Akum

I see your point, they're definitely not bargains. But I think they're still pretty solid as individual trades - HH for 6 & then 24 for Howe do pinch a bit. If we could then get, say, Hrovat (not Melksham) for 24, we've given our midfield a major boost for the next few years.

Just wanted to bump this from a few pages back for those who might have missed it, because it's such a good solid proposal. It's a genuine win-win-win - all 3 clubs get what they want, while giving up something that they are either gonna lose anyway (Dixon, Howe) or can live without in order to get a bigger prize (Hartlett, and to some degree Howe). * We get Hartlett & ND24 and lose Howe & ND6. * Port get Dixon & lose Hartlett. * GCS get Howe & ND6 and lose Dixon & ND24. And I'm assuming that as Prestia is said to be "seeing out his contract", we'll pick him up next year not this year.

Do you mean in view of the fact that Roos was initially prepared to sign on for 2 years but then agreed to the third? (at a time when we didn't have a potential successor on board) In other words, that it was probably the original intention that he would hand over earlier than 2017, provided that we had somebody reasonable to hand over to? None of this is a surprise; I think that both Roos & MFC have both been pretty open about that's how they expect things to pan out. There's nothing clandestine, surely. Did anybody really expect that Roos would coach until the end of 2016 before handing over? If anything, it's a massive vote of confidence in Goody from Roos that he feels that he's at the standard where he can begin to take more of the responsibilities, especially in instituting what King refers to as "modern football".

If I were Prestia, and if I was considering leaving a team that was likely to be very competitive for several years (allowing that their current problems are temporary & will be sorted out), I'd need to be sure that the team I was going to was also likely to be very competitive.And if I was thinking about coming to MFC, I would have cooled a lot on this over our last 6-8 games, and I'd want to see signs of major improvement next year. No way I'd want to come to a club whose midfield might struggle (because they don't combine well) for the rest of my career. I reckon it's all up to us to improve out of sight next year. If we do, we've got him. And fair enough.

Not more Tom Gillies?

When a journo uses the phrase "to be honest" ... You just know the shite's gonna come thick & fast.

Hawks pathetic. Proves that ... (1) The best players in the best teams look pathetic when they're continually under pressure. Like we are every game. (2) The best players in the best teams look pathetic when they're being ritually disembowelled by the umpires. Like we are every game. Don't know how Wc do it. Those sniping high tackles and they're still getting an armchair ride from the umps. Clearly the AFL-approved premiers IMHO.

What about a swap of No.1 picks - Watts for Kruezer (who still hasn't signed with Blues)? It couldn't be a trade because Kruezer's an RFA and the Blues will get pick ND2 for him to get both Weitering & Schache.

Roos is a great builder - a team builder, a list builder, and a club builder. He has great intelligence and integrity, and above all, leadership quality. There is no doubt that he & PJ have done an outstanding job in building the club. His list building has been sensational so far, and no doubt will be extended over the next few months. The team building has been solid in that he's given us a team structure that, when we can maintain it, we are actually very hard to beat. But this structure has been pulled apart too easily by too many other sides through careful planning & strategy, which we haven't been able to counter. Roos' preference is to let the players work it out, and while that worked great for the Swans team from 2005 to 2010 (and after), it hasn't had the same impact with this team in 2015. It's now an ideal time for someone to step in who's a "modern" (for want of a better word) coach. A "modern" coach has usually had intensive formal study of every element of the game, including strategy & tactics, and has had an apprenticeship of several years as part of a strong coaching panel with successful clubs in whom they've had an influential aspect is some way, before they take over a team that's lower on the ladder but which shows promise. Roos, in fact, had none of these. He was drafted in as interim coach when Eade was sacked, and did so well that at the end of the year, the players forced the club to renege on the deal they'd made with Wallace. The Swans' strategy was pretty straightforward, but they had a great team with great leaders and that's all they needed. It's worth considering that apart from Roos, there are only 3 senior coaches in 2010 when Roos retired who are still coaching now - Clarko & Lyon (who are outstanding innovators who have the ability to reinvent themselves and their teams) and good ol' Rocket. All the other 14 teams have "modern" coaches who have all come in over the past 5 years. There's been a generational change. Over the past two years we've needed, above all else, Roos' leadership, and his building of our team, our list & our club. We'll need him to continue all this next year. But it's now time for a "modern" coach to counter the plans & strategies by which our structure has been pulled apart, or maybe to give us a "game plan" that will hold together under pressure no matter how hard the other side tries to pull it apart. I hope to God that Goody's the guy - though there's every reason to believe that he is. I think the timing is perfect. The thing I most admire about Roos is that while he knows what he's the best at, he also knows his limitations. He's not the egomaniac control freak who has to have a hand in everything. He's big on bringing others forward where he's lacking, and he's big on succession planning. Like only the greatest of leaders.

