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POSTGAME: Rd 16 vs GWS



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I only caught the second half but wasn’t impressed by much. We have relied on our defence to win us games by the opposition giving us easy exits out and steamrolling it forward on the slingshot. Opponents have worked this out and are now either lowering their eyes or at least putting it to dangerous spots that make it hard for Lever and May to mark it. 

On the flip side we had SOOOOOOO many good opportunities to pinch this game but absolutely disgusting and inexcusable misses cost us. I liked Hunts run and endeavour but he needed to learn from his previous mistakes and pull the trigger at the right moment. So many balls into targets that we either outsized or outmatched in numbers. We had good forward connection early in the year, that has seemed to completely fail us now. 

TMac played a very good game as a CHF/FF but if he’s playing as high up the ground as he was today then we need a proper tall forward for him to hit up. 

Was this the first game we lost at selection? If BBB plays a solid game this weekend then get him in the team. 

We don’t have to finish top of the pops, but we have to get top 4 to really give ourselves a shot at the premiership. 

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35 minutes ago, WA Demon Boy said:

We need to do something about Viney

Our forward line will come

But with Viney we simply can't have him for another 4 years 

I would seriously consider shipping him off 

 

I reckon his feet are stuffed.

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Structurally we lack marking power up forward. TMac showed his value today up field gathering kicks and kicking into the 50 metre area. The resting ruckman be it max or Jackson don't take enough marks up forward and are not creative enough as forwards. Another marking option is needed. Fritta should be a marking option but not the tall target or pack mark. We saw it last week and again today. Spargo, Neal-Bullen and Sparrow are all role players not creative goal scorers. Picket has been that livelier dangerous forward but he is having a form slump, it happens. 

The lesson can be seen with the dogs, cats and lions who all have 2 key marking targets and a classy flanker at ground level who is good over head

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The pressure acts stat is now up on the AFL website.

Viney again leading the way for us with 24. Pickett third for us with 21. ANB 15, but Spargo only 8.

Spargo also had 0 tackles inside 50 (Viney had 2, Harmes, Pickett, ANB and Gawn had 1 each).

ANB 4 score involvements, Pickett 3, Spargo 2.

These are some key metrics that I'd suggest the FD will be looking closely at for our small forwards and, I think, spell trouble for Spargo.

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6 minutes ago, Pates said:

I only caught the second half but wasn’t impressed by much. We have relied on our defence to win us games by the opposition giving us easy exits out and steamrolling it forward on the slingshot. Opponents have worked this out and are now either lowering their eyes or at least putting it to dangerous spots that make it hard for Lever and May to mark it. 

On the flip side we had SOOOOOOO many good opportunities to pinch this game but absolutely disgusting and inexcusable misses cost us. I liked Hunts run and endeavour but he needed to learn from his previous mistakes and pull the trigger at the right moment. So many balls into targets that we either outsized or outmatched in numbers. We had good forward connection early in the year, that has seemed to completely fail us now. 

TMac played a very good game as a CHF/FF but if he’s playing as high up the ground as he was today then we need a proper tall forward for him to hit up. 

Was this the first game we lost at selection? If BBB plays a solid game this weekend then get him in the team. 

We don’t have to finish top of the pops, but we have to get top 4 to really give ourselves a shot at the premiership. 

This isn't correct, at all.

GWS didn't "work us out". Lever and May both took 5 intercept marks (for comparison, Davis took 4 and Haynes 3).

GWS didn't "work out" how to break down our defence. They scored 9.10.64, their second lowest score for the season and fourth lowest number of scoring shots. 19 scoring shots against is right about our average, too.

This wasn't lost because they "worked out" how to break down our defence, this was lost because we couldn't get our hands on the ball in the middle and we couldn't kick goals from the time we did spend in our forward half.

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2 hours ago, No Plan B said:

Sadly this is going to prove to be the game that costs us Top 4. We'll drop to 5th when Port beat us. Still have West Coast in Perth and Geelong in the Cattery after that. [censored]. This is a slightly modified 2017 all over again. 

BBB would have easily been able to milk a couple of frees or take a couple of marks on the lead and that's the difference right there, but the arrogance of Goodwin has cost us big time. 

The "ARROGANCE" of Goodwin and selectors..... Yep Nailed it f or me!

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TMAC works hard up the ground, clunks the marks and then wheels around to kick to......?
Ben Brown has to come in.

Fritsch can hold his head up. A really good return to form. That was a clear mark in front of goal early in the last quarter that wasn't paid. (thanks ump no. 6)

Our forward line is as functional as the National Party. The amount of times I watched blokes in front of goal getting in each others way was distressing. Thank god for our wall down back.

