CHANGES: Rd 18 vs Port Adelaide

[leave it to deever 15,315]

22 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

194cm aggressive key forward who loves nothing but to crash packs and launch at the footy. From a physical size point of view he's ready to go, It'll be more around the step up in terms of AFL intensity and match fitness.

Not only that, he's got some serious jukes on him for such a young kid. His contesting marking was elite at under 18 level and from what I've seen of him this year that's carried into VFL level.

His stats alone at VFL level this year speaks for itself.

10 games 20.7 goals and averaging 4.3 marks per game.

Small glimpse.

 

Thanks Dazzle

What have we got to lose at this stage?

[Sydee 3,613]

27 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

194cm aggressive key forward who loves nothing but to crash packs and launch at the footy. From a physical size point of view he's ready to go, It'll be more around the step up in terms of AFL intensity and match fitness.

Not only that, he's got some serious jukes on him for such a young kid. His contesting marking was elite at under 18 level and from what I've seen of him this year that's carried into VFL level.

His stats alone at VFL level this year speaks for itself.

10 games 20.7 goals and averaging 4.3 marks per game.

Small glimpse.

 

Let's just keep some perspective - that game against Nth he kicked six (Weid also got six I think and his goals apart from the nice mark from JVR were arguably more impressive) - That Nth side was,  to be kind, not very strong. JVR's stats ex that games show he's kicking just over 1 goal per game - I'm not suggesting he doesn't have potential (I do like him as prospective AFL player) but physically I don't believe he is ready to impact at senior level yet 

[Sydee 3,613]

8 minutes ago, leave it to deever said:

Thanks Dazzle

What have we got to lose at this stage?

M Brown kicks bags in the VFL regularly - gets promoted and can't deliver at AFL level 

There is a trend here - the leap is huge from VFL to AFL listen to any debutant such as Turner recently 

[forever demons 1,810]

Love to know whats up with May ,resting an AA back is not ideal but he looks like he needs it.He was out of sorts last night for sure

[Sydee 3,613]

35 minutes ago, Deespicable said:

Goody said the audit would come and hopefully with a 10-day break both he and the selectors do some tinkering.

The first and biggest decision is deciding if they can continue to just attack via the left-hand side. I know we have three left footers down back but it was embarrassing watching our lack of variety and inability to switch play. If we are sticking with that line of attack, then you have to go back to another big up front to present down that line. The obvious fix to this is to either use a right-footer such as Brayshaw on kick-ins or to provide a fun incentive reward for May to switch to the right at least once a quarter.

We looked slow against the Cats and we also did against the Pies in Rd 13. We altered our mix after Rd 13 to have an extra small forward to solve the pace problem - Bedford was added - but unfortunately in a pressure-cooker game (and they all will be from here) it didn't work and we just looked small and ineffectual.

So the first thing is that it's back to three small forwards (not four). The other thing is that we looked slow in our ball movement from down back and at the same time didn't have enough bodies (extras) around the stoppages. 

At least one of Rivers or Hunt must return to our back seven because we have to have more drive from the back. If that means Bowey has to sit out for a few weeks, then so be it. The thing with Hunt is that he cannot be left on last line in a one-on-one contest because he's not that sort of player as we saw against Sydney. Hibberd or Salem or Brayshaw have to take whichever small forward is playing close to goals. I'll be interested to see if the hunger has returned with Rivers after a few weeks out and we will know after tonight's VFL game I suspect.

As to stoppages, Harmes has to be in the middle more often. Yes he's not as classy as Trac and Olly, but we need his grunt work more than ever in the lead-up to the finals and together with Viney they can provide shutdown roles as well.

Finally, we need a bit of excitement among the group and that invariably comes with a first-gamer. Hopefully either Lawrie or Van Rooyen plays well enough in the VFL tonight to warrant a debut. 

I am also hopeful that we are spending a bit more than two nights in the Alice as right now our young guys need to have a break from what is an incredibly cold winter. Sure the guys with kids may prefer to stay put with their families, but this is a great chance to get some endurance training in along with some team-bonding with peripheral players.

In: (subject to decent games in VFL) Weid or (Van Rooyen), Hunt or Rivers (maybe even both), Lawrie (if he has a good game in VFL).

Out: Bedford or Spargo (you cannot drop Kossie for the Alice Springs game), Olly (if thumb broken) or Sparrow (if Lawrie plays well in VFL), Bowey and possibly Hibberd (if Rivers plays a blinder in VFL).

Ins: Why Weid ? in what role? - he has failed time and time again as a forward. For Jackson? - he was comprehensively beaten by Stanley and looked like a man with one foot out the door 
JVR is not ready if you ask me and I've watched a lot of Casey this year
Hunt/Rivers seem to both be serving time at Casey for poor disposal or not playing their role - haven't seem much recently to warrant a recall
Laurie is a clever footballer and has quite good skills but doesn't get enough possessions at VFL for the role he plays imo - he is also quite slow so that is going to be a real challenge when/if he steps up to the faster pace at senior level 

Outs: Spargo is usually dependable to use possessions to our advantage - going nowhere
If Oliver is injured he may need to sit out but didn't seem too fussed walking around after the game
Hibberb was one a our few decent players last night - he is very safe 
Bowey has been a bit disappointing but the reasons he has been disappointing are probably the same reasons Hunt and Rivers are at Casey so is a change here any upgrade ?

