Lord Neville X Flash

17 hours ago, Uncle Fester said:

Rather roll the dice on a cheap Bennell then an over priced Martin or a DH like Murray - tho a cheap Murray might be worth a roll too

You've got your head in the sand if you think AFL players don't do drugs, including Melbourne players (jack watts for example). Murray just got caught

1 minute ago, demonstone said:

Papley's not that special!  I think people are vastly over rating him.

I disagree. He's hard as nails, fast, tackles, never fumbles, good kick inside 50, and kick goals. Plus he's under 24. A poor mans brent harvey for mine. 

1 minute ago, Choko said:

Not at $800K/year though

Agreed, his price may be an issue. However, if there is a will there is usually a way, i.e. beams & collingwood last year

pick 8 for papley, maybe a 3rd/4th rounder back?

Has there been any acknowledgement in the media that GWS want pick 3, or is this isolated to demonland?

I feel like this scenario, if true, should be obvious to people in the business; but i have not heard anyone mention Green or a gws/melb pick swap. 

what do we do if we get 6 and 11?

i would happily give up one of these for Papley 

I think we need class up front, of any size. As we have seen in previous years collingwood, richmond (2017) and west coast have been contending with different mixes of forward sizes. 

I think Harmes could be moved to play a large percentage up forward. Hes got good size, and would give us great ground level presence, plus loves a goal. This would free up a spot in the middle for Gus, whose form dipped when moved to a wing. 

I think we also need to pray that Fritsch, Trac and Weid take the next step. Only time will tell. 

If he can get 23-27 touches a game, he is a great chance for AA ($51 on SB). One of only 3 AFL players rated as 'elite' in disposal efficiency in 2018. Potential emulate Laird, Simpson, a better Brent Guerra even?

I've huge hopes for the kid

1 hour ago, rjay said:

Mahoney doesn't seem like the type to waste his time on pointless games.

We could have played harder at the trade table & had an unhappy Hogan with us next season.

As you say winning a flag is hard, too hard to be carrying a kid who is going through a lot & doesn't want to be there. I'm not sure he is very clear on what he wants but that's for Ross to sort out now.

As an aside, it's going to be interesting to see how Geelong go with Tim Kelly. They played it hard & the coach even called him out as being as a Scully. I have a feeling that it might all end in tears.

I would have liked melbourne to have negotiated harder, and then accept 5 & 23 in the last minute if that was the best offer. Anyway, it's hard to know what the circumstance were behind closed doors. 

Like i said, we did okay, a par. But we didn't dominate the trade period like essedon last year, or freo and hawthorn this year.

9 minutes ago, rjay said:

I don't buy this line of argument...I've seen it posted by a few people on here and it just doesn't hold up.

Whether Mahoney spoke the words or not the hand was sitting on the table for all to see.

Even "Blind Freddie" could see that the Hogan & May deals were intertwined.

You think Freo couldn't see it?

If we had publicly stated that we were trying to get May without selling hogan, or at least made no comment the narrative around the situation would have been very different. Would freo have bought it? Who knows. But surely worth a try imo.

Winning a flag is that hard, we need to maximise every area of the club, including dealing hard at the trade table. 

7 hours ago, mauriesy said:

I don't think trading players futures and livelihoods is like some poker hand that you leave concealed with a straight face.

You do it in good faith to get the overall result you want. Jesse wanted to go home for strong personal reasons and we respected his needs and facilitated it. In return we got some advantageous picks that improved our side, and a good future trading reputation.

I don't care whether they were "overs" or "unders", I only care that we will be a better team in 2019 and beyond, given Jesse's circumstances.

It was also blindingly obvious what we needed to do to get May (i.e. a first round pick), given that other clubs were interested.

It is actually is exactly like poker. A list manger from another team refused to answer  question saying "I can't answer that as it will give away our hand" on traderadio. 

I think we did just okay, and to go around saying we had an amazing trade period is wrong. Jesse hogan was a "straight flush" and we got 5 & 23 for him. Like it or not hogan is worth more than that

17 minutes ago, Dippy said:

Yes hogan was traded for may and kk. They are all linked together. MFC wouldn't of traded hogan,  if may and kk wasn't coming back in. 

Hogan is only worth what someone is willing to buy for him. Nother else. 6 and 23 is very fair, for someone who doesn't want to be there anymore, and wants to go home. 

Mfc is very well this trade period. 

They were categorically two seperate trades. MFC did okay, Hawthorne and Fremantle did the best of all the clubs. 