Hunt and the rest of them were probably told at the last break to hold that forward entry until they were certain they had the right option. He busted his guts. Twice that he was penalised in the last he actually did hand pass it off but was penalised anyway. (thanks ump no. 6 again)

Our captain was punched in the back of the head and went down again (thanks mummy). Our team needs to start being a bit more grubby IMHO

We can't keep expecting to win games by playing one quarter of football. Our midfield sucked.

  

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Posted (edited)

It’s unfortunate for Hunt that he hesitated and got caught a few times in the last quarter. Can’t blame the loss on him though. He was asked to play a different position suddenly after a preseason and 15 matches into a season, and yet he still took the game on and looked more dangerous that any forward bar Fritta. Pickett has been MIA for weeks and should be judged far harder than someone who’s getting involved and looking dangerous. Spargo was poor with his defensive pressure today too. There have been some serious passengers the past few weeks. Hunt isn’t one of them.

We were shocking today to be honest. Our midfield got dominated for three quarters and our forward line was utterly dysfunctional. It’s bizarre we only lost by 9 points and sit top of the ladder, yet we look in real trouble. If we can’t pinch wins against at least some of Port, Dogs, Cats or Eagles in the run home, then we’re not going to finish top four. We’ve also had a dream run with injuries this year. If we lost Lever or May for finals then we’re likely out in straights sets. 

A lot to work on now. Let’s see how we respond against Port. If we go in with an unchanged forward line then I’ll blow my brains out.

Edited by Lord Travis
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Posted (edited)

There’s a few things that frustrated me about today and the last 3-4 weeks.

We’ve drifted away from the team first mentality that seemed to be the catalyst for our early season form. So many examples today of poor decision making based on an individual wanting to be the hero.

The last quarter provided us plenty of chances to win the game but we came unstuck with guys being too cute, trying to take on one too many or simply helping each other through situations. Hunt will cop some heat for his efforts but he was trying to make the play and there wasn’t anyone giving him any better options - either by instruction or by leading at him with some real intent.

FFS, We got to the position we are in by doing the simple things well.

A few specific examples from today that really infuriated me;

Petracca stopping on the spot when he takes a mark or gets a free kick. Then waiting, then going back and going over the mark anyway. That’s under 12’s stuff.

Harmes and his obsession with trying to break a tackle. Whoever is encouraging him to take the game on is undoing all our hard work.

Viney coming in well underdone - I don’t believe he commands an immediate spot in our side after a long layoff, even at his best. If Ben Brown can’t get a gig after actually performing his role at the lower level, then its culture killing to think Viney can come in off some limited match simulation.

The last one is a bit controversial but I’ll go with it anyway. Our game plan is starting to unravel like years gone by because it’s incredibly taxing. We may be fitter (allegedly)  than every side, but we’re not mentally ready to do it for a whole year.

The real defensive based game style we’ve played the last few weeks is a bit puzzling. We’re trying to play safe and we don’t have the cattle for it. 

Season is on the line now, I’ll be interested to see the response from the coaches and the players

Edited by BW511
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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

The pressure acts stat is now up on the AFL website.

Viney again leading the way for us with 24. Pickett third for us with 21. ANB 15, but Spargo only 8.

Spargo also had 0 tackles inside 50 (Viney had 2, Harmes, Pickett, ANB and Gawn had 1 each).

ANB 4 score involvements, Pickett 3, Spargo 2.

These are some key metrics that I'd suggest the FD will be looking closely at for our small forwards and, I think, spell trouble for Spargo.

I really do not give a stuff about Vineys "Pressure" acts, Rugby players rack up those stats all the time. What skill does he actually bring to the table that will assist in us going forward particularly in finals???? Overated and injuries have made him very mediocre!

Edited by picket fence
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If Tmac is going to roam up the ground consistently then I would suggest we pic a forward who stays in the f50 and can mark and KICK STRAIGHT. 

We were lucky last week given our in accuracy but this week we paid the price. 

Goal kicking practice and picking a forward let’s say BB is a priority this week. 

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Unfortunately I went to the QB in Sydney and to the G today. It was essentially the same game. No intensity. No pressure. 

We are a poor kicking side. We were out played. Our midfield pressure was absent.

Our defence cannot play one on one and the target is usually hit at 45m from goal.

It wouldn't have mattered today who the FF was, there was no time and space and our skills are poor. We need to send a message that there are spots available for those who want to give their all. Not just pick and choose.

Great game Salo

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I am still bloody angry about how we let this game slip. Still shows we have a long way to go. 

We ain’t gunna win anything this season if we continue to play like we did today. 

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4 minutes ago, one_demon said:

Relax.  Every team has a slump at some stage during the season. Better to have the slump now than at finals time. 

The problem is where are we going to be in the finals… we have been up and down for a while. And if we don’t get top 4 from 12 and 2 - that Goodwin thread will be get a workout…

We had more I50s than score - that is the stuff of recent nightmares…

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, one_demon said:

Relax.  Every team has a slump at some stage during the season. 

