Toast

From the MFC web site review of players; about Dunn:

.......................................

Lynden was one of the most improved players for 2012. He should look forward to the pre-season, knowing that he’s locked down a spot within the team. - Jade Rawlings (backline coach)

Lynden looks to be a stayer.

Interestingly, Dunn is the same height as Rivers and a few kgs heavier. Hmm....

I'd love to see Dunn play on, love him. His last few games this year were fantastic, he showed genuine hunger which is all I ask of players.

By this reckoning though Mono it seems 'Gys' will be with us next year also something which I'd be bloody happy with also!

From the 2012 player review by the coaches:

Pre-season is going to be really important for Gys, to make sure that he can try and get through uninterrupted from injury - if he does that, he’ll keep progressing to being the AFL player that he’s capable of being. - Aaron Greaves (midfield development coach)

Talk about off topic.

I am an avid fan. Look for Ardberg and Laphroaig (both Islay malts) - stick with the basic Ardberg, but some of the (dearer) quarter cask Laphroaig versions are worth the extra. Talisker from the Isle of Skye is another beauty.

Bloody hypocryte aren't I? But hell it's all grog!

Mono love your suggestions Ardbeg right up there but I tell you what I'm on a bottle of the Laphroaig Quarter Cask at the moment and it is blowing my mind! I can't stop talking about it. I think this is what happens to people who first discover the pleasures of the good stuff. Thanks for your suggestions mate!

Whilst on one of my favorite topics, any single malt drinkers in the house?

I finally 'got it' late last year and am having a ball exploring the world of single malts. Any recommendations for good smokey, peaty goodness?

Why is thread after thread hijacked by the same morons time after time?

Seriously take your personal gripes elsewhere gents and ladies you are a complete and utter bore!

He's bringing up money because that's the point he's making. The $500k price tag quoted for Mackay was way too high.

I don't think anyone doubts that we, as a club, need to spend to attract quality players to the club and sometimes pay over the odds, but at the same time, most would consider $500k for Mackay as way over the top.

FWIW, I thought he went quiet in the first half and went ok in the second half but overall, I haven't seen enough from him that suggests he would make a difference at our club if we had recruited him. Also, I think if you're going to take on a player on that pay, it's not unreasonable to expect a top five b & f finish.

We wouldn't recruit him on where he is going to finish in the Crows Best and Fairest though, we'd get him at our club to see where he'd finish in ours. Sure he might not finish high tho year, but what about next year? I think we saw value in where this guy is heading rather than where he is now, much like what we saw with Clark this year.

He would have been good for us. I just hate people judging our club on past experience given the turnover we've had off field in the past year.

Thanks for bringing up Champion Data where Mackay's average ranking isn't even in his team's top dozen but while you might have made some sort of point as to why we should go after a player of his ilk, you haven't addressed my concern which is the $500k price tag, which I maintain, if it is/was true, it was way over the top. In any event, if his own club believes that he has the extraordinary qualities you ascribe to him, then he should finish top 5 in his team's b & f. I look forward to seeing how he goes.

Keep digging your hole Mo. More stats! Mate he's playing a role in a top 4 side. He'd play midfield for us and stomp on half our list. Why bring up money when you doubt the figures quoted anyway? Stop reading the Sun and taking it as gospel.

Gee Mo the champ tag really got under your skin huh?

So you've come back at me with the airchair weapon of stats! Awesome, maybe all those coaches we employ should just run their fingers down the stats column of the Sunday Herald-Sun every week and just offer money to whoever gets the most! What do you think that's you're reckoning isn't it? Lies, damn lies and statistics they say. Some players like Mc Kay impact the game in other ways, like with their speed, ability to read the play and set up their team mates. I imagine the role we had for him would have been different to Adelaides (the one the team who nearly made it into this years grand final). Or do you think he would have gotten the exact same number of statistics for us? Stats don't impress me but they obviously do you.

You're other suggestion, that Brownlow votes will somehow qualify your argument one way or the other is just plain bizarre. Now you want the bloody umpires to be in charge of our recruiting!!! Ha! Being the lover of statistics you are maybe I shouldn't have been surprised but gee whizz this is a beauty cause as you know only the very best player in the comp ever wins that. So youre now saying we should just recruit whoever wins that, or whoever gets over ten votes! Can't wait to see that list, throw some. Ames at me on Tuesday mate!

So with help from footywire, champion data and the umpires you sure have shown me my friend. You've shown me that we should bugger fringe players at other clubs who can bring something special to the worst club in the competition. We should invest in players like McKay with his speed, kicking and leadership qualities. Oh my hell no, champ!

We offered him a four year $2m contract?

Good lord!

See your first Crows game of the year? Good on you champ.

I love it when the armchair experts hit the forums to let us know how little people like Neil Craig know about the game of football.

Looking forward to similar insightful contributions such as this in the future MO. Perhaps you could start by letting us know who should have received the offer instead.

Can we add Clinton Young to this list? I just think he is a real sleeper, not getting much of a game with a very strong Hawks side. Not much being said. Anyone aware of his contractual status?

