Rodney (Balls) Grinter

58 minutes ago, Macca said:

Under JT, we've had a history of working our way up the draft to seemingly snag certain players

I think it just make sense to trade up the draft order whenever you can.  Not every high draft pick is a smash hit (Weid and Schache and Tompas a few obvious examples), but on ballance of probability, I they turn out OK.  To me we often seem to keep perennially trading future picks for current hight picks which also make infinite sense to me if you can pull it off - next year's draft never comes and if you can be putting that development into the player you have actually recruited that year earlier, then I think it helps keep more talent on the list now, rather than later.

i.e. if we could trade our first rounder in 2050 for a first rounder in 2024, then next year, we will just trade our first rounder in 2051 for a first rounder in 2025.  I guess sometimes it catches up, but I think those are the year's when we have a pretty well performing stable team that doesn't need replenishing and we don't really want to go to the draft anyway.

On 18/11/2024 at 11:17, Supreme_Demon said:

Jason Taylor said a lot without giving much away.

Said the Demons are going "best talent available" as is expected.

This has pretty much become the recruiter's clichè equivalent of "we're just taking it one week at a time"

On 15/11/2024 at 18:28, daisycutter said:

this has got cameron schwab's fingerprints all over it

what an absolute waste of good money

Don't know if it was Cameron Schwab's finger prints or not, but the branding / logo designers who did this probably got huge bickies for putting together this rubbish.

Are the Suns financially viable on their own yet?  If not, that's the rest of the league teams paying for this waste, both in terms of the branding outlay, plus I can't see it helping their popularity and gaining members with such an uninspiring jumper design.

Max made the comment the other day that we aren't the same Demons of 2021 any more, which is true, but just off the cuff, I think we'd actually have as good if not better side on paper.

Big outs:

Hibbo (and admittedly I think this is a big out)

ANB

Dogga

Brayshaw

Harmes

Jordan

BBB

Ins:

Mc Vee

Winsor

Van Rooyan

Chandler

Disco

AMW

Honestly just think we need some guys like Salo and Spargo to have injury free seasons, Trac, Clary and Bowser to be there normal selves again a few of the mature guys like Sparrow and Rivers to take that next step and regularly impact games.  I'd contest that Kossie is a better more mature player than in 2021.  That 3 - 4 year group of Roo, Disco and Chandler are already coming on nicely and I'd expect them to continue on their curve.  I'd also expect several the 2 - 3 year players like Woewy, Brown and the Kolts have real potential to be solid regulars in the side.

I still remember all the experts writing us off at the end of 2020, questioning if we'd even make finals the next season.

9 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

It's technically nobody's home game. Just an additional game on top of every club's 11 home and 11 away games, which is not part of a club's membership package. (I've also seen us listed as the home team in the Gather Round promo)

For example, in 2023 Richmond were the home team against Sydney at Adelaide Oval, Gather Round. Then later in the season Richmond played Sydney again as the home team at the MCG, but in a normal home game. On paper Richmond were the home team twice against Sydney in 2023, but realistically the MCG game was the only genuine home game of the two.

If we play Essendon later in the season, Gather Round will have no bearing on who's home game it would be.

In theory the concept is a crock, but attending the event is actually pretty fantastic and the city of Adelaide has a tremendous vibe. It's a ton of fun if you love your AFL footy, not just MFC.

That's not quite true by my reckoning.  Last year we played the Crows in gather round, meaning more effectively an additional away game for us and an additional home game for them.  Means the Crows and Power get an additional home game so long as they play gather round in Adelaide.

I actually hate the Gather Round concept for this reason and that it's another example of the AFL putting TV revenue and excessively priced reserved tickets ahead of the average punters ability to pay for and attend games.  I would occasionally travel interstate to see our team play, but bundling it all up in the one small state at the same time sends airline tickets and accommodation at premium prices as well, so small chance I'll ever attend a Gather Round.

6 hours ago, demosaw said:

Highlight was the dribbler against Geelong

That goal was a real high point in our season all up.

