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geez you would think Viney is barely AFL standard reading the comments here. unbelievable.

So Carlton get to open AFL, AFLW and the AAMI seasons in prime time. They are still the AFL's favourites when it comes to fixturing to maximise sponsor exposure and member interest! Jealous. Some will say we need to win games to get better fixtures. True. But for years we have done a lot better than Carlton in all forms of the game...

if you class trac as more inside-outside, viney is a miles better footballer than any other inside mid option we have other than oliver, and his defensive tendencies are better than clarry the amount of opprobrium for a former captain and multiple b&f top 5 placegetter on this site is baffling we are a much better side when viney is up and going than when he's sitting on the sidelines; here's hoping for a quick and full recovery

A win is a win, particularly given such a horrible travel schedule. Even a 7.30 flight means getting out of bed at 4.30-5.00 which makes it even worse. A lot of positives: McNamara will be a ripper, and is typical of the up and coming players. Strong and powerful. The best in the competition are all built the same way. Bannon will also be good. First hit out and more than held her place. Still not convinced with Stinear as coach. Too much emphasis on handball, which the girls can't execute properly ( across the competition). GC showed in the first quarter that a kick is more valuable than a chain of handballs to gain ground. When Paxman started thumping the ball into the forward line in the second, things changed mightily for us. Also I wish he would teach the players to kick the ball off the ground, instead of trying to pick it up in contested situations. Again, Paxman knows how to do it, but with a team stacked with ex-basketballers, soccer players and netballers, they just aren't suited to the oval ball. Kick it along the ground and gain the meterage. Fortunately, he moved Cunningham up the field in this game. She can't sit in the square like she did last year. Forwards are progressing toward the same model as the men. Big and powerful. The backs are matching it. Moving her up the ground as a target at CHF gives her the chance to use her height. Greiser (St.K) and Perkins(G.C.) are the body types that are excelling at FF. Livingstone(Coll) is the future of FB's. No small wonder Tayla Harris(Car) was cleaned up again by her the other night. We need Meg Downie back to bolster the defence, as Perkins nearly pulled GC back into the match on her own, like she did for us against GWS in the final last year. Demonlands own Karen Paxman was a ripper. Not just the drive in the middle, but her relentless running around the ground is the reason she will be AA again. Good to see Lauren Pearce back for rucking duties. And she is mobile and capable around and with the ball. Goldrick never loses a one on one, and so can't wait for McEvoy and McGee to get the chance to show their wares. Don't know what they do in Ireland, but they are sure some tough lasses!

It's all so subjective. I think Rob Flower was a terrific captain at Melbourne yet we only played finals once in his tenure of 7 years. Bruce Monteath was a handy player but captained Richmond to a flag (from the bench) in 1980, in a team chock full of leaders - Bartlett, Cloke, Wood, Bourke etc etc. That was his only season as skipper. The best captain I've ever seen, from both an on and off field point of view was Terry Daniher. One of the lads, but set such an outstanding on field example that players were prepared to follow him anywhere. All time greats like Tim Watson and Simon Madden, as well as workmanlike players Peter Bradbury and Steve Carey speak reverently of TD's leadership capabilities. He spoke to fans, to corporates and media in an authentic and relatable manner. Gawn has the capacity to lead like Daniher. He has great media and fan presence. He is an outstanding player who clearly has the respect of the playing group - in almost every interview Petracca and Oliver do they reference the influence Gawn has on their individual and collective games. He has been an outstanding player for many years now. 4 times an AA speaks volumes as to his playing ability. He will grow into the role, and as Petracca, Oliver, Lever, May etc become better able to share that onfield leadership burden, we will collectively become a better team. Those pushing for May need to remember he was not a successful Captain at GC. He led a side with an ingrained poor culture that he couldn't effectively influence, and was a part of since day one. Often injured and sometimes suspended he was far from professional. His first year at Melbourne was a continuation of that. He has played one good season. He has leadership capabilities, no doubt, but he would not have the respect that players like Gawn have built up over a number of years.