Just now, ManDee said:

I give up.  Feel free to think we should have done better. Next time we could act tough like Dodoro and miss out on a player that wanted in.

Mate, your acting like i'm up in arms. Like, i said it's not the end of the world, and i don't know why Melbourne played their hand like they did.. maybe there was mitigating circumstances. If your so affronted by opposing opinions i recommend leaving Demonland.

3 minutes ago, ManDee said:

Really, can't you see the big picture? If we received pick 2 & 23 then 2 would go for May. You need to look at all outs v all ins. One hand of poker does not tell you the full story.

I can see the big picture, jesus. 

Just because we did well to get in May and KK doesn't mean we didn't let Hogan go cheap. 

In my opinion we showed our hand by admitting that we needed Hogan out to get May. Hogan was worth pick 5 & 14, and fremantle had those picks. We accepted pick 5 & 23, it's not the end of the world but it is unders.

4 minutes ago, ManDee said:

How do you figure that? Hogan out May & KK in. I think we are a better side = win. You have to look at the big picture. We would not have May & KK without trading Hogan. As Mahoney said.

Hogan was not a trade for May and KK. Hogan was worth more than pick 6 and 23, that part of the trade freo got the better deal. 

However, pick 6 for May and KK was a steal, and GC got unders. 

Everyone saying our team is better is underselling how special Hogan might turn out to be. But he wanted to go, and considering trauma he has been through, we had to let him go

We definetly lost the Hogan deal, but 6 for May and Kolo is a win. Once again GC are the ones who got truely shafted

I doubt we will get cerra, but I have connections to him and word is he would want to come home to Victoria 

Hopefully another team sweeps in and offers overs for May. 

Then we would not be so desperate to get Hogan out, and Freo would have to pay 5 and a future first rounder... Oh the look on Bell's face would be priceless 

27 minutes ago, EnterTheDragon said:

Interesting comment from a guy that called me a [censored] for saying similar a few pages back. 

How’s your Recruit Harley Bennell thread going? What a corker...

Actually I called you that for Insinuating racism to win an argument. Please reframe from quoting me

1 minute ago, Good Lord George said:

Isn't this the problem though? What are they thinking? We'll give a bloke 8 mil over 8 years but not pay the commensurate trade value? Hogan isn't a free agent, they have to give up something.

I'm not saying he's worth 2 early first rounders, but he's worth more than 11 and 23, and much closer to 5, 23 and 30. 

Yeah for sure, but maybe they think cumulative cost for Hogan Picks/Price/Years is too much. Maybe if Hogan's management agreed to 5 x 5 they would be happy to give 5, 23 and 30. But who knows

1 minute ago, Pates said:

“A Hogan trade is not dead in the water, but it appears Melbourne will have to buckle first”

Why the hell should we buckle? He’s the best young KPF to come on the market for years and we want proper compensation for him, plus he’s contracted. 

That plus the “smell a rat” line has just added bizarreness to an already weird trade discussion. 

He didn't say we should buckle, he just thinks that is the only way it will happen. 

1 minute ago, FlashInThePan said:

It’s hard to know where to begin. Firstly it is not a description off the trade taken from multiple angles, it is a press statement from Fremantle siting only their view of why they are behaving like idiots. Next it does not logically hold water, as others have mentioned, how did the deal get to club to club negotiations without them having an in principal agreement on the contract. That just doesn’t happen these days, before tings even progress to the club that holds the player the purchasing club and player have a deal in place. Next: 

The subst does Jesse’s contract length have to do with Melbourne, nothing we  

I read it as though Freo were not prepared to cough up that much money, that many years and those high picks. And therefore Freo called the negotiations off. And that they would offer Hogan the 8x8, but not give up the draft picks. 

I could very well be wrong, the article was ambiguous. Having thought about it more, it is a poorly written article, but that doesn't mean there is not a lot of truth in it. 

Just now, TeamPlayedFine39 said:

What today’s contract ‘revelation’ tells me is that Hogan is happy to stay at the Dees and in Melbourne, but has put to Freo that if they were to make him an obscenely good, too good to refuse offer, then he’d go.

Yeah, it's kinda looking like a positive for us. Maybe we will be able to extend his contract..

8 minutes ago, DTJ said:

Yeah for the most part I'm sure you're right - this latest piece by TM however is just indefensible. Have a read if you haven't already.

I don't really follow why the article was bad.

Freo wanted Hogan. Freo gave Bell a job. Bell felt hogan wasn't worth 5 & 23 if they also had to sign him for 8 x 8mill?

That seems logical to me. 8mill over 8 years is a risky deal to give anyone.