Generation dee

I don't know if they won that on emotion from the buddy issue giving them a bit extra, or Sydney being a bit undermanned, but they were simply awesome. Some skill errors kept Sydney in the game but they are seriously improved.

On a side note, how long before sections of the media question if it was Sydney landing buddy that contributed to this loss. Especially the players squeezed out. Even getting the full list back, I'm not sure Sydney have the weapons to match hawks or freo.

This has been answered ad nauseum.

His foot is fine, it's other parts of his leg getting used to increased and foreign workloads. His legs are now susceptible to soft tissue injuries until they strengthen.

Here's my point. I understand the foot seems to have healed, but I mean is the training that he is undertaking wrong? Is he doing too much running and not enough weights etc. have we tried to get him fit too quickly? Has to be a solution close by.

Yeah I do, I'm not sure it's good if he can't get the loads into his body to even run the tan without getting injured.

I hope this can work if that's what it's meant to do.

He must be totally gutted, no matter how much you are being paid you like to feel you are making a contribution and moving forward. Thank god he has the photography to at least give him some respite. He must have a lot of self doubt at the moment.

It's not great at all, which begs the question- why? Is it diet? Too much too soon? What's causing this?

He has missed the best part of two years, could very easily become three the way it's looking, i think he's in big trouble, which is a shame because he has absolute superstar potential.

Which begs the question- you and I are extremely disappointed about it, therefore how gutted do you think Mitch is?

It's not about razor blades, it's just not looking good at the moment. Maybe the break will do him good but it is an about turn from the club who have consistently said he needs to gradually increase his loads because he has had too much time away from the game to now taking all the loads off and giving him a break.

You mean the load increases which are contributing to these setbacks? I reckon it's good, maybe he needs more healing than partial training. Everyone recovers different- jimmy stynes was testament to that! What would rub other guys out for a month would niggle jimmy for a day.

I really hope Mitch can make a swift recovery, he comes across as being our spiritual leader, like max rooke in a sense, the whole list will get a boost if he is back playing.

It's totally out of our hands unfortunately but if he doesn't play imagine how Clark would feel?

Yes we all would be devastated but have a thought for Clark.

It would be the biggest disappointment for him I would think.

What will happen will happen. It's in gods hands so to speak.

Exactly right ox, if only other posters shared your views and had some more respect for the bloke.

I too reckon he's overrated. The year he made AA he didn't come top 10 in his B&F.

That said, I reckon he'd rather drink acid than play for us. Also, there's no way he'd contemplate leaving West Coast. He loves the place.

And it would be a tad embarrassing when we could have had him.

On many fronts this is a disastrous suggestion.

I think with the club debeloent over the past few seasons, we could have picked any of Dangerfield, Fyfe, Natanui.. And all would be less the footballers that they are now had they arrived at Melbourne. In which case we would probably be talking about the athleticism of watts running around subiaco, blease tearing up the gabba and the like. I know there have been se disastrous selections, but poor development is the backbone of our struggles now.

What, and miss out on the "we can't be as ordinary as last year" feeling I get every preseason? Wouldn't miss that for quids!

I can certainly understand those that stop following the dees, it makes every Monday that much harder going to work after getting pumped on the weekend, as well as losing interest in the game on weekends. But the optimist in me still says we will turn it around soon, and those times will be that much sweeter after going through the past 7 years, and knowing how far back we've come from.

It's not easy but it's another season and we just need to keep the faith.

I'm still trying to find where in that article it mentioned either chip or Dunn leaving? Such is the outcry on here. How about we leave it to roos and the like to turn things around and show some genuine direction, in which case frawley will sign!

I think playing in NT may have taken more out of the boys than they realised. We never play well after a game up north not that we have played well for the last seven yrs but u know what I mean

Hawks are premiers for a reason and we r a bottom 2 side for a reason.

The class was always going to be miles apart.

Remember where the Hawks have come from guys and that is in the exactly the same position we r in now.

Keep the faith ( as hard as it is )

It's bloody tough but you are right!

The photography may have started out as a hobby but it has become much more than that. Selling prints, tutorials, a web-page (other than a Facebook Page), an escalating interest and investment in more and better equipment and so on. The Photography Bug can bite hard and I speak from experience.

What about buddy and his clothes range? Nick riewoldt as well... What about the players studying courses at uni?

You mean they spend 70 hours a week at a footy club and that's not enough with various meetings, trainings and discussions? Pretty poor opinion that players can't have an interest outside of footy, be that photography or anything.

Not sure why we have to give him the benefit of the doubt.

No one is doubting his desire to play or willingness to train hard to make it.

Don't think I started out to belittle him, as I said just stated the position at the start of 2014.

I must have misunderstood your "crock" reference. I don't mean his desire to return, I mean that he is on track to return early rounds. Not round 1, but 3, 4 or 5. Anyway you and I can talk all we want, the only people who really know are Mitch himself, and the medical team!