Well, that was about as good a hit out as you could hope for in Round 1. Classic case of everyone being better for the run and to come away with the win is the icing. There was certainly a couple of layers of rust for our players, but they worked their way into it well before fading at the end. To be honest, I’d expected them to be even more out of touch given the nearly 10 months with only one practice game and the unsettled lead-up. Not sure if we’d have had second look-in if we’d had that kind of start against Adelaide. But that’s irrelevant now! Kudos to the club and everyone involved though for keeping everything chugging along over lockdown. It’s no mean feat! Positives: L.Pearce, great game, we look so much better with her in the side. And consequently, with Zanker getting more time in her true position. Which in turn, takes the pressure of Cunningham, who has now equalled her poor 2020 goal tally in one game. Paxman, must be some reverse-Samson energy or something, but she keeps upping the ante. Accurate goal kicking in general. Goldie, just to be out there so soon after quarantine was impressive. Hanks, feels like she’s been around forever but is just shy of 21 and among the best kicks in the team. First-ever goals for Heath and Petrevski (plus a second!). Playing at a non-wind-affected venue. The debutants: McNamara obviously had the most apparent impact, super impressive. Fitzsimon looked steady out there, not out of place at all. Bannan is a natural and will work her way in. Fun Fact—Bannan is the 500th players to debut in the AFLW and the 51st player to represent the Dees in the league. The negatives: Birch had nowhere near her usual impact due to our defence being out of whack structurally. It’s probably our greatest area of concern at the moment with Downie out for a bit and just lacking experience back there in general. I wouldn’t mind seeing Scott go back. Unfortunately being the stop-gap always seems to fall to her, although it worked out well enough last season. May not be the best idea, since she looked a bit all over the shop in this game (a great contested grab though). Someone upthread was asking about Gay and Lampard. Not sure on Gay because she’s a walk-up start and wasn’t listed as having an injury. Maybe a work conflict or the like. Lampard is still recovering from an ACL and is hopefully set to return mid-season. I want Magee in ASAP but also am trying to temper the instinct as rushing her is probably not wise in the long-term. Overall, just so happy to have footy back, a truly fortunate position to be in and one to savour. Don’t forget, tickets on sale on Monday for Round 2 v. Richmond at Casey. 9AM members, 10AM general public, I believe.

Great win by the Dees they busted the game wide open by kicking 5 goals to the none in the 2nd quarter against Sun and that was the game. There was a debutant in Eliza McNamara who played on the wing and ran hard all day had a great game and was one of the reasons that we won. Pearce in the Ruck and on baller Mithen set the standard in the first half and the Dees blew them away in the end. Tired in the last Quarter but that was expected with a hit and run game at Metricon Gold Coast after arriving in the early morning. Well done Dees.

The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.” ― Charles Bukowski Abdolute confidence.