2 hours ago, Demon17 said:

Brad has never led a major business/organistion and may be wondering (or have wondered) "...what do I know about chairing a footy club - or anything else..?"

He did captain the MFC and lead a group of players - think that counts for something leadership wise and not many of the business/organisational type expert leaders that might stand for president could bring that to the table.

While realising that it's still obviously pretty important he is able to lead the business/administration side, I would think that having a player/captains perspective is something that is pretty darn important to have when leading a footy club and probably exactly what we need right now to provide the sort of space to let the players get on with things and get us back on track on feild next year.  We start winning games consistently and convincingly next year and just watch all these off field issues evaporate in the eyes of the media.

15 hours ago, DeeZone said:

Having watched our super hero play indomitable footy year after year it was very hard to watch Clayton this year, unfit injured constant headlines and derision from the media pack. So looking forward to seeing Clayton Clarry Oliver back to his peak fitness and enjoying his footy surrounded by a group of energetic enthusiastic youngsters following in his footsteps. Comeon down Champ.

Think it was pretty hard and frustrating for Clarry to be playing at below his normal capacity.  He's a pretty laid back character Clayton and doesn't give away alot, but I think some of his own disappointment with his fitness level and I think at the hand injury in particular came out in that great podcast interview he did after the season

For all the criticism of his apparent underperformance on the field this season, I don't think he's been given enough credit for continuing to push through the injuries he had week in week out for the team and still put in mostly credible performances, even if those performances were well below the lofty super high standards he's set in his time at the MFC.

1 hour ago, Timothy Reddan-A'Blew said:

For comparisons for Roo, another animal comes to mind: The Ox.

Can someone do a stats comparison of their first 2 or 3 years (allowing, somehow, for the mercurial nature of those years for Schwarz)?

Just to throw in the other point of reference I mentioned, in his second season Jesse Hogan played 21 games, kicked 41 goals and took 149 marks in a side that was still rebuilding - what a beast.  Still spewing we didn't get him back after his stint at Freo.

53 minutes ago, Timothy Reddan-A'Blew said:

For comparisons for Roo, another animal comes to mind: The Ox.

Can someone do a stats comparison of their first 2 or 3 years (allowing, somehow, for the mercurial nature of those years for Schwarz)?

So very high level, in their respective second seasons:

                                  Roo      Ox

AFL Games Played   21        22

Goals                         30        20

Marks                        81         112

Loved Schwartz as a player and distinctly remember some of those early break-out games he played, including that massive final against Carlton.  Unfortunately, the below courtesy of Demonwiki pretty well summarises the fate of the Ox from his third season onwards (http://demonwiki.org/David+Schwarz):

Schwarz's first injury trouble came in 1993, when persistent groin issues and a hernia restricted him to nine games. He bounced back to kick 60 goals in 1994, including a career-best nine in the last home and away game. That year he and took more marks than Wayne Carey in a season where he stamped himself as a future star of the competition. At the end of that year, he ended speculation of a switch to the new Fremantle side by signing a contract extension to the end of 1998.

The AFL Media Guide for 1995 described Schwarz as "a genuine AFL star centre half-forward. High-leaping, aggressive and mobile", but he was soon struck down with a serious knee injury during an intra-club match. He returned just 16 weeks after surgery, in Round 9, 1995, but the knee collapsed under him in the first quarter of the next game, requiring another reconstruction. Returning in the 1996 pre-season he broke down again in a Reserves practice match and missed the entire year.

Yes he certainly went on to play some solid footy after that, but I think those couple of seasons would be regarded as the most spectacular highs and lows of his career and my most vivid recollection of his playing days.  If only players like him, Gary Lyon, Alan Jackovic and Sean Charles stayed uninjured and Martin Pike had kept his act together, I have little doubt we would have won multiple premierships in that era.

Thought Disco had a great season and was one of our shining lights up forward.

