Deemania since 56

On 14/05/2024 at 16:50, whatwhat say what said:

no it wasn't; it was about an mfc premiership

six stars outta five!

Seven out of five ... it made you feel as if you were part of the Premiership team; Max really put you there.

5 hours ago, Demonland said:

In the space of a month Melbourne has gone from chocolates to boiled lollies in terms of its standing as a candidate for the AFL premiership. 

The club faces its moment of truth against a badly bruised up Collingwood at the MCG. A win will give it some respite but even then, it won’t be regarded particularly well being against an opponent carrying the burden of an injured playing list. A loss would be a disaster.

The Demons have gone from a six/two win/loss ratio and a strong percentage just south of 125 which placed them firmly in the top four after besting the previously unbeaten Cats to where they are now. At seven/five, a percentage barely over 100 and tenth on the ladder, a catastrophic fall from grace on the back of a scoreless opening term against Carlton, a woeful capitulation by 35 points to West Coast and last week’s 92-point drubbing by Fremantle. The only W in this period was against St Kilda.

Their opponent this week is not in such good shape either but not for reasons of poor form or a lack of enthusiasm but rather, because they have been decimated by a massive injury list. At Marvel Stadium on Friday night, they came out firing and full of enthusiasm to kick four of the first five goals to lead by 22 points before the Western Bulldogs reeled them in and ultimately dominated the final term scoring five goals to nothing.

If the Magpies had nothing to give in the last quarter of that match, then consider the Demons who gave nothing for all but the opening seven minutes of their game against the Dockers in Alice Springs!

As former Collingwood coach, Nathan Buckley, said after the game: top four teams “just don’t have a performance like” the Demons’ 92-point loss. “Plenty of sides have got players out at the moment and to only get 37 inside 50s against any opposition is a concern.”

Buckley believes there are lingering issues beneath the surface at Melbourne and there are some real questions to be asked. The fans have been asking those questions all week, but nobody has come up with any answers so the task of looking into the crystal ball has been made more difficult because of the lack of clarity coming from the Demon camp.

In the normal course of things, I would look at Collingwood and read missing names like De Goey, Mihocek, Cox, Pendlebury and Elliott and declare Melbourne past the post for a win by five goals. 

However, on current form (and if truth be known, there is no current form that you can trust in the context of this team), you would be justified in arguing that the firm of N & J Daicos could beat them on their own, such is the skill and brilliance of that duo. They never let their team down which, after some of the Demons’ dismal recent performances, you can’t say about any of them other than perhaps Max Gawn and possibly Christian Petracca and the skipper is carrying an enormous burden on his big shoulders at present.

The Magpies at least showed plenty of aggression and determination in their last up display which means that they should be able to open up a big enough lead on the Demons to hold off any fast finish that their slow starting opponents are capable of mounting.

Collingwood by 5 points.

THE GAME

Collingwood v Melbourne at the MCG, Monday 10 June 2024 at 3.20pm

HEAD TO HEAD 

Overall Collingwood 154 wins Melbourne 85 wins 5 drawn
At the MCG Collingwood 86 wins Melbourne 64 wins 3 drawn
Last five meetings Collingwood 4 wins Melbourne 1 win
The Coaches McCrae 3 wins Goodwin 1 win 

LAST TIME THEY MET

Collingwood 9.6.60 defeated Melbourne 7.11.53 at the MCG in the 2023 Qualifying Final

The Demons were jolted early in the 2023 Qualifying Final by the head high hit that ended Angus Brayshaw’s career and helped give the accurate Magpies a big enough start to fall in by 7 points despite a goalless final quarter. Many Melbourne fans argue that hit cost their team a flag and many others are still bemused about the fact that the perpetrator was free to play on in his team’s finals campaign including the winning grand final.