Settle down, I wasn't giving an opinion whether we should take him at #3 or not. I was just doing a bit of Mathes to highlight how crap our Scully compo could end up being.

We should just thank god that BP is no longer around as he would definitely pass on Viney for a skinny classy mid instead.

You're as good at maths as you are at spelling it!

Whilst I totally agree with the crux of your argument about the 'welfare mentality', I really don't think that posters who want JV in the second round or don't think we should pick him at 3 unless we actually value him third best (or better) in the draft are necessarily exhibiting this mentality.

If he is not rated top 3, and we are forced to pick him there because another team is able to use of the vagaries of the father-son system against us, then what some have said here is true; we are going to be the first team ever to be disadvantaged by our own father-son pick in the draft! Fact! (and I'm not talking about what JV might end up being. Nobody knows that for sure. I'm saying, if he is rated 5 - 8 now (hypothetical, I know, but a reasonably accurate interpretation of everything that's been written about him by those who should know) and we pick him at 3, we are paying slightly overs). The fact that we would be paying slightly overs for a player that, historically speaking and by the nature and intention of the rule under which we are getting him, we should be getting at unders, is just further salt in the wound. No welfare mentality there. Just a legitimate gripe!

Even in this very same draft, another team is paying well-unders for a future father-son gun (Daniher). Imagine if the Bombers finished last and were forced to take him at pick 1, when he is generally rated around pick 2-5. They would be having the same conversation on BomberBlitz. They'd be livid that they aren't getting him in the second round. And I don't think anyone is suggesting that the have a welfare mentality over there.

I can see where you're coming from and respect your opinion but your central argument, I feel, further illustrates my point. The concern that "we are going to be the first team ever to be disadvantaged by our own father-son pick in the draft! Fact!" is indicative of our "poor bugger us" mindset. (What's your opinion on Ace Cordy?) The father son rule is relatively new to a very old game and the way I look at it a situation like this way always going to happen, of course it was, I just struggle to tolerate the some posters devastation that it has happened to us. The fact that some are unwilling to take him because we 'have to pay a little bit overs' is pathetic. This is a game and in games you play by the rules. I think it's great that we have access to JV and that we can trump other clubs if we want to.

You got it wrong here. Our compensation is pick #4 and pick#13

If other rules cause us to have to us our first rounder pick #3 then we are down 1 pick. So theoretically our compensation for scully will just be pick #13.

Lose pick #1, get pick #13.

Not fair imho

You've missed my point...

I am not making a direct correlation between the Scully pick and Jack. I am using the Scully compensation as an example of the abundant opportunities we have been afforded to improve.

It seems to me that some Melbourne supporters have kind of slipped into a welfare mentality where we think we haven't been afforded enough by the system. We want it all but don't want to have to pay for it.

We have been massively overcompensated for Scully, something which we all acknowledge. We've had priority picks and bail outs by the AFL but it's still not enough. Obviously we all hope we can snag young Jack in the second round, but suggestions that we should not take the bloke simply because we have to pay about what his worth is just indicative of the handout mentality we have fallen into.

If you'd told me at the start of the year thy we were going to have the picks we have now I would have laughed at you. Even after all of our failed recruiting and our questionable culture we have an opportunity to capitalise on ANOTHER draft.

We have the opportunity to draft a heart and soul player. The son of a Demon great. We know better than anyone that there are no guarantees come draft time. Viney is the surest thing we've had come our way in a decade and the idea that some people want a bargain more than they want this animal on our side is unfathomable.

Pay up people, I'm going to love watching this bloke play footy and I reckon you are too. Especially alongside his fellow draftees who are bought in under a new regime destined to take this side away from the dark place where we have resided for far too long.

Further suggestion today in the Herald-Sun club by club trade whispers update that Cook has 'quit'. Seems to me that it is just carrying on the rumor from Jay Clark the week prior.

I havent..I think you might be. That you have a low base of fitness REQUIRES you to work harder. Seems the Gys didnt. ......next

Bub I reckon he had a low base of fitness due to his 2011 injuries.

Gysberts won't go, you'll all eat your words and apologise for all the uninformed opinions you offered and the rumors you surcumed too.

yep...fancy giving currency to that

Yeah but being lazy and being asked to work harder from a low base of fitness are two different things. It's plain stupid to confuse the two.

Even the assertions on here that suggest Gysberts is lazy is rumor. There are no facts supporting this other than opinions formed on coaches comments thy he has to work harder.

Is there a link to this information?

I doubt we'll offload Gysberts, this is just rumor until something comes from the club. Same can be said for the Cook rumors.

Hold tight, we're all so desperate for details of the clean out we're just getting a bit ahead of ourselves.

Mods I demand Curry & Beer's account is suspended immediately for the longest time allowed for his/hers disgraceful comments above. Inciting violence against an individual is illegal, not just here either you hero.

Recently in Adelaide Liam has been in contact with Dean Bailey, whom he shares a good relationship with. It was suggested to me that this is where he will be playing next year.