Still can't fathom why he was the starting substitute against GWS in Rd 21 and again the following week against the Bulldogs as I thought he'd been pretty good in the weeks prior and plays both tall and mobile.  His accuracy in front of goal from a variety of positions, situations and distances was very good and he was actually a much more effective goal kicker over the season than Petty.  We only lost that GWS game by a smidge in the end and his goal kicking ability could have been the difference and kept our season alive.

On 02/11/2024 at 17:13, Roost it far said:

Champion forward in the making. Can’t understand the doubters. 

Don't count me as one of the doubters, but I think impatience goes at least part of the way to explaining my own feelings on the Roo.

We got absolutely spoilt by Jessy Hogan being a contested marking beast and better than your average mature KPP from pretty much day dot and Jackson was similar.  We have also had a significant No. of somewhat overhyped false dawns with key position forwards like Watts and Weid.

Can definitely see the potential in Jacob to dominate games and give us a great focal point up forward.  His set shot goal kicking is already elite.  Personally I just want him to deliver on that potential right now, while realising that's a somewhat unrealistic expectation and that statistically he's already actually maturing at a rate that is up there with the best of some of the recent elites of the league.

Can't wait to hear more and even louder cries of ROOOOOOOO echo throughout the G in coming seasons.

Now currently the AFLW all time top goal scorer.  Doesn't surprise me in the least.  From the get go, Kate was a super and reliable shot on goal and knew how to get it in dangerous spots.  One of the few players at the time that I felt comfortable would nail most of her kicks for goal if she went back and lined up.

Has been great seeing her keep taking her game to new levels in recent years and starting to get some credit for it. Agree you @spirit of norm smith what a star and how blessed our AFLW team have been to have such great leaders and great people over the years.

42 minutes ago, roy11 said:

Yes we don't know his instructions, work-rate still there though

Times Featuring in Top Five Players for Total Distance in 2024
Ed Langdon 21 times
Alex Neal-Bullen 13 times
Tom McDonald 12 times
Tom Sparrow 4 times
Adam Tomlinson 2 times

Matches Featuring in Top Five Defensive Work Rate

Alex Neal-Bullen 16 times
Tom Sparrow 12 times
Ed Langdon 10 times
Kade Chandler 7 times
Koltyn Tholstrup 5 times

Matches Featuring in Top Five Offensive Work Rate

Tom Sparrow 9 times
Ed Langdon 7 times
Alex Neal-Bullen 7 times
Kade Chandler 6 times
Koltyn Tholstrup 4 times

Source: https://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/1686412/gps-numbers-revealed-fittest-and-fastest-demons

Interesting.  Work rate seems to be there, but impact less so, or less obvious.  He's got a great kick on him and a tough/strong body and mindset, so I see heaps of potential upside to Tommy, just needs something to click for him to go to that next level.  Maybe Chunk can help him?

As an asides how impressive is it for a player of Tommy Mac's size and age to be still right up there for distance covered.  He was always the top distance athlete, but to keep kicking on at his age and with some of the injuries he's had is amazing.  Nothing but respect for T Mac.

13 hours ago, Old Time Demon said:

I think that Nate Jones starts off with one of a potential coaches most important assets, respect.  That's not a bad start,

From what I can recall, that respect and good rapport with the players was something Paul Roos had going for him in his first stint at the Swans.  I really don't know if Jones has the same football genius as Roos or not, but I'd also contest that part of the Paul Roos brilliance was to simplify things down, communicate and get the buy-in of his playing group.

I'd further add that I really do wounder if all this tactical genius stuff is overrated.  My coaches always had the view that footy was a simple game played by simple blokes.  I actually think the key to the tactical side of it is having a game plan that is both simple enough, but different to the one that's been in vogue for the past few seasons that everyone else has worked out how to play against.  Surely the senior coach and other coaching staff are more responsible for overall game plans. 

I'd also contest (pardon the pun) the in the midfield alot of the tactics are about the close in tough stuff, body positioning, understanding your opponent and how to get under their skin and/or how to defeat their strengths that guys like Jonesy would have an innate understanding of.

Glad to have Jonesy back in the fold and really keen to see the influence he can have on the team again.