THE TEAMS (to be loaded when available)

COLLINGWOOD

MELBOURNE

Injury List: Round 13

Jacob van Rooyen — adductor / Test 
Marty Hore  — calf / 1 - 2 weeks
Josh Schache — foot / 1 - 2 weeks 
Jake Lever — knee / 2 - 3 weeks 
Jake Melksham  — knee / 2 - 4 weeks 
Lachie Hunter — calf / 4 - 6 weeks 
Charlie Spargo — Achilles / TBC

Onyer, Vines. Mongrel Man, you made us all proud - several times over the years, but this was the icing on the cake. I insist that Goodwin shows this to the boys pre-game, the entire incident. If our whole team stood up for each other like this, the flags are ours! No speeches, just silent vision of the moment. 

41 minutes ago, D Rev said:

Is it just me that can't see the name Frampton without thinking of Peter Frampton?

Do you feel like I do? Same thoughts...

3 hours ago, Demon17 said:

I'm with Nathan Buckley on this week.

Its not the result, and its not the opposition,.  Its all about the team showing heart and effort.

Was last week an aberration - maybe?

  A win won't fix anything because the pies will be so undermanned thus that will be the media commentary, . but that's not the point. 

Its how they go about the endeavour - yes I'm looking at you Bailey (for one)

These were some very good thoughts to take into account, and to address.

22 hours ago, Gawndy the Great said:

A side without Pendles, DeGoey, Elliot, Mitchell, Mihochek, Cox is significantly on the back foot. Any other week I would have penciled us in with an easy 6+goal victory. But alas, we are Melbourne, we seem to find incredibly innovative ways to screw things up. 

I really don’t know what to expect. I can firmly make a case that will see us finish bottom 4 and top 4 from here. Do we persist? I know the game plan change is making us look really bad. Is it the old adage of it’s the darkest hour just before dawn?

I am wondering, with this absentee list from the Filth, that just perhaps, the gods of eternal damnation are about to smile upon us for a win - for a change. A loss, on the other hand, is now almost certainly the sole responsibilities of the snot goblins (with peas in their whistles - also a change, for once). 

8 hours ago, gs77 said:

Taller than the door - good stuff 😀 

Good luck, Luker!

Nice pair of shoulders, too. Going to be tough the out-bump him, just like it is for those allocated to knock Tracca out of the footy focus. Now, take Luker out of Goodwin's grasp and boring field of influence ... put someone special into his immediate development, like Gawny, Tracca and/with Williams (in fact, call in Neita for specific one-on-ones against the world).

On 30/05/2024 at 22:27, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

I see shades of Cam Pedersen... 

Hope he can be a useful gap filler like Cam was over the few years up to '18

JvR out has me cringing thinking about Petty, BBB as 2nd ruck/fwd, Petty's been hopeless this year, BBB better for structure has 1 competitive effort this year only...

Do I recall correctly Peds playing starting ruck with Max out (??), and having a cracker. Regardless, I knew him as "clunker" as he was a decent clunk. Denfitinitely got the most out of his 193cm.

I miss Cam! 😢 

Cam was wonderful, so often, so 'needed' when the chips were down, so good at collecting unexpected marks and goals. I still dream that he is in the forward line when we are trailing miserably and need a red-hot poker insertion. 

1 hour ago, dazzledavey36 said:

A young hulking young key forward who likes the physicality side and his nickname is 'The Duck'

I think I'm going to love this kid even more..

 It will give us something the quack about, based on impressions so far. 

On 02/06/2024 at 21:41, spirit of norm smith said:

Hi all. 2 June 2024.  
Unbelievably after our 2021 premiership 🏆 and talk of a Demons Dynasty, the Dees have been smashed by Freo (by 92 points). Our 3rd loss in 4 weeks. We now sit 10th.  It was a humiliating loss. Beaten all over the ground. Zero winners.  Zero.  We looked slow and uncompetitive and incapable of successful transition of the footy. Our contested footy and stoppages are embarrassing.  Our forward line was led by two defenders trialling as forwards.  The loss comes two weeks after being beaten by 6 goals to cellar dweller Eagles.  Do we panic? Well we might.  But footy can be a simple game.  Simple.  We forget how sport can be over analyzed and players confident eroded by the lack of strategy and skill.  How do we respond ?  Here’s some easy thoughts from a humble 48 year supporter and former suburban footballer.  Memo to Goodwin. 
 