You would have to be a puffin muffin to drive all the way down to Casey (about 45minutes down the freeway from the city and on to Clyde Rd) on a day like today. And yes it certainly wasn't like Gosch's Paddock when I arrived - no coffee shop nearby, no Saty, no guys video recording behind the goals, no bike riders cycling through the park. In fact, aside from coaches, fitness guys, players and physios, it is fair to say no-one attended at all - except of course for a silly old fool like me standing behind a fence in a rainjacket at the Wilson's Prom end like a Mexican in Tijuana trying to cross the border. The roads around Casey have been improved since my last visits there about five years ago for an intraclub practice match that featured a demoted Lynden Dunn playing on Jesse Hogan. It was incredibly windy that day and if you ever watch Casey games on TV or club footage, you will know that wind and Casey Fields go hand-in-hand like Scotland and rain. This morning, however, the constant rain seemed to scare the wind away. We are in the middle of summer and the first thing I saw as players did a circular kicking drill was Trac in a long jumper taking a one-hander and as my gaze followed him, he kept hitting his targets with ease. He wasn't alone in the long sleaves - Gawny, Kossie, Rivers, Salem had them and plenty of others as the morning progressed and the rain got heavier asked for a jumper switch. A quick look at the rehab group saw Bowey, Smith and Mitch Brown doing various leg drills and soon after Angus came wondering around walking laps - most likely a layday for him on his road to recovery from all those onions he ate at Gawny's. Melky was also a late starter for the scratch match, but a trainer told me he was fine. Hibbo wasn't sighted at all. As I'm sure we all do, the first thing I wanted to do was have a look at Ben Brown and yes he's big, but his prominent mop top was lessened because of the rain. His first touch wasn't a good one - he spilled a mark like you or I would and it's fair to say it wasn't his morning - the rain rarely is friendly to the talls and when the scratch match started he was pitted against Steven May. In fact there wasn't much joy for any of our bigs because Lever is mega-disciplined at training and had Weid or Fritter covered while Tomlinson is also aware that he has to perform to stay in ahead of Petty and therefore was staying close to his man. Just before we get to the match, let me make a quick observation. There is one coach who has a loud voice. He's 62 years old and he was out there in shorts while others were rugged up. "Pick easy targets, not long and wide - that sort of thing just doesn't happen" he bellowed to make his point crystal clear. It could have been Tom Hafey reincarnated, such was his vehement passion for the game. You all know who it was. Mark Williams will annoy the [censored] out of Goody and Ooze and our other coaches all year with his comments, but he will inspire the players with his gung-ho spirit and love for the game. I was almost about to jump the fence for him. But let's get to the bit you all want to read - the match practice. Such was the constant rain that it ended up being two 30-minute halves before training was called off early. In terms of matchups our No.1 defenders were pitted against our No.1 attackers while our No.1 mids were up against our Casey-headed mids, so it gave me a clear insight as to Goody's current thinking. A lot can change between now and Rd 1 though. Prior to game starting Olly was sent off with the rehab group to work on the oval across the road - obviously they didn't want to risk him yet, although he did all the other drills - just not the game. Viney also seemed to disappear as well - sorry I am not even sure if he started in match practice game - I somehow missed his departure. The first half was a bit like watching the last quarter of the 1987 preliminary final again - everybody was missing the big sticks. One nice passage of play saw Harmes (who was fairly prominent in the middle) kick long to Trac, but sure enough he missed from about 40m. I think it was 0.5 to 0.3 with the A grade defenders with the B grade forwards and mids ahead. Sparrow, Bedford and Kobe Farmer were among those to miss, while Rivers almost nailed a long bomb early for the A grade mids and forwards team, but eventually the drought broke early in the second half when Neiter (Aaron Neitschke) had a bit too much time and sent a long bomb home from the 50m. Moments later a clearance from Swallow ended with Kobe who got on his left and snapped a clever goal. Both Neiter and Kobe were mobbed. There weren't too many goals though - Spargo snagged one from a good crumb by ANB and T.Mac set up ANB for another, but really the game was a mass of fumbles, tackles and outnumbered forwards at both ends. Jonesy got injured at one point and went off for a check before returning, while Brown was crunched by May a couple of times on the lead. Rivers getting caught by Jackson was another highlight - although I'm sure Trent wouldn't say so. If I was giving Brownlow votes on the game I probably would have 3 Gawn (even though Jacko was also prominent on him), 2 Spargo (yes, he did surprise me and was clever and looked a tad quicker than normal and 1 to either Harmes or Swallow - the two most prominent mids IMO. Honourable mentions also to both May and Petty who were dominant full-backs for their two teams. As to the most interesting duels aside from May on Brown, it was probably the wings. Langdon was up against Rozman and T.Mac (playing for the As) was up against Baker. All four got plenty of it and T.Mac was probably the most influential of the four and gave his team a longer marking outlet. Rosman, sporting the No.19 top, was clearly the most interesting to watch and most of his kicks got a chorus of cheers from the coaches area - I think it was Goody, but given I was 150m away in the dugout, it might have been our man Chocco letting rip with praise. Rosman is an undoubted talent and is a thumping left-foot kick - whether he is another Brent Grgic just bombing it onto his boot is yet to be determined, but at least he will have good coaching. Such was Rosman's game that I reckon, given Goody's previous annual ritual of promoting players way before they are ready at the expense of his senior men, that we might even see him in Rd 1. Bailey Laurie was also quite prominent and clever in his role as a high half-forward for the B team. Based on the side that was picked today, here's your Rd 1 combo (not my team, how the A Teams lined up today). Excluded because they weren't out there at game time are Olly, Angus and Melky. Spargo played more as an onballer today and was lively - hence my votes for him above. Probably my biggest surprise was that Rivers wasn't playing with the A grade defenders side. B: Lockhart May Lever HB: Hunt Tomlinson Salem Centres: T.Mac Trac Langdon HF: ANB Weid Fritsch F: Spargo B.Brown Pickett Ru: Gawn Harmes J.Jordan As the rain strengthened the players split into gps of about 8 and finished with some one-on-one tackling drills and there was one voice bellowing encouragement to his gp - yep that 62yo guy from Port Adelaide. Could be our best recruit of all this year. With my shoes soaked I wondered off through the puddles back to my car. As I threw off my wet gear I noticed the COVID testing centre, which is located 100m from our ground. I then let out a huge sneeze. I think it was from the rain and chill - but maybe I'm coming down with COVID-19 or maybe I was taking away some excitement from our new covert operations No.19 - Goody picking Rosman for Rd 1.