50 minutes ago, Katrina Dee Fan said:

Let's see.  He oversaw the developments at Casey Fields.  He has got us closer than any other CEO to a home base with the Caulfield proposal.  He has got the club in the best financial shape it's every been in.  He has seen us get to the highest membership in the club's history.  

 

I think winning the flag in 21 and the exciting footy we played doing it largely took care of the club finances and membership - even I probably could have acheived a similar result at the MFC I'm those circumstances.

Not to say that Pert deserves no credit for some of the achievements at the club during his time though.  The venom and polarisation of this topic has got way out of proportion I feel and I think we'd probably be in agreement on that.

36 minutes ago, Dannyz said:

Wish him well. Delivered 21. Made slight progress on facilities. Financials are strong. Culture is not and that’s sword any organisation lives or dies on.

I'm not sure I'd give him that much credit for that and more so to Roos, Jackson, Goody and Gawn and Co.  Winning in 2021 was a cumulation of those foundations IMHO.

Honestly, I'm not close enough to the issues to know how Pert and/or Roffy have impacted club culture in the past few years good or bad, but I really do hope this helps clear the air and lets us move forward without this issue as a distraction.  Do actually feel the problem has been somewhat overblown due to media beatup and us having a sub par on field season - if we didn't have a horror season injury wise and had won the flag no one would be talking about changes within the club's administration and Pert etc would probably be lauded for being master managers.

17 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

How does he compare?

Well for starters Lever made the initial All Australian squad at just 21 years of age.

By 21 Lever was a 3x best 22 and under of the best talent in the league.

Had a Rising star nomination by the.

Howes not even remotely close to this.

Wow.  Really shows what a freak talent Jake Lever is and how (pardon the pun) well we did to have recruited him over.

As an asides, along with loosing Brayshaw, Patracca and an injured Clayton Oliver, being down one and or both of Lever and Steve May really hurt our performances as the season wore on.  He's a player you often don't notice when he's there, but it make a huge difference to our defence when he's not.  Those critical of our 2024 drop off really do need to take a look at the injuries we copped to key players throughout the year as a moderating factor while making any judgements.

7 hours ago, Nascent said:

I more or less agree with your sentiment but just had to pull you up on your opening line. Laurie only played 6 games this year with 4 of them being sub or subbed off. Woewy played 16. He's also contracted until end of 2026.

I defended him throughout the year and thought he was given a rough run by the match committee. Only played one consecutive set of matches, showed a bit of improvement in his last few games yet was straitht out and never given a run to build his confidence. 

I'm less bullish on his prospects now. Despite getting a deal until 2026, he's going to need to really demand a spot and play a good chunk of games otherwise he'll probably be told to look at his options elsewhere.  Best of luck to him, hope he makes a good fist of it.

Fair calls.  Wouldn't have picked Taj as playing 16 games in season 2024, but maybe he was sub for 75% game time in a number of them and that's why I have that perception (like that ridiculous situation when Kynan Brown was put on the ground with like 2mins to go).

I stand corrected on him being contracted till 2026, although I did recall him being contracted way longer than what I thought his performances to date seemed to justify, last time he signed up.  In that case, he'd want to really turn it on next year, otherwise I think we've really wasted a list spot over multiple seasons.  Again I struggle to understand the rationale in investing so heavily on the main list with Laurie, when we can recruit guys like Judd McVee who come up off the rookie list and look like much better quality players from day dot.  Even players with ability like Nev Jetta spent time being dropped onto the rookie list while we worked out if they could really make the grade.  Part of me feels that he's been given more time to develop because we invested realitively heavily at the draft with him at pick 22 and want to try to squeeze blood out of that stone.

4 hours ago, M_9 said:

Not sure. We have McVee, Bowey, Salem, AMW and possibly Brown. His kicking lacks depth and I'd rank those five above Bailey.

Agree with much of the above only it would be nice to release those guys to be used further up the ground to hit up targets inside 50 more, particularly Judd, Salem and Bowey.