Just a statement of the facts Gd.

He has been out for the vast majority of the last two years.

The current path he seems to be on will IMO not see him contributing till well into the season.

He is on I think a four year deal and wants to play.

I made no mention of his desire, I am sure most people believe he is trying hard.

But the simple fact remains he has not been on the park much and does look like it yet this year.

Understandable, given we need our best players playing more than any other club. That said, do you think posts belittling him really are justifiable? He isn't the first person to be injured nor to sign a long term deal- I use Nathan bock at Gold Coast as an example. The facts are as you pointed out he has played very little footy in his time as a dee, but the other facts are he has still not missed a game in 2014, and even if he does miss the first 3 or 4, that will be done with the intention of him being available the rest of the season. Shouldn't we give him the benifit of the doubt that he will play early, unless otherwise stated?

Has turned into a crock since early 2012.

Don't expect much till May

I definitely don't mean this disrespectfully, but how come there are so many comments like this one floating around about Mitch? It's hardly the guys fault he copped a serious injury, and at this stage he is doing everything in his power to get back, let's not forget guys like Hird and richo came back from similar. It's not like Matthew Egan where we are hearing it's going to be another 12 months- we are hearing he is doing everything possible and was doing everything right until Xmas. I understand everyone wants to see him back playing, but give the guy some credit- he is still in the leadership group and he obviously loves the club not to chuck it in and quit after his past 2 years. Can't we be positive that he WILL be back this year?

I don't consider Pedersen in the same context as a marquee signing of Dawes. He's a VFL player without one strong redeeming skill at AFl level. Podsiadly even at VFL was a great grab. Pedersen has a track record at Box Hill and NM that would have suggested he was bog ordinary. It's totally beguiling why we offered a flawed VFL player 3 years. After closely seeing him play at MFC and Casey we must have been suckered by his age, height, weight combo. I am not sure why you needed to bring Ablett, Mitchell and Bartels into the discussion. All are proven AFL champs. Pedersen clearly isn't.

The Pedersen/Gysberts was a low grade punt by both NM and MFC. Gysberts got one year at NM. He failed there and is gone. My information at NM thought Gysberts was a poor pick by MFC but their regard for Pedersen was so low they think they won out of the deal just to be rid of him. And then MFC gave him 3 years......go figure. I note you didn't address how he could play Murray league in 2015 if he is still contracted to MFC that year.

And using big words out of a Roget's Thesaurus does little to hide your poor grasp of matters and your pretentious. But well done on the spelling

Pretentiousness? Really? You can't keep from getting personal again? All because what, I originally said we had to pay overs to attract anyone? You're a blight on demonland due to the inability to construct a good spirited debate. I won't be engaging anymore with an old man attempting to rectify his bullied childhood by compensating on a club forum. Good day.

'Impecunious' means you have no money. Not sure that's quite what you mean.

Late night posting. However I think you got my drift

Thats rubbish we had to overpay to a VFL player from another club.

If they had done the investigation on the player from his time at Box Hill and NM, they might have detected that he was ranked ordinary and selfish. I am not sure how he was to set "an example" for younger players. His 1st round squib dealt with that.

He is 27 this year so Roos will be a genius extracting further "development" from a very limited footballer.

I dont know why you think we can jettison him in 2015 given we have mysteriously given at best a depth player a 3 year deal.

Another example of impecunious interpretation from you rhino. If you backtrack a little you will see I said, and I quote "older players to set an example, and kids. Pedo falls in between". Your abject failure to elucidate why roos cannot "extract further development" from a 27 year old footballer is simply mystifying given the recent influx of mature age footballers reaching new heights later in their careers, examples being podsiadly, callinan and Stephenson. Or are you of the belief that 27 is the new 30, and once past that age you should be thrown on the proverbial scrap heap? I guess we should encourage Ablett, bartel and Mitchell should all sit this season out?

You didn't consider "overs" being paid for Dawes? Or the Pederson-gysberts trade to be in North's favour? "Rubbish" being the fact we needed to entice players with bigger contracts? I'd love to see the comparative contract for Dawes and Pederson between 2012 to 2013.

Another poor post with shallow thinking rhino, you be sure to fine tune your interpretation next time before "rubbishing" someone's post.

We had to "overpay" to get anyone to join us at the end of 2012, we lost a lot of ordinary players who didn't work hard enough, and replaced them with a mixture of older ordinary players who were here to set an example and kids. Pedo falls in between and he has the chance to really set himself up as a first 22 player, or an average vfl/depth player. Truth is, he will never get a better chance than having roos incoming as head coach and surrounded by genuine development coaches. Whilst he has his flaws, he deserves a chance to improve in the same manner as Strauss, blease, tapscott and bail. If they don't, 2015 will be out playing for minyip/murtoa in the Horsham league.

