Slartibartfast

Yep, I agree. Enough on this issue everyone, your points have been made. Discuss the footy and leave personal comments alone. Thanks

Morton's fitness and ability to run has always been elite. He ran 15+ beeps prior to being drafted. Scully, Jones, Trengove and Morton are all elite runners and I think Grimes is not far behind. Will make it very hard for opposition clubs in years to come...

Blease ran laps and worked with the rehab group. He's yet to join normal training.

When you've worked it out can you let me know?? I couldn't do it on the old site so I'll never work it out here!! Good job Andy (and Nasher?), fantastic effort.

I don't think Garland was involved in any of the drill that I saw.

Neither did anyone but BP. Praising BP now is premature. We are basking in the Trengove/Scully double but it's quite possible that Martin, Morabito and Butcher end up being more valuable footballers. Watts may still be a bust. I don't think either of these scenarios are likely but they are possible. Teams, as I'm sure you know, require elite players who generally come from the early picks (something CAC didn't have post TJ) but they also require good players from down the draft. Geelong have Chapman, Enright, Rooke, Johnson and Ling. Saints have Montagna, Milne, Gilbert, Baker and Fisher. Good teams have later picks that excel when measured against their draft selection. Of course recruiting managers are measured against all picks but the good ones find the gems late in the draft as well as getting the early picks right. At this stage BP cannot be judged. And Grant, how many successful clubs haven't bottomed out or received some unique advantage over the other teams. I can think of one and perhaps two. IMO there is no team that has won a flag in the last 6 or 7 years who hasn't had a lot of early picks or some advantage. Some have had both. Your measuring stick is flawed.

Open. We support healthy debate, that's why the site exists, but if you have a clear disagreement with someone please recognize it, have your say and move on. Thanks everyone, Fan

I'm going to lock this thread for a while and let everyone relax a little. I'll reopen it and hopefully we can avoid a slanging match. If anyone (that has been involved) feels that they have not had an adequate chance to say what they want to let me know. I'll reopen it tomorrow. Thanks Fan

Shame really, it's the best post of some very good ones and if there is one to read to summarize the thread, this is the one.

Good stuff Old, that's a very good start I would have thought although I would argue you'd have to take into account the "role" that someone plays. Mids v KPP v Rucks v Flankers v Taggers. There must be a "rarity" factor in there and there must be some sort of "value" factor. All I'm really trying to point out is that I think the well worn phrase "best available" is a crock of rot because you can't compare the different roles. Whether it is formal or otherwise there is a matrix that leads the Barry Prendergast's of this world to call out a players name. Anyone heard of "Moneyball"?

So, Barry Prendergast is sitting at the National Draft with pick 11 and looks at his options. There is a midfielder there he is 95% confident will play 100+ games of AFL football and who has good skills. Then there is a KPF who he is 50% confident will play 100+ games of AFL football but who has known faults. At pick 18 he thinks there will be a midfielder who is 60% sure of playing 100+ games and a KPF who he thinks is 40% sure of playing 100+ games, but of course he can't be certain. Nobody argues we don't need a KPF but in this circumstance who do you pick?

Beautifully put. End of argument I would have thought. By the way, when comparing a key position forward and a midfielder how do you determine "best available"? What do you take into account in your judgement?

I guess they have the provisional draw. DB gave a speech but it didn't contain any new news. CC spoke briefly but again nothing much of note.

Yes it was. On a pro rata basis he beats Davey. Beamer did make the comment but without the swear word. It was very well received. Of the 2009 list Brock, Buckley and Trent Zomer didn't attend. Shane Valenti was there. Each of Wheater's, Robbo and Matty Whelan made a speech. Wheels was first up and was short and sharp. Paul Wheatley gave the most impressive speech of the night and whilst the delivery was not Obama like the content was absolutely outstanding. He is clearly a club man, highly respected and admired. His speech included the comment "I would have loved to go on and play next year but I realise that given where the club is it would be wrong of me to take the place of a young player." He is an outstanding young man. Robbo's speech followed and was typical Robbo. He clearly feels aggrieved about being delisted. He could have learned something from Wheaters. The other speech of note on the night was Colin Sylvia. Genuine thanks to the club for supporting him, clearly implied he had underperformed and seems ready to realize his talents. In excess of $60,000 raised for the club as well with 9 people paying $6,000 to join the team when it visits Adelaide next year and be included in "everything". About another 25 who pledged $500 each to support a rookie, it could have been more, I'm not sure of the number. A good night, very positive and some genuine excitement about next year.

Fellas back to the topic please. Thanks.

Well technically he is contracted but his contract finishes on 31st October when he will become uncontracted if he hasn't signed with another club.

OK, I missed Demonland's post. Sorry guys. My initial intention was to make this for confirmed trades but I've been overruled by the boss!! Post away.

Guys I'm just going to delete "discussion". Thanks

How about we leave this thread to confirmed trades and discussion can be in separate threads?

I thought we won?

Thanks Hannabal.

Have you seen him play live?

I can't comment, I haven't seen him play live.

Thanks for the advice Pit but I'll not judge a player on one incident in one game, that is for mugs. I'll look at the whole year and what he's achieved. I'll not restate his achievements but he can clearly play. BTW, what do you think of Rivers? Just take a look at the fumble in the square against Richmond in the last quarter. That did cost us the game.

---- Ok. Of COURSE we can learn from our competition. But no more than any other club. I think you learn from the successful clubs and not the unsuccessful clubs. That said, there are things to learn everywhere, not only what went right but what went wrong? For example, look at drafting 2004 Richmond v Hawks. Apply that to Melbourne drafting 2009 - it's not that easy. Also what have Sydney and Saints got in common that allows them to get their players on the park? How have Collingwood got a lot of recalcitrants playing eg Dick. ---- So why are you looking here? No-one on here, not even Hannibal, can help you with that. Because there are some great posters here who present ideas I've not thought of - that's how I learn. Hannibal ( thought it was Hannabal) has taught me a lot; Axis of Bob talks about things in ways that enlighten, WJ has a different slant on things, Grazman is quality. But we all support the same team and are subject to a level of groupthink (although Hannibal will deny he is!!) so even some lesser posters from opposition teams can be interesting. I thought OX might be one. I was wrong so I move on. Oh, and DD - I agree, your response was too long!!