The best part about Watts being traded is that there'd be no more threads like this.

So out of the 27 blokes you've named, we're cutting between 13 & 17 of them (depending on the strength of that "maybe", and whether or not you'd cut Howe). Why so restrained? You're losing your edge.

This is the only reason I can think of for this decision. It's not as if the factors that Cross brings to the team are speed and elite disposal which he's now lost. We brought him to the club for his professionalism, his application, his leadership, his willingness to have a go no matter what, and his ability to do the jobs that are asked of him, no matter how tough they are. These factors certainly haven't diminished in his game. It's not as if someone else has stepped up in the professionalism-leadership-toughness area as the season has progressed. And without Cross we'll be severely deficient in these factors when next season starts. Somebody said a few posts ago that he got shown up against Harvey's pace. The fact that Roos had to resort to such a horrible mismatch against someone who could so easily exploit his well-known limitations such as Harvey makes it glaringly obvious that there was nobody better on our list that he could turn to. Roos knew that those on our list who are a far better physical match for the likes of Harvey would have done far worse. And that's what bothers me. Next year we still won't have anyone better to do the tough jobs. And we'll still get run off our feet by well-drilled ordinary teams like Norf.

We know how the 'script goes from here on.

I think it's more than this. We want to play in a certain way. But it's all too easy for the opposition to stop us playing in the way we want to. So what do we do then? That's when we've got NFI. Nobody knows what to do. We're perplexed. It's like being trapped up in a spider's web - the harder you struggle, the tighter it gets. We're easy to tie up. And at the moment, once we're tied up, we're stuffed.

Now if you're suggesting that we all meet up there for a celebration to pay tribute to long-suffering supporters, & deliberately pay no attention to whatever's happening on the grass in the middle ... Maybe we could enact all kinds of ritual humiliations, flo.ggings and so forth. Get it out of our system.

Another of the many tragic outcomes of this game.

Maybe that's not a bad idea. Solid way to send a message. If the players don't show up against Freo, the supporters don't show up against GWS.

More like bubonic plague.

Yeah, why stop at 12? HH being unusually restrained.

He's already been through that with Neeld. Though Ramsay is probably more of a thinker than Neeld.

Come on people! He didn't jump, he was pushed.

The other factor is that because our best is better, other sides take us much more seriously. They don't want to risk just turning up expecting to win and they now actually take the trouble to plan very hard against us. That's why we get jumped in the first quarter - the opposition has made plans and they catch us on the hop. Dogs, North, Saints outstanding examples.

Interesting. There's a difference between "chose to resign" and "agreed to resign" though.

Must have been a massive settlement for him to agree to go quietly. If he's been pushed against his will, we wait for the mushroom cloud!

Hate to say it, but I'm not surprised one little bit. Teams are now planning how to beat us Earlier in the season they didn't bother, and we grabbed a few wins. Last time we succeeded in tying up their running game. This time, they took the trouble to work out how we did it, they expected we'd try the same tactics again (which we obligingly did) and they worked out how to nullify our few strengths. And even more obligingly, we made no changes until half time, got on top, and then went back to where we were.