I believe that JJ and Sparrow are two of the six players that are going to improve our top 22 - 25 players this year, they appear to have the belief and pre-requisite skills to improve the team.

Have faith friends, Jack will be ok. It's only a foot.

Looks like poor old JJ is this year's victim of having his name continually misspelt by posters. It's Jordon folks, not Jordan. Two "o's" and no "a" at all. Same spelling as our erstwhile under 19's coach, Ray "Slug" Jordon.

I thought the girls looked a bit lethargic early on with the travel, but that 2nd and 3rd quarter was sensational and could be the difference between us making the finals or not. This was exactly the type of game we should have won in seasons 1-2 but we would drop & then missed finals narrowly. Great to hear the song again, and I teared up a bit with the three debutants in the middle of the circle. Love that they sing the song on the ground.

Warning: I've been a consistent track watcher for over 15 years and two of the most impressive PS trainers I've ever seen were Sam Blease and James Strauss. I wish Rosman all the very best and will be thrilled if he is what we all want but like most I've not seen him play and I have no expectations - neither optimistic or pessimistic.

Dee Zone that is Exactly why I like you are so bullish about 2021 being a big year for improvement I would live to know your six but will try and predict mine. 1. JJ the interview on the website ( and on D/L ) shows where he is at and he looks ready to debut Reminds me of a kid prior to Christmas knowing he is going to get given his requested toy and can't wait. Not sure if I have even seen JJ play on the TV. 2. Sparrow is Another believer Who just is in the groove following a cameo role in games in the middle of 2020. Bridged the gap To AFL and looks ready for more under our new coaching setup. BTW if these 6 players are important to our rise then think again the how big Ooze and Chocco are in this scheme of things!! 3. Jackson untapped potential like 1 and 2 who was injured at The business end of the season. Bigger stronger and like a young colt ready for the Spring 3 yo races Dogga will knot up the forward connection, compete not once but repeat in the ruck and won't hand the opposition a sniff of advantage when relieving bud Maxy. Oh and his superb handball and below knees skills will thrill us supporters. Strong hopes for some goals up forward as well. 4. Kossie Will put any of the doubters to shame with a big list of chases tackles runs speccies attempted and goals as a highlight as he Zigs and zags through our middle and forward lines. Composure the key to finishing his efforts. 5. Riv The quiet achiever Already a lock on the half back line with some pretension for cameos in the middle! It's about 5 mins Remaining vs GWS and a seemingly innoculous strike with his left foot floats amazingly through the middle to give us a 10 point lead. It's his second career goal for the game and he follows up with a lunging punch Over the boundary at half back in the last 30 seconds To ensure our win over the Giants. We're in good hands when Rivs around the ball as cool calm and confident footy decisions and skills are the trademark of this tyro. 6. Locky Not sure you will Have Jay In your list but I believe he is a natural back pocket small Forward minder who breaks lines goes aggressively at the ball on ground and in the air and hopefully doesnt dive on it too often Enthusiastically so the Umps can ping him for Holding. Another who will be stronger fitter and confident in his position ready to Lead the charge downfield. Thats the 6 but wait our steak knives could well be Bowey Laurie and Rosman as well. ( Sounds like a legal team!). Signs are good early on for the trio with Fraser's big VFL frame, enormous tank With pace, and strong marking grip he will be No 7 very early on in 2021. Let the games begin DZ!!

Sage words Ding, I suspect falling on barren ground. But then what would a preseason be without some excitement!

Football, cricket and journalism - Percy Beames was part of the Melbourne landscape for several decades - Percy Beames: a man for all seasons

That’s good news indeed! Like trainspotters, I think there’s something not quite right about birders. ?

Because of 1 security guard contracting it from a quarantine hotel. This is complete madness.

Being of the generation when it was VFL I dislike all Vic teams. My whinge was about the AFL consistently favouring a team: unsuccessful Carlton. There other AFL favourite to promote is unsuccessful Essendon which I put into the 'loathe' category!

Thanks OD for your honest opinion. JJ was very close last year in getting a game about 4 games to go but injured his wrist I think. He has been Getting good reviews for his development so far this pre season especially his greater muscle and physique also his improved ability to get the ball and disposal. He just seems ready judging by the reports etc. and also speaks as if he feels confident tjis is his breakout year. Lets hope so.