[Ham 741]

Couldn't agree more @Sydee in regards to JVR, the skill jump from VFL to AFL has never been any bigger. 

I've highlighted it before, but JVR is always taken by the #2 or #3 defender at VFL level, which is so unbelievably subpar in comparison to what he'll receive at AFL level. 

[picket fence 15,097]

46 minutes ago, Sydee said:

I've watched quite a lot of Casey this season and I am a believer that in time JVR could be a good footballer at AFL level - his time is not now if want my opinion. To me he is a bit like a Jack Darling or Jack Riewoldt - he does have good hands and seems to know where the goals are. He is not particularly quick for his size (but not slow either) he does seem to like the physical contest - this being a real positive because some of our other tall forward options don't seem keen or capable in that area.

The reason he is not quite ready for AFL imo is that to play like the Jack's mentioned above you have to be physically strong enough. He has put on size this season so his body will keep getting stronger but the step to AFL is a very big one. I also think he will benefit from another preseason where he can build a bigger fitness base so he can run at pace for longer periods of the game - this is critical for a forward of his height.   

There are too many posters on this site calling for mass changes after last night which obviously was a disappointing performance - we were our pressured by a team that wanted to win more and given that pressure we turned the ball over too easily. Changing personnel is not the answer - changing mindset is. Yes there are a couple of players that could arguably be replaced this week but for me there were only a few that played to their true capacity and we can't change 75% of the team

Form at Casey doesn't really translate to AFL level we have seen that time and time again with the likes of Weid, M Brown, Baker and even Tomlinson. Chandler is another that performs well at Casey but can't replicate that at senior level (yet). People need to understand that players like RIvers and Hunt are probably at Casey because their disposal has been sub par - based on last nights performance the last thing we need is players who are prone to turning the ball over consistently. 

Sorry for the long winded answer but for me JVR is going to be a player but I'd be reluctant to through him to the wolves now unless we have totally lost faith in BB and Fritta

Can agree with Dazzle Uncle, but would add, that as my training reports revealed he has the following attributes

1 Can flly for one grab pack marks

2 Can kixk freakish goals

3 Puts himself in dangerous positions.

Ive seen enough, rime to Blood him

[Sydee 3,613]

1 minute ago, picket fence said:

Can agree with Dazzle Uncle, but would add, that as my training reports revealed he has the following attributes

1 Can flly for one grab pack marks

2 Can kixk freakish goals

3 Puts himself in dangerous positions.

Ive seen enough, rime to Blood him

Strange he is not kicking 3 or 4 each week consistently at Casey then 

[whatwhat say what 18,891]

12 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Careful with those stats they include playing on from a kick out.

Rhyss Shaw always had magnificent stats

may more often than not takes our kick outs

[Diamond_Jim 11,736]

15 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

may more often than not takes our kick outs

Salem takes a fair few

Frankly kick outs should be excluded from disposals as they skew the stats

[deelusions from afar 1,608]

Was a very disappointing game but I think some of the suggestions for changes are a fair way off the mark.  Eg Spargo didn't get much of it - but we did struggle to get it out of our defence.  He's one of the few that is reliable with ball in hand.  Equally Bowey got caught out a few times but our defence was under enormous pressure.

For me it is not about the personnel, it is about the effort.  Geelong came to play and their tackling pressure was very impressive.  Trac, Clarry and Viney all played well individually but Geelong killed our onball brigade as a whole.

If this were round 20-23 I'd be concerned but it's not.  Maybe it's fools hope but we timed our run to perfection last year and there's no reason we won't be doing the same this year.  The Brisbane game showed we still have it.  

Our game relies on significant effort and pressure.  Clearly it's not possible to bring it every week of the season.  If we don't bring it, we are just an ok side.  But when we bring it, we are almost invincible.  

[DeeZee 6,731]

I think there are one or two spots available if someone really can put their hand up for Casey this week.

Rivers or Hunt could be back in contention or Chandler.

Interesting to see which tall stands up out if JVR, Weed and M.Brown.

 

Edited July 8, 2022 by DeeZee

[old55 21,257]

Jordon has been great on the wing and Gus has been great down back. I wouldn't change this.  Maybe Rivers or Hunt in more defensive roles for Bowey and let Salem free a little more.

Sparrow was down last night but he too has been playing well. I prefer him to Dunstan.

Amazing how including Bedford against Brisbane two weeks ago was genius but now many want him out. I think we need to stay the course there and look for more from Jackson and Max forward.  ANB has been in good form. Maybe Chandler for Spargo, but it's not a major game changing difference.

