Posts posted by Sir Why You Little
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Edited by Sir Why You Little
9 minutes ago, Go Ds said: NO, we crashed and burned after 2023 and there's still a slight chance it's been more a bingle and overheated radiator. Yes, Hawthorn had some great recruiting. Admittedly Fremantle made one of the worst trade mistakes ever trading pick #1 for Croad and Hawthorn benefited from no team drafting Mitchell the year before and still in the 'Croad' draft having every team let Hawthorn pick him at 36. Admittedly these picks have nothing to do with Clarkson who wasn't coach yet. Similarly we can't really go at Goodwin for draft picks before 2016 - players now round their prime at 26 to maybe 29 as well as some older campaigners. You're still missing the point that Goodwin had a very good team while Clarkson had a champion team so arguably this is more why other teams overtook us rather than coaching mistakes.
And if you really think it's better to miss finals altogether or only lose elimination finals why would any team bother finishing higher than 7th? It makes no sense. Yes, straight set exits are painful but nearly every year making the top 4 on the ladder is like getting a golden ticket.
Sure itās a Golden Ticket, but we blew it Twice on our home Deck in consecutive years. Thatās very bad, however you Dress it up. We chokedā¦.(Crash & Burn) Finish 6thā¦.
No one expected Hawthorn to win the Flag in ā08, least of all themselves, in reality Jeeelong Choked it. So it took the Hawks a few years to reload and get a 3peat
With the list we had accumulated in ā21 we should have achieved a lot more, but our trading of Senior Players has been horrendous which is something Goodwin is partially involved in
Losing Burgess was a huge setback i admit, but i still think a fresh voice would have been beneficial after the ā23 Season, sadly we will never know
The next 2 games are very interesting in terms of where we really are this year. Win them both with solid performances and Goodwin may claw his way backā¦
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2 hours ago, sydneydee said: Regardless of the two wins, he needs to go.
The club expected a high finals finish to the home and away season. As soon as finals are not mathematically possible he should be removed for a fresh coach for the pre season.
The next 2 weeks should give a pretty solid indication of what the future holds
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3 hours ago, Go Ds said: NO, that's my point! Are you seriously arguing two straight set exits is worse than the even rarer embarassment of missing the finals after the flag in '08 plus a 'comfortable' elimination final loss the year after? That's what happened to Clarkson. Thank God, Kennet and co didn't let a subsequent threepeat coach go.
And how about Beveridge? After his flag his Dogs came 10th and 13th. He's still coach and now some (not stupidly) would happily have him coach us. As someone said above maybe people have overreacted to the straight set losses.
(As for comparing the Hawks and Dees one did win three flags in a row, had luck in the prelim where Port kicked like they were in red and blue jumpers and arguably got Sydney and WC on bad days while the other had things like their Norm Smith medallist collide with Buddy plus lost Brayshaw for as good as the whole '23 finals.
BTW do you know that Hawthorn's 2015 GF team in hindsight had 12 All Australians plus future Norm Smith winner Isaac Smith compared to 5 All Australians currently in our last final?)
If Hawthorn had 12 AAās after 2015, that is excellent recruitment and Development, which we should be aspiring towards. Not many people thought we would crash and burn after ā21, but that is the reality
After ā23 it was time for a new voice with fresh Assistantās, but no Pert had write up a new Contract.
The situation with Oliver was a lot worse than what was reported in the Media, and it has caused a lot of angst. It is now improving, but there are still scars to be sorted
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6 minutes ago, Go Ds said: NO, that's my point! Are you seriously arguing two straight set exits is worse than the even rarer embarassment of missing the finals after the flag in '08 plus a 'comfortable' elimination final loss the year after? That's what happened to Clarkson. Thank God, Kennet and co didn't let a subsequent threepeat coach go.
And how about Beveridge? After his flag his Dogs came 10th and 13th. He's still coach and now some (not stupidly) would happily have him coach us. As someone said above maybe people have overreacted to the straight set losses.
(As for comparing the Hawks and Dees one did win three flags in a row, had luck in the prelim where Port kicked like they were in red and blue jumpers and arguably got Sydney and WC on bad days while the other had things like their Norm Smith medallist collide with Buddy plus lost Brayshaw for as good as the whole '23 finals.
BTW do you know that Hawthorn's 2015 GF team in hindsight had 12 All Australians plus future Norm Smith winner Isaac Smith compared to 5 All Australians currently in our last final?)
I am talking about Hawthorn winning a 3peat after Franklin left the Club.
And yes i think losing 4 finals in 2 years on our home Ground is a worse scenario than what Hawthorn did after 08
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4 hours ago, Go Ds said: Why the hell would you sack a coach two years after breaking a huge drought?!!!!! šÆšÆšÆ
Get rid of a recent premiership coach to get a less recent premiership/ preliminary final coach? Huh?! Sorry, most of your last post I agree with but that sentence is a real headscratcher. Add to that you mentioned a team who won a flag then missed the finals altogether and then followed up with an elimination final loss. Be honest were you also suggesting at the time Clarkson should be sacked too? What a waste if he had been! Imagine 5 years later if Hawthorn had spent that period languishing in the middle of the ladder while Clarkson had just turned a no-hoper team into back to back premiers.
