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Didn't achieve them but looks like they will keep him on. Having said that - I am not certain. I couldn't give a flying about Hawthorn's list management so I haven't studied it closely.

I can certainly see Matthews living up to the italicised bit. The AFL just wants everyone to move on, and he wants the best outcome for his club. Ken Wood is the one who got them to put the money in the cap, and he would be one of the few I trust at the AFL to do what is right, and not what is right for the AFL. I cannot see Wood changing his ruling or altering his findings. But good on Matthews for annoying head office.

Agree with you but he is at the Hun. Edit: Read the post wrong, apologies.

He is a very good writer IMO. He is Hemingway compared to Stevens, Robinsion, et al... Don't know what he is going to do with himself if this is true...

This is a hypothetical, how it is on our best interests, because no one at the club played along with any charade. We didn't acquiesce or become obsequious to our own failure. It would be pathetic and the end of the Jim Stynes administration - I wouldn't bat an eye-lid as they all get pushed out.

This is how I feel, I don't like supporters spouting nonsense about the MFC's involvement in this. If we acted that way I would be the first calling for all positions to be spilled and re-filled.

Freddie Clutterbuck? On that name alone, he will not get anywhere in professional sports... Really sorry kid. Steele Sidebottom broke the glass ceiling but Freddie Clutterbuck is a bridge too far...

If that is all you are saying then fine, what I am saying is that you cannot then make the leap to say we were aware of this farce as it was unfolding - that we knew of the things that were happening behind the scenes. That is the BS.

I don't think you are following what I am saying. WYL is referencing Jimmy's assertion. The bolded part of your post - I agree with it. But there are some on here that think we played along with this farce and knew ahead of time but didn't blow the lid for fear of AFL recriminations or something along those lines...That's the BS.

You go to Jimmy and you tell him that you think he and Cam and the rest of the motley crue not only had knowledge of this farce but that we actively participated in a charade that played with our club adn our fans. What kind of reception do you think that would get?

You want 'projects'... Watts, Blease, Gysberts, Bennell, Jetta, Morton, Gawn, Fitzpatrick, and Sylvia (still qualifies [face palm]) are all players that have shown the requirement of special 'encouragement,' a large amount of time, and the ignorance of a lack of application and or fierceness at the footy. We have got plenty of projects...

Crawford, Sewell, Hodge, Mitchell. With Lewis and Ellis. Dal Santo, Montagna, Goddard, Hayes. With Ball and Baker.

Held to account? Who is left? Schwab and the board are the only ones who survived The Great Admin Issues at the Demons 2011. As an aside, I hope you are not implying, once again, that the MFC was complicit with The Great Conspiracy? I refuse to believe that Cam Schwab or CC would be involved in any BS. And I am sure I would told to 'f... off' if I asked them if they were involved in any BS. The MFC doesn't do that.

Yes, and I hardly see the positives in having your 12th best player so close in ability to your 30th... That doesn't scream to me "competition for places," it screams "we only have 11 good players."

I have condemned and admonished a wide range of actors in this machiavellian play; The Expansion Rules are shambolic and self-defeating as they are intended to get the clubs to win a handful of games in the first few years - GWS will not get near a win in the first season. Graeme Allan is a shifty and unethical disappointment to modern social mores. Andrew Demetriou is floundering and drowning in his own hubris and inability to reflect on his words and the negative effect of his administration on the AFL. But I am also going to mention the Melbourne Football Club in the causal chain of this mess. We had a tough 2011 and we were not an attractive place to stay at. That is not to say that HWFUA and his father made the wrong decision and made it in such a way that it lacked moral fortitude and character but we still played our role in this mess. But we move on, don't we? We have a 200cm CHF we would not have had if 2011 didn't occur the way it did and we have an impressive coaching group that would not be there if 2011 didn't occur the way it did. C'est la vie.

Can we please stop infering how fortunate enough we are to have 'good depth'? The internet is visibly cringing.

Wait, what? HWFUA is to blame for our other issues? Well, here we go. Sweep all your problems to the door of the Dishonest Simpletons and we all sleep well at night... A whole confuence of events occurred that led us to losing a talented young player. But let's not kid ourselves that we didn't play a role in that. And I am not alluding to the nonsense that we played a part in some grand charade, I am talking about the fact that we had enormous issues within the club that led us to ask Garry Lyon for some direction and assistance. Those issues, plus the AFL's desire for expansion, plus $2m, plus a lack of moral backbone of one Punxsutawney Phil, and the naivete and lack of character of a young fool led us to the situation we found ourselves in. The conspiracy is great copy - it's a good read. But let's not let ourselves off the hook by blaming The Grand Conspiracy on all our troubles...

You are such a racist! Actually, pointing out someone likes players with funny names is more like Namism... And that is damning. Or is it Van Dammeing? No, just damning...

Yeah, get all that but LJ hasn't pulled his finger out but can still kick 40 goals in the AFL... That's more than 'showing glimpses.'

We are ekeing every last bit out of the HWFUA (i like it DC) Saga... We lost a talented player because of our issues, the poor character of a family and kid, and the lax rules that surrounds the expansion clubs recruiting. Not some overblown conspiracy borne out of our tanking. We need no punishment for something that Hawthorn and Collingwood got a flag out of and Carlton got Judd out of. Our issues left us bereft of any chance to keep someone whose father was pushing out the door, but those issues led us to getting a strong former captain to give us a rudder and an impressive coaching setup and the chance to grab a tall forward that we have been crying out for. Stop searching for excuses, face the fact that we lost someone and realize that we might just be better off for the Saga.

We are ekeing every last bit out of the HWFUA (i like it DC) Saga... We lost a talented player because of our issues, the poor character of a family and kid, and the lax rules that surrounds the expansion clubs recruiting. Not some overblown conspiracy borne out of our tanking. We need no punishment for something that Hawthorn and Collingwood got a flag out of and Carlton got Judd out of. Our issues left us bereft

FCS people - Neeld has said Sellar is expected to challenge for the team, he is not assured of a spot. What would he say about a 22 year old just drafted by the club?

DC - being told not to go near TJ and telling someone 'on' him to find the footy are not the same thing, but they get you the same result. Players don't tank.

We give Sellar a AFL lifeline and some people think he will be CHB and others think he will CHF... The guy should be looking to be apart of the team but let's not kid ourselves - he has a long way to go to be anything more than depth. Batram Frawley Rivers Nicholson Garland Grimes Bail Trengove Sylvia Watts Clark Howe Green Jurrah Martin Jamar, Moloney, McKenzie Bate Jones Davey Blease

So we pick up a bloke at 54 who has been around for 5 years for 21 games and he is a better CHB than Garland? We are throwing him a lifeline and maybe he can force his way into the team but let's not go nuts here.