Edited July 8, 2022 by old55

[dazzledavey36 48,706]

2 hours ago, Sydee said:

M Brown kicks bags in the VFL regularly - gets promoted and can't deliver at AFL level 

There is a trend here - the leap is huge from VFL to AFL listen to any debutant such as Turner recently 

 

2 hours ago, Sydee said:

Let's just keep some perspective - that game against Nth he kicked six (Weid also got six I think and his goals apart from the nice mark from JVR were arguably more impressive) - That Nth side was,  to be kind, not very strong. JVR's stats ex that games show he's kicking just over 1 goal per game - I'm not suggesting he doesn't have potential (I do like him as prospective AFL player) but physically I don't believe he is ready to impact at senior level yet 

Agree to disagree. 

Could mount a strong case why I think he's potentially ready for AFL action but I can't be [censored] lol.

Looking forward to watching him tonight though and a few others pushing for selection. 

[Sydee 3,613]

3 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

 

Agree to disagree. 

Could mount a strong case why I think he's potentially ready for AFL action but I can't be [censored] lol.

Looking forward to watching him tonight though and a few others pushing for selection. 

If it was a strong case why only "potentially ready" ?

Anyway, happy to have a different view that's ok - I think we both would love to see him play very well tonight and give the selectors plenty to think about 

[dazzledavey36 48,706]

Just now, Sydee said:

If it was a strong case why only "potentially ready" ?

Anyway, happy to have a different view that's ok - I think we both would love to see him play very well tonight and give the selectors plenty to think about 

Well yeah I worded that wrong. Imo I personally think he's ready full stop.

[layzie 28,683]

Really don't think wholesale changes are going to fix things 

[1964_2 2,357]

15 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

We either need to play Gawn/Jackson forward more when they're not rucking, or we need to pick Weideman until TMac's back. We can't be that small forward of the ball.

Bowey and Salem both struggled tonight. With Rivers and Hunt out of the side, there is competition for their spots.

I'm not convinced by Bedford. His Brisbane game was good but he is too fumbly under pressure and with our run home, we're copping pressure each week. 

If teams are going to copy Geel, and not bomb it anywhere near Gawn then he needs to play as a 70-80% permanent forward. 

I don’t think we would miss much, not having his hit-outs 

[old dee 22,843]

Tmac in.

Oh that's right he is out for the year .

Back to crying in my beer.

[Bates Mate 3,818]

3 hours ago, Fat Tony said:

I am coming around to thinking we need to give Weideman time to get confidence and find form if we are going to win the flag.

Biggest thing that he needs to work on with our coaches and b.brown is positioning and leading patterns. Everytime he has played as second tall him and brown are competing for the same ball in the air and getting in each other's way. Tmac and brown don't have this problem

Edited July 8, 2022 by Bates Mate
.

[Fat Tony 4,398]

45 minutes ago, old55 said:

Jordon has been great on the wing and Gus has been great down back. I wouldn't change this.  Maybe Rivers or Hunt in more defensive roles for Bowey and let Salem free a little more.

Sparrow was down last night but he too has been playing well. I prefer him to Dunstan.

Amazing how including Bedford against Brisbane two weeks ago was genius but now many want him out. I think we need to stay the course there and look for more from Jackson and Max forward.  ANB has been in good form. Maybe Chandler for Spargo, but it's not a major game changing difference.

Agree on Jordon, Brayshaw, Bowey and Sparrow.

The key question the coaching staff needs to ask is if we can win the flag without another tall forward. Bedford played well against the Lions but we dominated the midfield battle and this was the key. Last night, when we failed in the middle, we could have used another tall target. I think we need to give Weideman an extended run to get him confident and marking well.

[Swooper1987 2,745]

It's a long break until the next game.  A lot can happen in 10 days.  I'd be expecting minimal changes. The reality is most of the next in line blokes in the VFL have been tried and fallen short.  Maybe Rivers or Hunt gets a call up.  Bowey and Salem both off at the moment.  Bedford looked ordinary last night, but the other small forwards struggled too.  Goody tends to back his lads in.  There'll be a big response against Port.  We play Traeger Park well.

[DubDee 20,536]

In - Hunt and Weed

Out - Bowey, Spargo

adds speed in the back half and height in the front half. Kozzi, Bedford, ANB could be enough smalls

[Fat Tony 4,398]

1 minute ago, Bates Mate said:

Biggest thing that he needs to work on with our coaches and b.brown is positioning and leading patterns. Everytime he has played as second tall him and brown are competing for the same ball in the air and getting in each other's way. Tmac and brown sunny have this problem

Having two talls up in packs is deliberate and part of the game plan. 

[Neil Crompton 4,716]

2 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

Having two talls up in packs is deliberate and part of the game plan. 

Please tell me why that is. 
Here’s an idea - what if they spread out instead and offered a choice of 2 targets rather than one dirty big pack, where our mids and smalls never seem to prosper from the failed pack mark?