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Why we wont win a grand final soon



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20 minutes ago, dino rover said:

"and we have problems across all lines"

Actually I said our midfield and defence was good but id like an upgrade on Hunt and Brayshaw.

No, you questioned our wingers and our height in defence. 

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I didn't say we have problems across all lines...

"Overall though with an upgrade on Hunt our defence is good enough. "

"but overall midfield we are strong. Another winger is all I want. "

 

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Every list has its deficiencies and ours is no exception. We currently have three long term injuries with Tomlinson being a big loss. There is an opportunity to add 2 backups in the mid season draft. We have Jones & Jetta who are both in the twilight of their careers, Jetta more so and I suspect he will struggle to retain his spot.

We are relying on Picket, Jackson, Rivers and Jordan to play at a high level every week. For goodness sake they are in the first & second years. Their contribution is enormous and they are in front of a few seasoned other players. They will be inconsistent. We have Bowey and Laurie who will need time to develop.

Rather than bu position look art our core and their leadership and talent. Max, Clarrie, Trac, Salem, Lever and May are the elite. The support group of Gus, Hibberd, Fritsch, TMac, Melk, Weid, Brown1 & 2 is where the difference will come. How do our bottom six rate? This is where the difference is and where flags are won.

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, dino rover said:

Hyperbole - what I said was can we win the GF - nice straw man.

Why start a thread if you aren't prepared for people to disagree with you?

The sky is falling is the perfect analogy to this highly predictable thread after a loss. Your points may have been better received had you shared them before we lost a game, but this is just like many other boring reactionary threads with hardly any meaningful insights other than identifying who hasn't been playing well lately.  

"I am trying to be measured here and some of this can be overcome but here is why we wont win a GF soon."

You did not say what you think you said 

Edited by Smokey
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Posted (edited)

If this is the bar you need to jump over to say a team won't win a Grand Final soon, then it would be absurdly easy to write one about every team in the league. For example: 

 

Bulldogs: Class is mostly in one area. Defence terrible and defence wins premierships. Zayne Cordy has to take the number 2 big forward. Awful in the ruck. Halve the midfield and you beat them. They're flat track bullies. Went to water when they faced pressure against an understrength Richmond.

Brisbane: Defence ordinary after Andrews and struggle to defend run ons. Poor in the ruck. Too many small midfielders who have been bullied around in finals the last few years. Rely on too few to do too much, and they're all similar players. Had their chance in the bubble and still didn't threaten.

Port: Butters out indefinitely. Lack a big marking option after Dixon. Too many 'meh' smalls. Struggle to score in tight games. Many players lack class. Best players are either old or young, with middle filled with average footsoldiers. 'Stars' aren't good enough to win games like others can. Had their chance int he bubble ... now they're all a year older. 

Geelong: Old and lack pace. Midfield lacks class. Ruck is terrible and costs them games. Play a high possession game that can get shut down in high pressured finals. Have struggled to win finals during their run at the top. Their old list plays well during the regular season but doesn't have it in them to raise their game again once the pressure goes up in finals. 

 

No team is perfect. Nor are we.

 

Edited by Axis of Bob
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Lol love this coming up after our first loss for the year (1 point with a few dodgy umpire calls costing us a chance to get something from the match). Is anyone going to bump the “Is Goodwin the right guy” thread as well?

Just as someone creating a thread saying “Why we will win a grand final” after beating the tigers, this is still too premature. We have issues with the team, and so far our peak has been against the tigers, but I see those issues being resolved through dedication and hard work, as well as adjustments to our structure. 

Something I’d like to point out though is that all premiers from previous years reached their performance peak towards the end of the year. I’m hopeful that we will see our best footy being played from round 17-19 into finals. 

Like everyone i enjoyed the 9-0 ride, but now the players (and fans) get confronted with a new challenge, how do you back up from a loss?

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8 hours ago, dino rover said:

The loss to Adelaide highlighted deficiencies we have over those teams realistically in the hunt for a Premiership.