Step 1/STOP THE OVERHANDBALLING  Players are scared to kick it. We run it until it’s into trouble. Opponents are sweating on us to make the mistakes   It’s so predictable. Backline hardball mistakes are shockers. Easy goals. Players under zero pressure handball to players under pressure
 

Step 2/ KICKING.  AUSSIE RULES FOOTBALL. Note to all. skills skills and skills. When free, use you CORRECT kicking leg.  Lazy foot skills often on display and turnovers.  Our skills under zero pressure have desserted us.  It’s horrible.  
 

Step 3/  STOP LAZY PLAY   STOP SLOW & WIDE & BORING FOOTY   Scared footballers take easy 15 metres sideways kicks , even when running through the midfield 

MOVE THE BALL QUICKLY WITH INTENSITY  BE BRAVE NOT SCARED!! 

Step 4/ STOP TURNING BACKS AND FORWARDS INTO MIDS (RECRUIT MIDS) 

The engine room is so critical.   It all starts in the middle.   Real quality mids are the stars.   Even with a generation champion Ruckman, our mids are losing big time.  No more Riv or Kozzy experiments. We need them doing what they do best. Kozzy kicking goals   Riv being courageous and defending for his life 

Recruit mids.  We have enough backs and forwards- talls mediums smalls.  Why are trying to turn small forwards into mids. Stop It

 

 Step 5/  our Premiership defence.  May.  Lever. Petty. RETURN PETTY TO DEFENCE. He looks a broken player.  He has lost confidence.  The forward experience is over. 

Step 6/ GOALKICKING   GOALKICKING  GOALKICKING  it’s so important but appears worse than ever  Players trying screw kicks on their wrong foot … why? why it’s horrendous !!! 

Step 7/ STOP GUARDING GRASS   The zone gets undone by ball movement and run and chip and mark footy   Freo destroyed the zone   Man up  Run to be accountable and responsible  

Step 8/ STOP RECRUITING UNNEEDED PLAYERS IN THEIR DECLINE   Hunter. Billings.McAdam. Schache. Why ? List cloggers.  Why? Hunter and Billings were taking salary cap dramas off other clubs   Stop now !!  

We attracted Langdon, Hibberd, Lever, May, Melksham. Find those players again.  Find the free agents.  Find the players with upside. 
 

Step 9/ TACKLING. TACKLING. STOP THE PLAYER.  MAKE IT COUNT. Too many games see our players failing to stop   Aside from JV7, our entire midfield lacks defensive pressure and shutting down opponents  

Step 10/ DISCIPLINE AND DESPARATION.  Dees have zero smothers zero blocks zero little extra non stats hard work showing out.  It’s a comfort zone.  The desperation is non existent.   Third efforts rare, very rare.  
 

The #Freo92 loss hurts.  Really hurts.   We are now seemingly over the chance of another premiership and one on the MCG.  The coach showed little emotion and little plan B.  Outsmarted and outcoached.  

But we can apply the simple things.  The fixes that start to rebuild.   
 

Go Dees !!! 

Bloody good start! 

3 hours ago, waynewussell said:

Further to my post on selection,

Casey have been reasonably competitive, depending a little on how many MFC listed players actually take the field. There have only been two blow outs, 41 points loss to Hawks, round 1 and 32 points loss to Willy, round 6. Other losses have been -20, -14, -13, and -7. Those scores suggest to me that a solid game for Casey gives a listed player the right to feel he is on track to be considered for senior selection if the opportunity arises.

AMW has averaged 24.5 disposals in 9 games

K Brown has averaged 18 disposals in 9 games

Fullarton has averaged 17 disposals in 7 games

It is a much healthier club that recognizes performances by fringe players at the lower level and rewards consistent effort rather than gifts 'name' players games when they aren't performing at either level.

There is something very valid about that, reflecting on team selections but what can we do about it?

