POSTGAME: Practice Match vs Bulldogs

[John Demonic 4,781]

3 hours ago, Roost it far said:

My god football journalism is a joke. That’s such a non article

You mean an F article Roost

[Flemo56 375]

29 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

Basically agree with this but why is it so? You watch the Bulldogs and they just instinctively know where their team mates are, where they can handball out of trouble, often out of sight, behind the ball carrier. Some of Libber’s handballs over his head backwards push the boundaries of credibility for the Umpires surely.  But yes in comparison we seem disorganised despite year after year of training drills but it all doesn’t seem to work at AFL level, we still depend on the individual supremacy of Max, Tracc, Oliver et al to be competitive. That is individual dominance rather than a playing system that can dominate. 
 

For the dogs there are always team mates ahead, sideways and behind. That builds confidence for the risk taking ball carrier trying to break defensive lines, that he will always have an emergency out. I don’t believe we create that confidence on game day. We provide it in our practice drills at training but come game day, under pressure the daring plays go missing. Is that because players don’t have support around them and players presenting forward of the ball? I don’t know. 

Well said, earl, my thoughts as well. We don’t play as a team, no awareness of ya teammates positions. Yep, apparently we practise it in drills but still cannot do it under game  pressure. 

[titan_uranus 22,219]

2 hours ago, olisik said:

Like Treloar,JJ, Easton Wood, Richards, Cordy, Hannan

Lets be honest, there depth bats deeper then ours and we are stuffed if we get 3-4 injuries and need to rely on Baker, Jordan and Sparrow

Johannisen, Richards and Cordy were all dropped. Fit, but didn't make the 26.

That's two best 22 and a fringe player missing.

Not comparable at all.

And as to their "depth", they have midfield depth like no other side in the league but they didn't look amazing when we went inside 50, so they didn't really have good cover for Wood.

[YesitwasaWin4theAges 5,788]

On 3/8/2021 at 10:42 PM, Earl Hood said:

I hope we get at least another 7 back for round 1. Oliver, Viney, Salem, Hibberd, Melksham, Kossie and Brayshaw. Hopefully we can also work Mitch Brown and Petty into the mix, up forward as well. These players will improve the side but I do worry that our forward problems remain unresolved. And I see no real changes to the game plan, if you can call it a plan! Slow ball movement out of the backline, kicking long down the line is not how we train, sorry to sound like a broken record. 

Petty has got to play Forward, we need another target form permitting.

Edited March 9, 2021 by Win4theAges

[olisik 4,060]

1 hour ago, titan_uranus said:

Johannisen, Richards and Cordy were all dropped. Fit, but didn't make the 26.

That's two best 22 and a fringe player missing.

Not comparable at all.

And as to their "depth", they have midfield depth like no other side in the league but they didn't look amazing when we went inside 50, so they didn't really have good cover for Wood.

The fact they were dropped says it all about depth.
 

They were able to drop quality players while we are forced to play VFL plodders. I would love Richards on our wing over Jones, JJ over Hunt, Cordy over Jetta any day of the week.

Even there VFL players would put our starters to shame.

Throw in Cody Weightman  over Bedford/Spargo/Chandler to please

 

Edited March 9, 2021 by olisik

[Gator 16,891]

1 hour ago, Win4theAges said:

Petty has got to play Forward, we need another target form permitting.

Petty should be playing ahead of Tomlinson in the back-line.  May, Lever, Petty is optimal.

That said, you're right.  Without Brown and Weideman, Petty as a fill-in key forward makes sense.  McDonald, Jackson with Gawn floating forward isn't the answer.  

We ned to be flexible and Petty forward is a better option.  Even if only for a few weeks.

Edited March 9, 2021 by Hannibal Inc.

[binman 37,763]

On 3/9/2021 at 9:20 AM, joeboy said:

Not an acceptable excuse under any circumstances ,but the feeling at the ground from the outset was the players weren’t up for the contest.

I think the attitude was established and the game was lost at the selection table.

Ultimately the Bulldogs came to play and we came to survive until the missing players on our list returned

Bit verbose for you joeboy, but i agree. 

I went to the game and have struggled since to assess the performance. But in hindsight, i reckon you're right. The team were not really up for the contest, bar a handful of players - in particular jetts who was ferocious at the contest all game. Trac barely got out of a canter.