I am trying to be measured here and some of this can be overcome but here is why we wont win a GF soon.

Key Forwards

TMac, BB and SW - there isnt anyone in that list comparable to Jeremy Cameron, Tom Lynch, Harry McKay, Tomahawk, Jack Riewoldt, Jack Darling, Josh Kennedy - could go on. Maybe SW will fulfil his promise - but that promise is getting on now. - BB just looks slow to me - TMac gets the best out of his 194cm but at that height we have modern midfielders - modern power forwards are 200cm.

Midfield

Gawn, Oliver, Trac, Langdon, Viney, Jackson - what is missing is another wing  - I'm unconvinced by Brayshaw / Baker as anything more than a stopgap - but overall midfield we are strong. Another winger is all I want.

Backs

Our strength this year - our system and skills are excellent, Salem, Lever, May, Rivers, Petty, Tomlinson but not Hunt who is a one trick pony - his tackling pressure is ineffectual, his kicking unreliable.

I worry that we don't have the height and bulk to take on the bigger key forwards - May uses his 100kg very well but at 193cm he isn't that big. Maybe Petty for the future but that lack of the big defender is a worry. Overall though with an upgrade on Hunt our defence is good enough.

I'm not saying we wont be competitive or our list cant progress.

Certainly our current level of performance means key forwards, a winger and a rebounding small defender are more likely to be attracted to us.

Can we win a GF with our current list?

 

We've lost 1 game. Chill Winston!

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4 hours ago, Dwight Schrute said:

6 is fair enough, but i think it's fair to say based on our form in the first 10 games, we're almost certain to make finals, and we'd be very unlikely to fall away so badly we don't make top 4.

But our goal, i'm sure is and should be a top 2 spot, and if we get that, we're a very real chance to make the Grand final. and i think any team would find us really hard to beat on the MCG. 

Sure, that's all fair. I'm confident we can go 6-6 at worst from here and that gets us to 15-7 and in the running for top 4.

Reality is, though, we have a very tough fixture from here whereas some of our contenders for top 4 spots do not (e.g. Richmond's already played everyone in the 8 except West Coast and only has West Coast, Geelong, Brisbane and GWS (arguably not actually a top 8 side) in their run home). 

Funnily enough losing to Adelaide is probably a better result for us than losing to contenders in so-called "eight point games". If we beat the Dogs on Friday that 1-1 split is better for us than the other way around.

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I think we have a better chance than we did on 2000 or 1988. Long way to go, but apart from Port and Footscray, we’ve beaten the top teams

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2 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Funnily enough losing to Adelaide is probably a better result for us than losing to contenders in so-called "eight point games". If we beat the Dogs on Friday that 1-1 split is better for us than the other way around.

Then we better win or else…..

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5 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Sure, that's all fair. I'm confident we can go 6-6 at worst from here and that gets us to 15-7 and in the running for top 4.

Reality is, though, we have a very tough fixture from here whereas some of our contenders for top 4 spots do not (e.g. Richmond's already played everyone in the 8 except West Coast and only has West Coast, Geelong, Brisbane and GWS (arguably not actually a top 8 side) in their run home). 

Funnily enough losing to Adelaide is probably a better result for us than losing to contenders in so-called "eight point games". If we beat the Dogs on Friday that 1-1 split is better for us than the other way around.

Definitely agree, my predictions for our remaining games is as follows in the event we lose to all the other contenders, reality is we should beat some of those and my drop 1-2 we don't expect to as well. but 

Dogs Lose 
Lions Lose
Pies Win 
Bombers Win
Giants  Win
Power  Lose 
Hawks Win
Suns  Win 
Dogs  Lose 
Eagles Lose 
Crows Win 
Cats Lose

this would give us a record of 15-7 which i think should give us a very good chance of Top 4, in saying that i think we're capable of winning 75-80% of our remaining games, acknowledging that it is a harder draw than our first 10 games. 

