Dees2014

If you post things without proper thought and consideration, you can be expected to be taken up about it. Isn't that what discussion debate should be at least partially about?What I object to on here is it is not always civil, and I think there is no excuse for that. Or there shouldn't be.

WJ, I think you will be able to get them on iview, even if they are not replayed in Victoria, I think on ABC2. Hopefully, the fact of the comeback indicates a change in attitude and he has now got his mind right. A mentally and physically fit LM I'd rookie in a heart beat. Any chance Wonna could be persuaded to do the same? A fit and firing Wonnamiri would certainly solve our small forward challenges. I think the loss of these two was the start of the Bailey era decline. If Roos could get them up and firing, it would make things very interesting. Just imagine a fit LM as the FOURTH tall forward. His ground skills are such too that he can play like a small as well of course. He and his little mate Wonna would be quite something in that forward line. We can only dream!

I agree. It is just the start of the pre-season after all. It was no doubt a reality check for everyone. What matters, is where they go from here. I have no doubt improvement will be rapid, hopefully across the board.

Yes I have been favoring Lennon on here, but I think I have been persuaded by a few entries from here that there are too many downsides to him. I must say Billings sounds ideal, and a perfect foil for Jones, Tyson, & Viney.

He could also provide the mantra for this site. What a player!!!

Interesting stats DD. Are they for all time or just last season? Ifthey were all time I would very much suspect Jamar got nothing like those numbers in the last couple of years. Also, Gawn is maturing, and has been injured too often for comfort (a bit like Sandilands - I think it might go with the territory for the really tall). He will really have to improve this year if he stays injury free, to be fair he had a couple of good games last season and was absolutely dominant in several games at Casey as well. The Master's subsequent entry about the five week stretch between rounds 14 & 18 last year would tend to suggest Max is just about there already, particular considering he is yet to complete a full pre-season, and what I saw today is that he is up for it, with Roos setting up a very healthy rivalry between Max, Spencer and Fitz. Maxy is a monster, and a fully fit and firing Maxy Gawn would be a huge plus for us this year. I must say though I think for the future Gawn has more potential than any of them. I guess it will come down to whether Roos sees the best way to get Maxy up to his potential is to have him dominate at Casey every week or give him game time in the MFC. Up to Max I suspect in as much as how fast is he prepared to improve, and how quickly will he become fully fit. Clearly we need to be competitive every week, and that at least may mean we play Jamar in the short term.

I think we are now in a very different situation. If we get the ball forward of the centre we now have three, possibly four targets (Clark, Hogan, Dawes, Howe) at which to aim. An opposition's nightmare I would have thought. Also though illustrates our urgent need for a quality small forward. In the short term Bynes maybe, turn Bleese into a quick crumber (although I suspect he will be more effective as a running attacking half back - if he can get his defensive game in order), or even better pick Garlett up in the draft. Whichever way we go it will be like the days we had Neitz, Schwarter, and Gary Lyon up forward when we often played in finals. Exciting times.

i agree

Oh thanks for that. I have been on the internet in one form or another since the 1990's in various parts of the world, so i think i can outlast a self-important individual on here. It would be nice though to debate the issues. I live in hope.

Well from what i saw today i think he has come back in top condition, along with his running mates the two jacks and Nicho. They were very impressive, and before anyone accuses me of "training the house down" comments, all i am prepared to say at this stage that those who have come back fit and ready to train hard should get recognition. It does NOT mean they are going to be world beaters necessarily, but it is a good start, and one I'm sure Roos will be observing very closely.

I'm not questioning his commitment, more his ability. Oh yes, and dry retching could mean he did not put the work in over the break and the workloan found him out today. I was surprised how taxing Misson and Roos made it today. Certainly far more for the first session than either Bailey or Neeld.

Well i really really hope so.

I find it really interesting on this site that if there is disagreement that the "go to" stance is personal abuse, rather than debate or argument based on information. I am quite prepared to admit i am wrong, but be buggered if i am going to yield to someone who has no better argument than, what did you say again, "twaddle". Congratulations on you sophisticated analysis

I would be staggered too. If i hadn't have seen it with my own eyes i would not have believed it. For us to progress we need to be elite - in every way. This time of year is very revealing in a lot of ways. That is all i am saying. I trust Roos to get this all right. He has the full knowledge. Everything else is simply observation.