We don't have a part time CEO or coach. We have a full time coach and a full time CEO, both of whom are contracted and both of whom are doing a fully committed job thus far.

Feel free to correct me anytime I've only been following MFC for 60 years.We've got a " laissefare " AFL appointed CEO on a short term contract who didn't want the job andwe've got an as above coach for two or three years who couldn't attract a takeover coach.Should we have got " John Lennon Rose Coloured Glassses " with our 2014 memberships ?

Fairly disappointing post "puntkick". When you take into account Peter Jackson actually sought to increase his contract until the end of 2014 after only a few months in the job, which has since culminated in the arrival of Paul Roos as well as the locking away of key sponsors. To say that the afl could make a person take a job they didn't want is simply foolhardy, the afl is hardly communist Russia forcing people to take on work against their will. Afl installed or not, they are there selling the Melbourne brand now and so far, doing a mighty job of it.

Paranoia.

Don't worry, he comes in, says something to attack someone because they make a point he disagrees with, then leaves again. Kinda like a cold sore.

I can see what your saying but as you pointed out, Clark and Dawes so far have been injury prone and hardly have played. We gave up pick 12 for Clark and pick 20 for Dawes.

On Hogan its too early to say. Hasn't played an AFL game yet even though he has showed real talent at VFL level the step up from that league to AFL level is HUGE. We did give up pick 3 for him which would have nabbed us Ollie Wines. Wines, Viney and Toumpas would have been a pretty handy onball unit as well.

Unfortunately the negatives far outweighs the positives with Neeld. The problem was Mclardy, Schwab and Lyon told Neeld to give the boys a good kick up the ass when he was appointed, which wasn't Neelds caliber. He tried to be someone he wasn't and that gets shown out big time to players. Why would players listern to a bloke trying to be a hardass when he was a [censored] as a player.

Picks 12 and 20 under previous Melbourne recruiting teams would have delivered less games than what Clark and Dawes have played. That said, when those picks were given up, no one knew Clark would get struck down like he did (people have very quickly forgotten the form he showed over the first part of 2012) and Dawes adds a professionalism to the playing group not seen for a long time. The games he got on the park he showed he is a worthwhile investment, and we should back our clubs fitness team to get them right. I see a lot of criticism at jamar for having a "flash in the pan" season warranting all Australian form, let's hope that the injury riddled seasons are a "flash in the pan" in contrast to a long prosperous and healthy career to both these players.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/11/30/07/16/footage-emerges-of-gold-coast-suns-brawl

You really want someone of this quality at our club demonsterative? Really? You think a bloke 30 years old who still can't handle his grog, belting a 21year old while he is getting held, you think this is a positive person to have around? It doesn't matter what the circumstances are, you belt someone drunk like that when they aren't ready for it, you're a coward and thug. I've no doubt I could break the jaw of Anthony mundine if he was sloshed and unsuspecting- I guess you like that too?

I'm absolutely disgusted people would talk about bringing a person like that to our club. Yes boys will be boys, yes sometimes you have a argument or a scuffle, but 2 cheap shots reaching over a guy holding him back? That's not on. As angrydemons has pointed out, what if he fell over and fell back on something, he is clearly sauced, how will he keep his balance?

It doesn't matter if you're a footballer, doctor, actor or plain joe off the street- hitting someone with a cheap shot like that is cowardly and a thug act, and I hope that soon the judicial system start to take it a bit more seriously.

Can someone report back on what Bernie Vince is like. Is he a hard worker on the track and is he a nice guy?

I've known him for years. Great bloke. Mates with everyone and the type of guy you want to play footy with. Good trainer but probably not a Daniel Cross or Nathan Jones.

You're missing the point. Toumpas contested ball winning percentages were too low at junior level. Recruiters like 30% to be a minimum benchmark and Toumpas was the lowest of all highly ranked mids at 22. Cale Morton was another from his year that was very low in contested ball winning ability. This year it was Aish and interestingly he slipped out of the top 3 where he'd comfortably sat all year. And I'd say he fell due to his poor contested ball winning percentage.

We need Toumpas to hurt on the outside with his beautifully weighted passes and to also win contested footy. It's an area he needs to improve. He knows it and the coaches know it.

The points you raise are valid, however is there a way to differentiate between a guy playing seniors at sanfl level, vs a guy playing at tac cup level? I mean, toumpas and aish wouldn't start onball every centre bounce, where as a guy like josh Kelly or Cale Morton playing tac cup are more likely to play onball longer.

I've seen enough of toumpas to feel he has a big future as an afl onballer. He sees gaps for handball releases, he keeps his feet (which will only increase as he builds core strength) and he uses the ball well. I see him developing into a jimmy bartel/chad wingard type. The days of being a pure mid are gone, you need to be able to go back, half forward etc, and I think toumpas will be able to be adaptable.

On a side note, has anyone seen much at training along the lines of stoppages and kick ins?