But also agree with you Re Laurie's kicking.  It's suposed to be one of his assets, yet so often I watch him collect the ball with time and space, then proceed to shank or grass the kick into our 50, giving our forwards no chance and turning it over.

Baffles me a bit how Laurie got so much game time ahead of Woewodin and Kynan Brown this season.  I hear the reports and see the stats that he seems to dominate some games at Casey, but struggles to find the same aggression and poise at AFL level in pretty much every game I see him play, bar perhaps 5mins of a game last season where he snagged a couple of clever goals.  He was recruited based on being an elite ball user in the mold of Jake Bowey, but I'm yet to see that he's really in the same class as Jake.

I'm guessing if he doesn't step up and find his feet fast in season 2025, he will be overtaken by the other similar emerging players we have on our list and find himself without an AFL contract at seasons end.  I wish him luck, but just don't see it happening based on results to date.

Look up resilience and tenacity and you'll find a picture of Tom McDonald.  Together with Jake Melksham making it back and impacting a few games, I think T Mac was one of the few MFC feel good/winning stories of the season.  Could be forgiven for dropping his bundle and having a mediocre season at Casey with the personal off feild family trauma he had in the off season.  But I don't think giving up and throwing in the towel is in Tommy's DNA.  I really love the verbal sparing between Tommy and Max.  Max exadurates and talks him down, that he's an ordinary bloke, but it's clear he has huge respect for Tom as a person, a footballer and professional athlete.

There were a couple of games where he was a bit below par and also a few where his frustration with the teams performance/predicament got the better of him and that was clearly evident in his emotional response on the field.  But by in large a really solid year when we needed him down back.  My biggest regret is that Goody didn't use T Mac's refound confidence in cluncking big marks more and swing him forward in games earlier where Petty was struggling to impact up forward - I think we could have pinched a few there with his presence and goal kicking ability.  It probably could also have helped Petty regain his confidence a bit using a defender to lead him to the ball and not having to be the target of defensive spoils every contest.

4 hours ago, Little Goffy said:

Yeah, well they were 2 wins and 5 losses (your point I'm guessing) after a bunch of almost seasons. If only Picket was in charge of the Lions maybe a decent coach could have been put in charge and won them the flag!

13 hours ago, Watson11 said:

I don’t get why some demonlanders are so hard on JVR.  He’s played 41 games and his goals kicked at this stage (41 games) is more than Josh Kennedy, Nick Riewoldt, Jack Riewoldt, Tom Hawkins, and Tom Lynch who have about 20 All Australians between them.  All except Tom Hawkins really hit their straps around the 50 game mark (Tom Hawkins around 100 games).  I think he’ll be a 50 goal forward in 2025, especially if we get it in quickly to create more 1 on 1s.

I'd say impatience has alot to do with it Watson and I quite often find myself falling into this trap with JVR.  I'm guessing the lack of other well peforming big key forward options around him at present also has a fair bit to do with it as we are actually looking to him to be the man and the focal point of our attack.

I also think we are somewhat forgetting that LJ had a bunch of other mature key forwards around him that took the brunt of the defenders and pressure off him most of the time.   Even then, for most of our 2021 season the story was that we were great defensively, but our forward line was a weakness, which really only clicked the last 3 or 4 games of the home and away and kept surging with momentum in the finals series.

2 hours ago, Adam The God said:

Exactly. Take Neale out of Brisbane and they don't win the flag.

Well he was kinda hobbling on one foot in the end, but I guess he held it together for long enough to get them over the line hey!  A bit like Steve May in 2021. 

I remember reading Leigh Mathew's autobiography and one of his big take away is that good luck with injuries is pretty key to winning a flag.  Similar to the aforementioned Neale and May examples Mathew's did also admit that Jonathan Brown was pretty banged up in one of the Lions three peat flags, but passed a fitness test and thus played.  I'm thinking that there is probably some value in star players just being out their to soak up some opposition attention even if they don't have a huge impact in their own right, so long as they can bluff it well enough.