Unfortunately $$ comes before spectacle.

Viney has got to be the weirdest choice for forum whipping boy in the history of Demonland. Foot injuries are always concerning; we've had plenty and I can't remember a single one turning out to be minor.

I'll back Rosman to make the grade he has so far given every reason to believe he may be the real thing! Possibly Round 1 on the wing. No outstanding competitor putting their hand up and please don't say Tmac. He is needed up forward or down back (yesDrD) If his current Pre season form continues depending upon availability or selection policy.

While the prior plantar fascia injury was to his right foot I hope we are really careful with this injury to his left foot. His left is his kicking foot and as he has no 'right side' an early return risks his effectiveness on the field. I'm not fussed if he misses some early games, we have plenty of coverage which we didn't have 3-4 years ago. Better that he is 100%.

Next time any of you are in the vicinity of the Percy Beames bar in the MCC members check out the cricket honour board high on the wall. His stats are amazing. I remember him as a lovely old bloke on TV footy shows with none of the bs so common now. It was wonderful to read that had the NS medal existed then, Percy would have won three of them, which is pretty extraordinary given that Smith kicked an absolute bag (7 goals) in the 1940 GF.

Great opportunity for Sparrow to really step up now.

Given the Trengove experience I wouldn't mind if we kept him out of all running drills for 12 weeks . Keep him on the bike and swimming for cardio and let him wrestle bears for upper body conditioning. Dr Biffen has spoken

He’s not in my best 22

When we looked down and out in the last part of the third and in first half of last it was Lauren Pearce who kept us in it. What a superb ruckwomen she is. The young Mcnamara looks like a real find.

McNamara showing plenty. She looks like a great pick-up.

Foot and minor procedure don't really go hand in hand (foot in foot). The procedure may be minor but the outcome rarely is. Let's hope for the 2 weeks but I don't like the sound of that given he's had previous foot issues.

A little too much excitement over some time trial results and a natural runner here. The wing is such an important structural position we have to see if he can get to the right spots at stoppages and when defending, that's challenge number 1 for any winger and isn't easy. After that we can't even be sure he'll be a good ball winner. Then the final step is probably how he uses the ball and thumping left foot boot means little if it's not going to a team mate. It's probably more likely at this stage that we'll see Tom McDonald at 28 on the wing rather than Rosman at 18.

If it's going to be 50% of capacity, I've half a mind to attend. *No jokes about only having half a mind, either!.

His suitability and 'structural' problems set in when Mister Jacovich arrived. It meant they couldn't play Bennet at Full Forward.

Absolutely rapt that we won so well under challenging travel arrangements. And how much more accurate was our goal kicking this year! I noticed we didn't have the play-on at all costs, 'chaos' football as much this year and were happy to go back and take a mark. A good change which reduces turnovers especially when our players have moved into attacking positions and the opp score easy goals. Overall both teams were very aggressive and it was a really enjoyable game to watch. I'm hesitant to be too optimistic. Yeah, I know MFCSS extends to the Women's game! My reservation is that 3 of our 9 goals were from 50m penalties and 2 from free kicks so we weren't able to beat GCS, a much less experienced side, with our style of play. I feel we need significant improvement in our ball movement fwd of centre to kick winning scores because we won't always kick straight or get so many goals handed to us on a platter. Having said that it is only round one, difficult travel arrangements and cobwebs to clear out. I look forward to next week at Casey and see how we fare when the odds are in our favour. Talking of next week, Richmond didn't win a game in 2020 so will be keen to win especially with Katie Brennan as their captain. We need to sort out fwd half play, start well and have a big win to set up our season because it will only get tougher.

Does player sponsorship work like shares? Because this good stock is going up.

You wouldn’t understand.

Look at all the usual sad sacks having a cry.

lets be real here. No-one really knows what they're talking about. Everyone is just taking a calculated guess. i.e Petracca should be in because he had a good season. Or Gawn is a bad captain because we came 9th again. None of this is scientific. There's a lot more factors to consider. Who says that the stereotypical alpha male Steven May style is the best leadership style to lead the group? Maybe the players would respond better to someone who is a soft spoken student of the game like Adam Tomlinson? Who really knows. For all we know Fritsch and Weideman could be the best leaders. So we need to define whether to be in the leadership you have to be a top 10 player at the club.

May should have been Vice Captain.