I agree.
But can't just expect the backline to hold the joint together every week though.
Haven't seen any officiant consistent footy from the mids or forwards for weeks.
That would be helpful.

 

Edited by Fork 'em
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14 minutes ago, one_demon said:

Relax.  Every team has a slump at some stage during the season. Better to have the slump now than at finals time. 

It'll be fine as long as it doesn't cost us a top 4 spot. Or having to travel to the Gabba week one.

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Just my 2c worth. Went to the game, they seem to kick to nobody (under pressure) and other times they would slow play (not sure who to kick to) allowing the Giants to regroup.   Whilst you see this from all sides It just seemed to cost us a lot today.

They all looked to be playing hard but for some reason just lacked player to player flow.

 

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18 minutes ago, BW511 said:

The last one is a bit controversial but I’ll go with it anyway. Our game plan is starting to unravel like years gone by because it’s incredibly taxing. We may be fitter (allegedly)  than every side, but we’re not mentally ready to do it for a whole year.

The real defensive based game style we’ve played the last few weeks is a bit puzzling. We’re trying to play safe and we don’t have the cattle for it. 

Some of the rest of your post I agree with (e.g. the comments on Petracca, Harmes and Viney).

But this I don't agree with at all.

The "real defensive based game style" we've been playing the last few weeks is the same one we played all season.

The difference today was a thrashing in stoppages, which meant we couldn't maintain time in our forward half (which is what Goodwin wants more than anything) and bad play forward of centre - turnovers and missed shots on goal.

You're talking as if we couldn't even get it forward of centre. 

The slide from our form to the 11-1 point is not nearly as big as you're suggesting.

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2 hours ago, wizardinoz said:

Why get BBB in to the club if you are not going to play him? Goodwin you are a goose who needs to have a good hard look at himself. Kicking scores of less than ten goals a week is not good enough.

Can't argue with any of that.  I said same to bro before match today when it looked like slim chance of rain?  

Someone should've been onto the local radar forecast and like many top liner clubs do at the last minute (and wear a fine if needed) ...

"In BB ...out Sparrow!" for the likely win!

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Posted (edited)

A shame goody didnt accept responsibilty in his presser for our lack of talls.

The buck doesnt stop with him.

Does the fwd line concern you?

"In what regard?...afl footys tough"

Bloke speaks in circles and cliches.

Blames it on everything but selection

Edited by leave it to deever
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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Some of the rest of your post I agree with (e.g. the comments on Petracca, Harmes and Viney).

But this I don't agree with at all.

The "real defensive based game style" we've been playing the last few weeks is the same one we played all season.

The difference today was a thrashing in stoppages, which meant we couldn't maintain time in our forward half (which is what Goodwin wants more than anything) and bad play forward of centre - turnovers and missed shots on goal.

You're talking as if we couldn't even get it forward of centre. 

The slide from our form to the 11-1 point is not nearly as big as you're suggesting.

I think we’ve definitely made a shift towards the Geelong style of playing safe against sides lower than us. We are intent on keeping a team to a low score, rather than attacking and trying to win. It’s a more defensive mindset.

No doubt we are getting it forward of centre, but we’ll never consistently kick a winning score with Fritsch as the sole target. He tried hard but he’s not exactly someone to fear

Edited by BW511
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Had a game of footy today so didn't watch it, and picked up the phone to check the results. Was not one bit surprised.

I need to watch the reply.  But reading this thread it sounds like our so called guns in Oliver, Viney and Petracca failed to stand up when needed.

Looking at stats I think its time to rest Kozzie and Jackson by the looks of it. I'll get caned for this, but I have felt it's Jackson who is the weak link in our forward line. Does a lot right around the ground but adds nothing up forward.

Very disappointing result.

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The midfield was fumbly and lacking in intensity and concentration, but the forwards were equally terrible this week. Our game resolves around those two areas of the ground paying pressure. It wasn't there.

The mids failed to apply adequate forward pressure and the forwards failed to apply adequate midfield pressure.

Really liked Petty's game, but Oliver and Petracca were dreadful. I don't care that they got the ball. They, along with Viney, had little influence on the game.

I know McDonald took a bunch of marks and was involved in a lot of our scoring chains with good ball use, but when he doesn't hit the scoreboard and he's playing as the main man, we're not going to win too many games.

Brown will come in next week all being well and he will allow McDonald and Fritsch to get the weaker defenders, as well as allow them to get up the ground. That will suit both of them. Brown'll also draw the ball and very likely kick two or three himself.

The tragedy of today is I think we may just have blown not just our top 2 hopes, but the top 4. If we end up finishing 5th, it would be an utter disgrace given where we've sat for the majority of the season.

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