Hawks racism allegations (merged thread)

[DeeZone 7,643]

24 minutes ago, Mincho Mania said:

Pretty sure it was reported that when Aussie left it was due to being very unhappy with the club, hope it's nothing along those lines.

Be interesting to see where Kennett lines up in all this.

Could be a couple of players requesting trades to North having a change of heart, be happy for Logue to consider heading to us

I always believed that Austin Wonaeamirri left Melbourne because his father was killed in a motor accident and Austin needed to take his place whereas Liam Jurrah became involved in a rival family dispute as he was a Tribal Elder.??

[layzie 28,473]

6 minutes ago, Jibroni said:

Bad decision by Brisbane to stand down Fagan, what if he is cleared of these allegations?

Then he will return to work.

[McQueen 17,862]

If MFC behaved in this way I’d drop my membership for quite some time. 
 

Let’s see how the Hawks members judge their family club now. 

[Lucifers Hero 36,974]

More insights  investigation-into-hawthorn-football-club-reactions-response

 

[old dee 22,803]

15 minutes ago, McQueen said:

If MFC behaved in this way I’d drop my membership for quite some time. 
 

Let’s see how the Hawks members judge their family club now. 

I will be surprised if much happens in that space. The largest number of club supporters probably don’t care. It might alter a little from one club to another but not a lot in my view. Did the pies numbers drop? Not from my memory. 

[redandbluemakepurple 317]

3 hours ago, CYB said:

I hear you but if this was a trial for rape or paedophilia, you would need much more than witness statement to persecute the perpetrator. From what I read there doesn’t seem to be any factual evidence to support these allegations. It is circumstantial as I can find many holes in the information that has been presented and the way it has been presented. 

It doesn't need to proved beyond a reasonable doubt like criminal cases.  The AFL just needs to be confident.  For damages claim, I understand that the criteria is the balance of probabilities despite what the judge on the Rebel Wilson case said.   I am sure a lawyer will correct me if applicable.

[sue 8,403]

24 minutes ago, layzie said:

Where does it say anywhere in the article that the AFL knew about this for 2 weeks and sat on it? The opening paragraph specifically says the following:

"The review document, handed to Hawthorn's senior management two weeks ago and now with the AFL integrity unit."

There is no mention of this being handed to them at that time. This is a serious matter and comments made need to be dealing strictly in facts and not between the lines. I understand many have agendas but can we hold off porking things up based on how we've all chosen to read the article?

Not quite - Gil has publically said he got it a week ago.  Hawthorn said they got it  2 weeks ago and contacted the AFL without specifying when. Hard to imagine they'd sit on it for too .long.

 

[daisycutter 28,435]

25 minutes ago, george_on_the_outer said:

Probably because names were named in the report, but de-identified for public consumption.

strange though that three coaches were explicitly named yet had not been questioned or offered a right of reply 

not implying anything other than lack of consistency 

[redandbluemakepurple 317]

59 minutes ago, Lucifers Hero said:

I wonder what skeletons are in our closet in our treatment of indigenous players?  Didn't Davey, Wanaemirri, Jurrah (and maybe othres) have issues with Neeld? 

Wanaemirri didn't come back after 2011 and Jurrah lost his way.  Their departures may not in any way be connected to Neeld but there was some noise about his treatment of them at the time.

MFC should get Wrecker to talk to the past indigenous players to find out.  Best to take it on the chin.

[Gawndy the Great 7,246]

4 minutes ago, redandbluemakepurple said:

It doesn't need to proved beyond a reasonable doubt like criminal cases.  The AFL just needs to be confident.  For damages claim, I understand that the criteria is the balance of probabilities despite what the judge on the Rebel Wilson case said.   I am sure a lawyer will correct me if applicable.

But if Clarkson or Fagan is stood down on the basis of this report, he will rightfully sue for wrongful termination , which would need to be heard in court and the body evidence required will most likely be higher. 

[old dee 22,803]

I have not read all the stuff today and I probably won’t it’s too depressing.

can someone tell me who broke the story ? Seems Hawthorn have had the report for two weeks. Did the AFL only find out this morning? If not where they sitting on it till after the GF? 

[sue 8,403]

9 minutes ago, old dee said:

I have not read all the stuff today and I probably won’t it’s too depressing.

can someone tell me who broke the story ? Seems Hawthorn have had the report for two weeks. Did the AFL only find out this morning? If not where they sitting on it till after the GF? 

Gil said he had it a week

Edit: about a week.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/sep/21/afl-investigates-claims-hawthorn-separated-first-nations-players-from-families-and-called-for-pregnancy-termination

AFL chief executive Gillon McLachlan said the governing body had received the report “about a week ago”.

Edited September 21, 2022 by sue

[Demonland 64,361]

 

[Sir Why You Little 34,405]

32 minutes ago, Jibroni said:

Bad decision by Brisbane to stand down Fagan, what if he is cleared of these allegations?

I wonder why the ABC did not hear both sides of the story before going public. Some people in the media would want to be very careful about what they say about this. Private conversations without any evidence of the actual conversation will have every lawyer lining up on behalf of Fagan and Clarko for damages for slander. Shocking if this is fact but I tend to think there are two sides to every story, especially emotive ones.

I am sure Russell Jackson has researched this article very thoroughly before publication. 
The consequences of misinformation is just too high. 
Russell has written some very serious pieces since 2020

[WalkingCivilWar 31,107]

2 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

Not so independent, after all. 

[Demonland 64,361]

 

[Supermercado 2,609]

Tempting to lay the boots into other clubs but I'd be surprised if every club in the league didn't have skeletons in the closet. Even if you take race out of the story, how many other young players have had similar experiences after being drafted?

[sue 8,403]

1 minute ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Not so independent, after all. 

Well perhaps he has taken leave so he can have time to be interrogated.

[Demonland 64,361]

 

[rpfc 27,384]

4 hours ago, rpfc said:

And this may be why having 5 white former cops in the AFL Integrity Unit (in Jimmy Carr’s voice) is maybe not the best idea…

@ding and @faultydet you can throw up all you like but what biases and preconceptions do you think that unit takes into its investigations and reports?

Like FMD, there is a massive segment of Australian society who will admit there are issues but not admit the underlying causes, effects or impacts, or any remedies.

Just a message of “why are you making a thing of it?” and excuses or portrayed grievance and victimisation. 

[Sir Why You Little 34,405]

5 minutes ago, WalkingCivilWar said:

Not so independent, after all. 

Nobody has made any noise yet. All just stepped down quietly….

the original article stands up so far

edit: Clarkson has refuted the article

Edited September 21, 2022 by Sir Why You Little

[Demonland 64,361]

 

[Demonland 64,361]

 

[DeeMee 731]

Common theme emerging from contemporary players, coaches and admin is that nobody knew “nuffen”.

I wonder going forward if we will be able to discern between commentary from real journalists to that of AFL journalists.

[John Demonic 4,781]

Michael Long doesn't really come out of this looking great either. Oddly seemed to be doing a lot of victim blaming of Cyril in the media earlier in the year and downplaying that there was any racism at Hawthorn because other players hadn't said anything.

Of course here on DL, we already knew Long was a person of questionable character on the field

 

https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/riolis-racism-row-takes-another-turn-as-afl-great-says-cyril-needs-help/news-story/8a1c8d7be737fcbf3e7a3c191b154958

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/afl/article-10699129/AFL-Indigenous-groundbreaker-Michael-Long-says-nephew-Cyril-Rioli-needs-professional-help.html

Edited September 21, 2022 by John Demonic