We should always make sure we're comparing apples with apples. But I'm amazed people are so desperately wanting to sack Goodwin (and yes, I saw it even earlier than September '23)
Where did i ever say Clarkson should be sacked? Hawthorn won the 2013 Flag with Franklin and then won the next 2 without him. We win a Flag and implode
Adversity doesnāt bother the Top Sides, (mostly) they just work harder
Losing 2 straight sets final series on the MCG is enough to change Coaches in my opinion, I believe we missed a serious moment there, but itās in the past.
I also wonder why it takes 2 years to teach a list to play āRun and Carryā Footballā¦.
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Edited by Sir Why You Little
17 minutes ago, GS_1905 said: Wasnt he flying this pre-season though? Surely the hammy tear in '23 isnt limiting his ability to explode from contest.
Perhaps its also confidence and willpower. maybe its all between the ears? He was non existent in the first Half, then came out like a man possessed in Q3 before tailing off again.
Absolutely, he is not fit enough, he needs that extra 1-2% of commitment.
He has improved on last year, but he can only play like āClarryā in short bursts at the moment
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35 minutes ago, Go Ds said: Sorry, that's too simplistic. If that 16 excludes the best 6 players that's gonna make a much bigger dent than if 4 of the best 22 missed a GF and now only 27th to 30th plus the 19th and 20th player have moved on.
Of course age and injury have a bearing too. Is it true that preseasons accumulate and missing one means a full subsequent preseason still has a player playing catch-up? If so Oliver, after psychological issues and an almost missed pre-preseason can't yet be the 21/22 version of himself. Add to that Petracca almost dying, losing fitness, and possibly trust in his body and on-field safety and he too maybe can't be expected to be the player he had been at least for now. Honestly if 2 of our best 3 players are only 85% for now and we've lost the likes of Luke Jackson and Brayshaw and maybe some others are also 85%of their old selves with age it's more acceptable Melbourne's drop-off. That doesn't mean players can be excused for not trying or very sloppy skills. But might explain something.
I am not disagreeing with any of that, but all Clubs face adversity every year. Franklin went to Sydney and the Hawks won the next 2 Flags. We do not handle adversity well.
The skill level in the first 5 rounds was deplorable, including a 10 goal loss to North.
Goodwin should have been moved on with a Handshake at the end of 2023, if we are being totally serious, rather than given an extension, considering what had been allowed to happen with Oliver.
But that is my opinion as you have yours, the biggest issue we lost was Burgess. We have lost our edge in fitness preparation and at the moment cannot run out 4 Quarters, and for that to include 16 Premiership Players (who should know what it takes) is a very bad look
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4 hours ago, Deestar9 said: But weāre not a top team ..yet. We are in the process of blending our new talent with our āoldā talent. Of course you donāt play the same way every week as you donāt play the same oppo every week & you may not have the same players every week. You win differently. Instead of wasting negative energy on Goodwin just try & enjoy the evolution of the team and the players. Itās actually fun
With 16 Premiership Players still representing the Club, we should be a Top Side, thatās the whole point
Maybe I expect higher standards than you
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6 minutes ago, Big Gun said: I usually mute the commentary these days as I find it insufferable. Thought Iād listen to the Geelong Blues game today just for a change but seriously Dwayne Russell is just the worst. His stupid one line planned puns are so embarrassing. How does he still get a gig???? Back to my music I think.
I have Brayshaw and Jab Watson
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4 hours ago, Deestroye said: Look.. that was my feeling too but Iām not sure if Iām being too harsh. It wasnāt all bad but yeh it also wasnāt anywhere close to the week prior. Why isnāt that sustainable? The top teams do it almost every week.
Top Teams do it every week
We do it sporadically for 1 or 2 Quarters and we do it very well, but it is not consistent enough
Goodwin is still under the spotlight 100%
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43 minutes ago, Adam The God said: Happy with what you've seen though over the last fortnight, SWYL? At least in snippets...?
Happy with the wins, of course
But our final Quarters have been bog ordinary, for some reason
Good sides will take us apart if it doesnāt improve
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Final Quarters are still a major factor
I have no problem with Max being rested, but that doesnāt mean that everything has to fall apart in his absence.
We have seen some excellent football over the last 2 weeks in patches, but Goodwin and the Coaching staff have still got some major work ahead of them, in terms of a Plan B
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Letās play 4 Quarters of Good Solid Football first.
Right now we are a V12 engine running on 7 Cylinders
Much tuning and balancing to be done
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I just watched 5 minutes of the North Gameā¦
We lost to them by 60 pointsā¦ How the F did we as a Club let that happen š”š¤¬
If by Seasons end we miss Finals by % or 4 points i will be so angry. They are going to get Belted every week.
This better be a dam good Gameplan Simonā¦ oh and btw, Does your new Gameplan include the Final Quarter??
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1 minute ago, Chook said: Best game I've seen Sparrow play imo. Bowey has turned into an absolute jet. Petracca is just going. Oliver has fallen off a cliff.
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Petracca & Oliver at the Dees in 2026?
in Melbourne Demons
Thatās what it is..he hasnāt gone to the elite fitness he had, and can only perform in shorter bursts at this stage. He is on big $$ās and needs to get betterā¦