I saw it too. Once....

The nature of his injury. It seems chronic. I was surprised he was out there at all frankly. All power to him, i do not mean to malign him in any way. I think from the little we have seen of him he is an admirable character and a great footballer if we can get him on the park. Also best to take the time needed to get it right. I was surprised i guess at how little progress he had made since the time i observed him light training at the end of last year.

Neither Clisby or M Jones were ever listed to have surgeries as far as i know, nor were they discussed as having injuries. You may know more than me. I also heard some interplay which was a concern about attitude, but i don't want to expand on here this early in the season I might be being unfair but i suspect not.

Oh i would hope so. Of the injured group today, you would expect Tyson, Hogan, Viney and Michie to be there, and maybe Dawes I suspect though we will see Clark mid year at the earliest.

I completely agree, and judging from how seriously Roos was treating it, so does he. At this stage of the year, it is mostly about attitude, and for M Jones and Clisby to return so thoroughly unfit as they appeared to be, I'm sure will not have impressed Roos at all. Big Max (and yes i am a big fan) will also have to improve rapidly if he is not going to to be overtaken by Spencer in the near term.

Another thing i should add is that all four television networks had full crews there with individual reporters, plus AFL TV. It says a lot about the power of the Roos brand. I could also point out the wide media coverage Roos recent interviews have had. I think we are getting there about being taken seriously again, and the AFL establishment are perhaps waking up that we are a coming force.

I didn't mean to reflect badly on Clark. He is injured, as you could see by watching how gingerly he ran, and was not involved in any physical stuff at all. He also did the last 300m run through with the Gawn/Fitzy group and was about 150m behind by the end. He has a long way to go, but i think we all knew that (or at least suspected it)

Sorry, i did this in my I phone in the car - not easy to Edit. Yes Tyson was in the injured group. See my second post.

No it is purely my highly unscientific assessment based on observing all ten run-throughs. It did though give quite a public assessment of progress, albeit incredibly early in the year. My guess though is that Roos will take a lot of notice about how fit these guys are when they return. He was very much involved in the process, and i think he will read it as a good indicator about attitude etc. I think my highlight was that our leaders of last year, the two Jacks, look very fit and Jack T looks to have his running ability back. At his top he is of course an elite runner (like his sister who is an olympic marathon rep). The early signs are good for JT, and if we can get him back to his debut year form we will of course have an a-grader pick 2 to go with Dom Tyson. Talking of Tyson, i was standing right next to the to the ball work of that group, where the trainer was kicking to them stab passes from about 15 metres and they were required to make them and then handpass. Tyson has amazing reflexes, quickest hands i have seen. The other guys who looked to have return very fit were Tom McDonald and Jimmy Toumpas. TD won all the runs in his group, and Jimmy Toumpas compared to last year more than held his own. I expect big years from both of them.

Just back from training. Started about 9.30 with warmups. Was an injured group who mostly did handball and light running at half pace, short distances.Tthey were; Hogan Viney Tapscott michie (I think) Tyson Not at training; Jamar N jones Garland Frawley Vince Watts Dawes After kick to kick the main group broke into three groups of four or five and did about ten 300 m run throughs at top pace. It gave a very good indication of their condition early in pre season. Here are the groups with an overall score out of ten. Roos personally timed each run through and seemed to be discussing every detail with Misson Howe 8 Grime 8 Nicho 8 Trengove 8 McDonald 8 Toumpas 8 Clisby 3 m jones 3 Spence 8 Maxy. 5 Fitzy 7 Terlich 6 Clark not fit and only did light laps. Does not look at all fit. Issues of note: Trengove and Toumpas look significantly fitter than last year. Spencer is we ahead of Gawn on current fitness. Max has a lot to make up.

Dons, Eagles, GCS, Tigers, Crows, Blues maybe even Pies. We will be much more competitive than you say.