1 hour ago, leave it to deever said:

Watched some of the replay. I know, why would you.

I noticed May had a severe case of the fumbles. 

And I don't get why are handballing was so prolific and often intercepted.

It looked at if players were afraid to back themselves.

Finally our tackling was as soft as it gets. Looked like bruise free footy. The body language spoke volumes too.

 

Backing themselves missing - handball at all costs with all carelessness - at least it's a disposal for the stats; soft tackling - with our injuries, outs and recoveries - if I avoid an injury, and considering our 'outs', I will probably get a game again next week, regardless.

1 hour ago, pitmaster said:

The only thing I would add to this is that it was an opportunistic hit entirely. It started as an attempt to smother - legitimately - but once the ball beat him Skunkhead saw a chance to take out an opponent and did so with intent.

 Turning of his body was the give away.

My interpretation of the incident was that the said player was going in so hard it looked like, to me, he was forever/completely intent on making forceful (not decelerated) impact whether the ball was about to be disposed of (legally) or whether it had already been disposed of immediately before impact. To my view, it was, therefore, an opportunistic deliberation on intent, execution and an unconvincing cover-up/concern for Gus' welfare. Mission accomplished. 

12 hours ago, 48 Year Now said:

Trac waving his arms in frustration with someone was unusual.

I felt it was more than humiliating for Trac to have to do this. Wherever he went as the game of carnage went on, he gave his all, changed some circumstances and ran out of petrol himself, early in the game (he trains as a polished footballer should, not as an absolutely essential decathlete ameliorating the errors of others),  playing as hard as he could to improve the situation without support field-wide. In the future, I earnestly hope that Trac takes up the senior coaching position at the MFC when his playing days subside. Alongside Gawn, Viney, Gus and ANB, he is the heart and soul of what it means to be a Demon. 

14 hours ago, beelzebub said:

Very good observations. 

Flag.. I'd say top 8 relevance.

The lid was lifted today and all the world could see....an empty chest..

The areas you highlight...spot on.

Add another 

Our Coaching Dept has no real clue about plans and personnel.  We have the wrong game and wrong list.

Yes ...without doubt a handful of gems.  Some about to say au revoir...some off the boil..  some just wasted.

Much of the list.....meh.

There will be those that say that's nasty,  cruel, inconsiderate.  To them... I couldn't care any less than I do.  They are supposed to be an elite professional club.  To be there you ought to be good  better than most etc. When there, a usually shortish ( relatively) time you want to be the very best...for you , the jumper,club and fans.

Today we understand that doesn't always apply.  Play like [censored].....then take the [censored].   That was [censored]

Depth, realism, spot on! We have seen it all smouldering underneath many patches of good - then reduced, same game ordinariness - across several seasons, now. The Club lacks 'killer' values and readiness. If no-one is listening, it's longer-term failure on the shelf.

33 minutes ago, bing181 said:

We've managed to paper over the cracks for quite a while, but you can only get away with that for so long. List has some serious holes and hard to say where solutions are going to come from, at least in the short term.  Almost time to start playing the kids, couldn't be much worse.

The cracks have been papered-over by the smallest handful of players across this season, not 'we' nor Goodwin. The game against the Eagles was proof. This game against Freo was ramifying and we will probably lose to the Filth by the same margin, next game. We have recruited well over the past few years but we have not developed those so annoited in the red 'n blue. The onus can now only be distributed to the 'handful' (ie: one player in every line) who are nearing exhaustion and frustrated out of their minds; simply, it is too late to make changes for this season, as well. 

Again,

17 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

What I find amusing, yet not unexpected, is that the likes of Hardwick and Chris Scott have a sook and HQ immediately makes changes.

If Goodwin said "look at my ruckman being hit in the head 90 times a game", he'd probably get a please explain and Gawn wouldn't get another free kick for the season.

Very likely unless checked by these revelations. I think we are all in disappointed awe of the omnipotence of those in (secretive) power over game outcomes.