Can just see this being a bigger issue. Soon enough we will hear he won’t do a pre season match. Then he will miss the first month of the season. Then it’ll be mid year. I sincerely hope I’m wrong, but we have seen this movie before

More boring than sensible. The Rosman train is full steam ahead and the seeds of a cult hero have been firmly planted. Nothing can stop the inevitable.

Plenty of sensible comments here regarding tempering expectations but there’s no doubt this kid has attributes and qualities to get excited about. Every training report I’ve seen mentions how he stood out, caught the attention. Maybe that’s just because he’s a big unit and hard to miss but perhaps its because he is genuinely talented and already having an impact. Its quite possibly he’ll fail to fire and fade away like plenty of draftees before him but I’m quite bullish about his prospects. I’m looking forward to see him play and hopefully the reality will match the hype.

Nothing would be nicer than having Rozman running into instant success. Nobody would like this more than me. However, in the way fate decrees and dictates, please let us take and accept his journey as a one step at a time episode. Let's not burden him with our expectations, let's just allow whatever will be to be. He could be great, let's not Moz him.

Listen to Jason Taylor himself. He was drafted on the back of dominating school footy in 2019 and then tearing the Sandy Dragons trial games at the start of 2020. School footy form is now becoming a key platform for recruiter's now days. His form in that was quiet strong and that along with his draft combine is what got him drafted. A lot of phantom draft and draft talk had him around that pick 30 to 40 range. I do agree that there is probably a little bit too much hype and personally I don't think he'll play round 1 nor do I think he'll start on the wing. I think he'll start forward and play his best footy there.

I think the opposite to the bolded part, a 2 man 'official' leadership group means that everyone knows who tosses the coin and who the back up is. Essendon did themselves in by having a larger group, which meant guys missed out and probably rightly, thought they should be in there. A captain/vice captain model, means that any other senior player should think they are a leader and can speak up when they see fit, it's not forced upon them while also not discouraging. The capt/VC can still talk to them if they overstep the mark without having to bring it into a group leadership situation, and as you said the coaches really should be the ones they go to with issues.

‘On-field general’ might have cut it in the 80s but there is 150+ hours a week outside a football field which influence performance more than someone shouting/instructing people on the day. Viney lost his spot largely because Max overtook him in terms of group-influence/connection off the field.

gawny regularly stands up late in games and takes huge "come with me if you want to win" marks and is regularly seen working his [censored] off to get deep in defence and play a role for the team and work hard to cover the ground lay tackles etc. + he is relatable and personable and obviously gets along and is approachable to all the squad. also time and time again we have seen him look stern and confront the group before gathering with the coach when we're playing [censored]. and realistically thats all traits of good leadership and captain material imo

Not solely directed at you tiers as many here share similar thoughts but I think this is pretty unfair on max. Does anyone here really have a good sense of who are the best leaders at the club? People were crying out for Max to be added to be captain prior to last season and now we think he isn't the best leadership material because we didn't finish where we wanted to. It's not the be all and end all but to me it makes a difference that he's a captain that doesn't talk in cliches - love/d them all as players but Viney, Jones, Green etc never inspired me because confidence/words weren't their forte. Which you don't need to have to be a good player but I think it is important as a captain. And it's not as if Gawn doesn't back it up on the field. While he didn't necessarily stand up when we needed him most last season, we now know he was carrying some big injuries - if anything shouldn't have been playing at all. Gawn understands what it is like to struggle - with injury, in the VFL, being on the fringe of the list etc and also through hardwork has become a star of the comp. It is well documented the homework he has done on ruck craft, opposition analysis, diet and fitness to become elite - and has been at this elite level (aside from injury interruptions) since Roos final year. I'm not against Trac and May being part of the leadership team in some form - but is it really just because they were our best / most consistent players last year? If Trac can't keep it going / isn't suited to longer quarters - does he go out next season?They're big bodies and players that impact games. But I don't think so any more than Gawn - he has saved us with critical marks in defence in addition to his ruck craft consistently for years. I take your point about other captains, but in Trac and May you seem to be going for the best players in the last year aren't you? It's interesting how prior to the tiges winning premierships, Cotchin regularly got criticised as a player (his possessions don't count) and captain (isn't one of the boys / doesn't live and breathe footy etc etc) In my view, Gawn is best suited to be our captain but if we think leadership and captaincy changes is where we are going to make up the lost ground in catching up with the 8 / top 4, then i think we're on a hiding to nothing!