in the 2nd group and Blease and Gysberts in the 3rd group. Happier?

What a surprise that he was out wide

The sentiment isn't cliche, either. It's fact.

It's like saying the sun rising in the east is cliche...

Please be more Pacific about what you're referring to.

Addition: "Nothing to see here". Summarily dismisses any point of view as irrelevant - like you have the right to do so. Rating - 9/10.

learning to read the flight of the ball in the air. The Irish knew how to finesse the ball - the Australians were way off!

Reading the flight was definitely the biggest problem. We were out-marked all night, usually leading the opponent to the ball, and then the ball would carry about 5m further than we anticipated, right over our heads and into the arms of an Irish opponent. The Irish also smashed us at pack marks, as they always had a bloke over the back waiting for the extra carry. We didn't do this well.

Consequently our blokes ran around all over the place like Brown's cows, really struggling to spread in the right directions. Once that was established, the Irish destroyed us.

I am sure Brad is rapt to be Captain...And Good Luck to Him.....BUT if he or Chippa get injured playing this Game i will be mighty pi$$ed orf.

My Beef is with The AFL for actually having this meaningless series.....The elite of the AFL have quietly said no....i wish that was the case with our Boys...

But if you wish to watch the game friday night, by all means do so,,,,I will be at the Movies...Footy season is over..Time to recharge the Batteries.

Yep, can empathise with you there. Personally, I like the fact it goes on, but definitely see your point. If Trenners does a knee or something it will be awful. Just think the 'embarrassing' part of the thread was a bit strong.

Looking forward to next season big time. Can't wait for the banter.

Regards, Baz