Bottom line is, we're going to feature in the finals this season, and we're a very good chance to finish top 4. 

I predict the Tigers coming home with a wet sail as well, so that will through a spanner into the works for the other contenders. 

 

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Someone’s got a case of Monday-itis. 
 

Very much hoping Jayden Hunt can put a sock in the naysayer’s gobs next match. Admittedly he’s fallen off a little of late, but I refuse to believe the improvements he’s shown this season are flukes. 

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7 hours ago, McQueen said:

For goodness sake please put an apostrophe in ‘won’t’. 
 

 

Ok ill try

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1 hour ago, Dwight Schrute said:

Definitely agree, my predictions for our remaining games is as follows in the event we lose to all the other contenders, reality is we should beat some of those and my drop 1-2 we don't expect to as well. but 

Dogs Lose 
Lions Lose
Pies Win 
Bombers Win
Giants  Win
Power  Lose 
Hawks Win
Suns  Win 
Dogs  Lose 
Eagles Lose 
Crows Win 
Cats Lose

this would give us a record of 15-7 which i think should give us a very good chance of Top 4, in saying that i think we're capable of winning 75-80% of our remaining games, acknowledging that it is a harder draw than our first 10 games. 

Bottom line is, we're going to feature in the finals this season, and we're a very good chance to finish top 4. 

I predict the Tigers coming home with a wet sail as well, so that will through a spanner into the works for the other contenders. 

 

Mark it down as it happens every year, we’ll win at least. two of Dogs x 2, Lions, Port, Eagles and will drop one of the W’s you have penciled in.

Plenty to work on from Saturday and there will be more identified issues from the Brissy and Dogs games, but you’re better getting exposed to your flaws now. I actually like that we finish with 3 really tough games in our last 4.

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Have a little faith, we’ve lost 1 game & if not for a gutless umpire would be 10 zip.

Im not saying we will win the flag this year but let’s  enjoy the ride, we’re having a fantastic season 

We don’t need these so called experts dissecting our deficiencies 

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Either Brown or the Weed need to be turned into a defender via the reserves . Having these two up front  reduces their optimum output and impact the way we play. M.Brown so far is a better option as he can play both ends of the ground. Daw can play in different positions  also. Not convinced  Brayshaw is a winger , Melksham has reached his use by date.  The Dees will win by 50 pts.

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  • 2 months later...

Footy Show today Cain Cornes says we don't have a compelling forward line - we cant kick a decent score which is my proposition in this thread.

I got howled down at the time but the question remains - do we have enough forward talent to win in September?

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We've lost 1 game!

We're top of the ladder!

They're out of the eight!

We've over performed / Where did you have us finishing in pre-season.

 

I wonder how that last one is going to stack up.

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If Ben Brown kicks straight and turns the 2.2 and one out on the full to 5 goals straight or even 4.1 it’s a different story. McDonald had a quiet game but that won’t happen every week. Conditions weren’t great for either of them and if some of the umpiring decisions were called the same way for both teams, then it’s a different story. 
Let’s just stay calm. There were a lot of positives to come from the game, and the negatives are easy fixes.

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45 minutes ago, dino rover said:

Footy Show today Cain Cornes says we don't have a compelling forward line - we cant kick a decent score which is my proposition in this thread.

I got howled down at the time but the question remains - do we have enough forward talent to win in September?

I guess we'll find out in September, not July...

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On 5/24/2021 at 5:02 PM, Dwight Schrute said:

Definitely agree, my predictions for our remaining games is as follows

Dogs Lose - wrong
Lions Lose - wrong
Pies Win - wrong
Bombers Win - almost wrong
Giants  Win - wrong
Power  Lose - wrong
Hawks Win - wrong
Suns  Win - probably wrong
Dogs  Lose - bingo!
Eagles Lose 
Crows Win 
Cats Lose

 

 

It's hilarious just how so much wrong you were. Stands out even on Demonland. 

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