12 hours ago, Demonland said:

In summary:

AFL umpires are receiving in-game feedback via earpieces from officials at the ground, raising concerns among senior coaches about the potential impact on the game's integrity. An investigation revealed that some coaches were unaware of this practice and worried it might influence decision-making. AFL umpiring boss Steve McBurney clarified that the communication is meant for positive affirmation during breaks and not to direct in-play decisions. While this system has been in place since 2013, its usage has increased recently, sparking debates on whether it compromises the sport’s fairness. Despite assurances from McBurney that the system does not affect game integrity, some coaches remain uncomfortable with it. The league confirmed that these communications are recorded but not publicly shared, and umpires can opt out of receiving in-game feedback.

The 'system' has never seemed to work for Max Gawn. All we can presume, therefore, is that over the years, his extremely high reception of head bashings, leg-breaking impact collapses, neck wringing and kneed abdomen or kidney punches have been adjudicated as 'fair play' by the advisors of the snot goblins who frequently lose the pea from their whistles. 

14 minutes ago, old55 said:

I think Luker Kentfield makes good sense from a list management pov. We are currently going with 2 tall forwards (one a ruck/fwd) plus Fritsch and three tall backs.

BBB is done, TMac is close to the end despite his great season, Tomlinson has not been starting 22 and would find better opportunities elsewhere, and May is getting on.  Schache is not up to it. J.Smith is assumed done.

To maintain our current set up through the decade I think we can assume that JVR, Fritsch and Lever are there and that hopefully we can retain Petty who could play at either end. That means we need two of Turner, Jefferson, Adams, Verrall and now Kentfield to make it as KP.  Hore is useful intercepting depth and Fullarton may be depth only too.  Kalani White is coming through but any effective impact can't be expected until towards the end of the decade. I think we've increased our chances of success in this area and we needed to.

We can concentrate of drafting midfielders which is the easiest target to hit and look for a serviceable ruck through trade or FA.

Exciting review ... there are combinations upon combinations for effectiveness in matches to come. 

13 hours ago, Mickey said:

Interesting that a knock on him was his speed, but his agility seems quite good. With a bit of forward craft he might make up for a lack of speed

I can remember Cowboy Neale not having much speed, either. Plus, he played with an alleged 27% body fat. However, true or false, he did kick a heap of goals as part of a well-rehearsed St Kilda forward line. 

14 hours ago, gs77 said:

Bowey?

Bowey and Wowie. Both have speed, meat and smarts with both kicks and handball. 

On 26/05/2024 at 18:02, gs77 said:

If Petty doesn't get up, does Jeffo get a look in after his bag of 5 today? 

It is time for Jeffo to get a taste - and a good park in which to gobble goals. 

1 hour ago, D Rev said:

It was truly unbelievable to see!  Hopefully it wasn't a one-off!

It is probably - and sadly - unbelievable in a consistent form of umpiring (as it was an enormous improvement on what we have come to expect from the snot goblins across several seasons) and you are correct, we certainly hope that it was not a 'one-off'; however, the realist in us tells a different tale - more arbitrary whistle-blowing to come, no doubt. We need to also work on our popularity with the masses for change (for the better) to emerge.

1 hour ago, demon3165 said:

And who's job is that to implement?

It would probably fall to a thorough coaching team that had a truly focussed intent for the players so involved, who learnt lessons, reviewed matches and performances, provided real adjustments to what had gone before and who would follow through over time to see it achieved. It would not be a singular affair, at all.

18 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

Petty is struggling there. Tmac is dominating down back.

Does anyone think it's worth a shot maybe when Lever is back or Petty moved back?

Tommo is a strong mark in a pack. What we could use perhaps.

 

He has the ability to at least play better than Petty has been lately - additional strength in the backline must be awaited, first; it will be up to the coach to give him a trot or two across upcoming games for short periods of orientation first and then, some intensive coaching on the game plan to enact such a revival. He does miss a few things resulting in advantages to opposition players; I'd think that these could be addressed in step-by-step applications when it mattered.