Farewell Luke Jackson

[Demon3 2,541]

45 minutes ago, 1964_2 said:

Or he has a cold or flu, like over half the people in Vic currently do. 

Yep, entirely possible, as is stress from his place of employment, like lots of people do.

[Lucifers Hero 36,983]

46 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

If that's true, that is incredibly disappointing given Cerra was keen to come to us last year.

FFS why would Jackson do that when he knew we were trying to court a Freo player?! 

It probably wasn't Jackson's doing.  The trade period was barely a few weeks after the GF so not a good time to approach him nor would they want to pay the price of an in contract player, effectively lose 2021 pick 6 for Cerra plus whatever else we may have wanted.

If @Ethan Tremblayinfo is correct, it would make sense for Freo to wait to plant the seed in the preseason.  That way Freo get pick 6 and get Jackson.

Methinks you are pointing the finger at the wrong party.

Edited July 26, 2022 by Lucifers Hero

[Lucifers Hero 36,983]

17 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Whispers there was a gentleman’s agreement before the season commenced, between LJ and Fremantle. Given Fremantle’s (unforeseen) form, I’m wondering if they’ve attempted to change any of the terms within the (unsigned) contract. 

There may be quite some truth in that.

Looking back at the start of this thread, in early Oct that he was ready to sign was reported by some well credentialed posters. 

Jackson spent the post GF time training in Perth due to covid travel restrictions in WA.  Plenty of time for Freo to interfere with his contract negotiations with the dees. 

It seems they succeeded:  in early December it was reported in this thread that contract talks went on hold.

[Lucifers Hero 36,983]

17 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Whispers there was a gentleman’s agreement before the season commenced, between LJ and Fremantle. Given Fremantle’s (unforeseen) form, I’m wondering if they’ve attempted to change any of the terms within the (unsigned) contract. 

In what way might Freo's form have caused a change in the discussed contract terms:  better?  worse?

[monoccular 16,010]

21 hours ago, david_neitz_is_my_dad said:

Most of the AFL management are invested BIG into the ponies

The head honcho and polo ponies, I believe.

19 hours ago, one_demon said:

Deleted 

I agree entirely.

19 hours ago, 1964_2 said:

Or he has a cold or flu, like over half the people in Vic currently do. 

Let's hope it is not the dreaded 'rona 🇨🇳🦠shared with the playing group.

Edited July 27, 2022 by monoccular

[dazzledavey36 48,642]

Can someone who can open this give a brief summary?

 

[Lord Nev 13,511]

5 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Can someone who can open this give a brief summary?

 

Just mostly Gus' quotes from SEN.

Says Freo have apparently offered Gus a deal that "could be worth" 800k per year over 5 years.

Nothing new about Jacko.

Edited July 27, 2022 by Lord Nev

[david_neitz_is_my_dad 3,925]

How the [censored] can they get both Jackson and Gus? Cooking the books?

[Deenooos_ 647]

They can [censored] off tbh. They are so desperate to copy and be like us. Freo won’t be able to compensate us fairly if they both leave. 
 

say what you want but all this crap is going to define our season and if we go back to back. Unless this gets resolved within two weeks or Gus stays I think it’ll rattle the club. If both announce they’re leaving what is that going to do to our playing group onfield over the final rounds snd finals? Nothing good dare I say.

so over it.

Edited July 27, 2022 by Deenooos_

[ChaserJ 3,956]

8 minutes ago, david_neitz_is_my_dad said:

How the [censored] can they get both Jackson and Gus? Cooking the books?

Fire sale on their experienced players. They have to get Lobb off the list, Mundy’s OOC, Logue  could go and many of the rest are quite young and on affordable contracts.

[JimmyGadson 3,455]

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

[Davos 734]

16 minutes ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

I'm a perennial optimist, and I won't be losing sleep if either/both of Gus and Jacko leave for the above reasons. Ideally we keep them both, but I'd be hesitant to pay Gus overs even if Jacko left. 

It's funny, prior to winning a flag I always thought I'd be content with winning one, even if it meant we were terrible for 10 years thereafter. Now, having finally got there, I'm excited by the prospect of finishing top 4 and contending every year for the next 10 years. I look at Geelong, and although I loathe them, I have to respect how they've managed to put themselves in contention for about 15 years straight. That is an absurd run. There's a chance both leaving can result in us extending our competitive window well into the future, not only by enabling us to bring in talent via the draft (assuming Freo can maneuver their way into at least 1 top 10 pick, plus another first rounder for Jacko), but also by freeing up cap space to chase stars who become available in the future. 

We're in a potential win-win situation here folks. Let's just chill and and see how it plays out.

[layzie 28,488]

Losing both would be crap. 

[Binmans PA 25,892]

3 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

I'm increasingly of this view as well and I'm beginning to wonder if the club is too...

Edited July 27, 2022 by A F

[BW511 2,236]

2 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

I am sure the club would have this front and centre in their mind.

It would be frustrating to lose two established players but from a business perspective, they have the currency to transform into 3-4 very good players who would keep us in the upper echelon well beyond the careers of Gawn, May, Lever etc

Edited July 27, 2022 by BW511

[Longsufferingnomore 1,457]

My logical self is telling me they are both gone otherwise how did they get Oliver's and Trac's contracts done without knowing what it was going to take to keep both Jackson and Gus. If they know that Jackson is gone they are either not going to pay overs to Gus as he seems to be asking for or he is gone as well. They are not going to announce prior to the finals that one or both players are off. Imagine we are playing Freo in a final. How would those players feel if they have left something on the table to retain one or both. I think justifiably "annoyed" and so where does it leave team cohesion. Of course do we boo or applaud. I will be muttering under my breath something about traitors and Sc...ly!

Now my illogical self tells me that they both love the Club and Maxy and have signed on but the Club is keeping it Mum to give us a huge boost just before the finals🤐😭

[Diamond_Jim 11,676]

3 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

Picks 14 and 16 for a pick 3 at 20 years old on one of the league's biggest ever contracts and NAB rising star winner.

Nowhere near enough

[layzie 28,488]

33 minutes ago, Longsufferingnomore said:

My logical self is telling me they are both gone otherwise how did they get Oliver's and Trac's contracts done without knowing what it was going to take to keep both Jackson and Gus. If they know that Jackson is gone they are either not going to pay overs to Gus as he seems to be asking for or he is gone as well. They are not going to announce prior to the finals that one or both players are off. Imagine we are playing Freo in a final. How would those players feel if they have left something on the table to retain one or both. I think justifiably "annoyed" and so where does it leave team cohesion. Of course do we boo or applaud. I will be muttering under my breath something about traitors and Sc...ly!

Now my illogical self tells me that they both love the Club and Maxy and have signed on but the Club is keeping it Mum to give us a huge boost just before the finals🤐😭

I was the same with the Gus interview yesterday. One minute thinking he could surprise us with an early re-signing and that was all a smokescreen and the next minute thinking he's priming us gently for his departure by saying how big this decision is. 

[Lucifers Hero 36,983]

3 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

It is a good plan.

Might just mention Freo don't have a round 2 or round 3 pick this year to trade with Brisbane.  They will have once they trade out players.   But the result you suggest can still be achieved by Freo giving us their 2023 first round pick as well as this year's.

And throw in Meek!

Edited July 27, 2022 by Lucifers Hero

[tiers 2,761]

I note that Dogga's form recently has not enhanced his value. Does this affect his re-signing?

[cantstandyasam 700]

2 minutes ago, layzie said:

I was the same with the Gus interview yesterday. One minute thinking he could surprise us with an early re-signing and that was all a smokescreen and the next minute thinking he's priming us gently for his departure by saying how big this decision is. 

I'm over this. All I want is Melbourne to be a force. Play hard ball and get the best deals. It is wrong to drag it out so much. I'm getting to the stage that I don't care if they leave as long as we make Freo or whoever pay overs.

[layzie 28,488]

6 minutes ago, cantstandyasam said:

I'm over this. All I want is Melbourne to be a force. Play hard ball and get the best deals. It is wrong to drag it out so much. I'm getting to the stage that I don't care if they leave as long as we make Freo or whoever pay overs.

It is interesting how they do it in NRL with players signing for other teams during the season. Possibly it is all out in the open and allows them to focus on the game? Someone more in the know on NRL might be able to shed light on this but I'd like to know how often teams win the premiership when their star players sign with other clubs during the season. Off the top of my head Cooper Cronk with the Storm was one. 

Edited July 27, 2022 by layzie

[John Crow Batty 8,221]

4 minutes ago, layzie said:

It is interesting how they do it in NRL with players signing for other teams during the season. Possibly it is all out in the open and allows them to focus on the game? Someone more in the know on NRL might be able to shed light on this but I'd like to know how often teams win the premiership when their star players sign with other clubs during the season. Off the top of my head Cooper Cronk with the Storm was one. 

NRL and Union are entirely different sporting cultures. Far more mercenary and unemotional. Not sure why such a radical difference but it is what it is. Perhaps something to do with players having a worldwide market to play in.

Edited July 27, 2022 by John Crow Batty

[Lord Travis 10,141]

3 hours ago, JimmyGadson said:

Let's think about this. 

Let's say if Gus left as well, we'd get a late first rounder/early second rounder as compensation. 

Jackson leaves, Freo have pick 14 atm. 

Brisbane have pick 16 as it stands and are likely going to want Ashcroft as a father/son so will require points so there's possibilities there for Freo to get Brisbanes first round pick for a swap of later picks. 

Imagine what could be done with three first round picks for us. Whether that's trading up the draft, targeting an established player or hitting the draft as is. There are so many possibilities. And you've got to back our recruiters in given their history. 

I'd be looking at this as a chance to hit the first round hard again, be super aggressive and consolidate our list with another crop of young talent. What an opportunity. We know we'll demand overs for Jackson. 

Can you imagine if we landed another Oliver? A McKay or Curnow type and a De Koning? 

Trust in Jase Taylor. 

It's a reasonable line of thinking and is the likely outcome at this stage I believe. It would leave us with picks 14, 16, 20ish. Unless we packaged them up to get a solitary high pick then they're not great picks IMO. We used picks 3 and 12 (really pick 10 but bumped back after academy bids matched) to get Jackson and Kozzie. Freo used picks 7 and 8 to get Young and Serong. If we'd had 14, 16, 20 in that draft we would've got Miles Bergman, Cooper Stephens, and Sam Philip. Hardly regenerating a list compared to either of those top 10 combos. Picks outside the top 10 are still a very low hit rate, even with all the advancement in recruiting. 

Not having a go and I agree your line of thinking is the most positive outcome. In my opinion though unless we get top 5-10 picks, we're going to be worse off. We're just trying the make the most of the poor hand we've been dealt and will likely have a net result of a weaker playing list if they're taken to draft. If there were proven key forwards on the market then I'd be trading those picks without a second. Picks at draft are overrated in my view though. Losing Brayshaw, an All Australian level half back in his prime, for a 10% chance at a best 22 player seems like a horrible deal. Take the proven player every time.

[John Crow Batty 8,221]

14 minutes ago, tiers said:

I note that Dogga's form recently has not enhanced his value. Does this affect his re-signing?

Not if he has an agreement already done. A suitor might want him to take it easy and look after himself.