Pollyanna noted the dogs had 24 more clearances and had 51 more contested possessions, which supports this perspective. When was the last game, practice or regular season, where we had 51 less contested possessions than the opposition? For that matter when did we last lose the inside 50 count by 23.

It really did have the feel of a practice match - and as you say that vibe was reinforced by the team they selected.

Yesterday, I got around to watching the post match presser and goody was the most relaxed I have seen him in a presser i reckon. Sure he said the performance wasn't good enough, but with no real angst or feeling. 

It made me wonder if the club approached the game as hit out rather than being fully wound up. And a chance to give some of the younger players a chance to make a case for selection. 

When i saw the two mid fields i had no expectation of winning. It was just never going to happen.

Add to that the low energy of the team, something i suspect might have been orchestrated (ie they made it clear to the team the focus was on the practice not the win) and I'm not sure much can be taken away from the game. 

I get the general angst about the performance but i wonder if the Tiger's game is a better gauge of where we are at. We selected a much better team , played the reigning premiers, who fielded close to their best team and we were clearly up for the game (the tigers too, though perhaps not as much). And we won. 

Some random thoughts about the game;

• It is  worth nothing that we were ahead at half time (or close to it). Yes the dogs probably should have been 4 goals up - but they weren't
• Given our energy, their lineup and the fact we had such a young team, it was no surprise they dominated the second half
• I concur with the comments that the younger players who were given a chance to show their wares failed to make a case, with the possible exception of Bowey - and him only because he can kick!
• Hunt should be told to only kick the ball 50 metres, or not at all if a long kick is not on he needs to handball it
• For any number of reasons, watching live is so much better than on TV. One reason is you can really see how critical running and covering ground is - and who is working hard and who is not. Nibbler worked his guts out and Langdon too. But Harmes didn't.
• In the last quarter Harmes lost a contest. The player he lost it to (the young fella who played on Tmac in the last) ran off him and won the ball again later in the possession chain down on the dogs half forward - with Harmes trailing 20 metres behind. I think it set up a goal. not good enough.
• Can't see Baker making it. Simply does not get enough of the ball. 
• Sad to say but Hunt might not either - and for much the same reason 
• Gawn is the best mark i have seen since Teasdale and Dempsey - and he is seemingly even more athletic this year
• I am not so critical of the constant long bombs by may from kick outs. I thought they might have been experimenting with taking advantage of the extension of the player on the mark.
• May was kicking it from 30 odd metres, and easily covers 50, so the ball was getting to a marking contest 80 odd metres from goal. At the contests we almost always had two bigs, though didn't take many marks. 
• Yes they rebounded from that contest quite often, but with our A grade mids we will win out share of those balls and the next kick is inside our 50. We did win some and i think got at least one  coast to coast goals from the tactic
• Our terrible foot skills remain our biggest issue. I was sitting on the 50 metre arc on the city side wing and got a birds eye view of Bont and Mcrae going to work with their inside 50 kicks, ability to kick diagonally and Bont's shot at goal from 50. Beautiful.  
• Sure they are top shelf players, but Daniels is an even more reliable kick and across their best 22 they have 5 or 6 other excellent kicks.
• We butchered the ball again. And missed dinky little 20 metre kicks under no pressure (Hunt says hi).  Even basic things like kicking to a free player in space so he doesn't have stop to mark it seems beyond us (Langdon says hi)
• Our kicking issues mean we need Melksham to step up, puts pressure on us to fast track Bowey (who you can tell from a small sample is an excellent kick), have to get Salem in more offensive positions, we need rivers to go to the next level, and possibly get Fritter up on the half forward and more into general play 
• I thought Spargo was better than many suggest - but maybe i need to watch the replay
• The best game i have seen Lever play. He was awesome. Looks more confident in his lateral movement and looks to be bigger and stronger. This year we will get our dividend from recruiting him and Lever.
• On watching the replay, it is pure joy to watch a game of footfall without having to listen to the peanuts that masquerade as commentators. Get the AFLW crew to do AFLW, and [censored] of Lyon, Brown, Riewoldt, BT et al. Hopeless everyone of them (except Daisy - keep her)

Edited March 10, 2021 by binman

[Binmans PA 25,892]

On 3/8/2021 at 9:23 PM, rjay said:

For those who doubt the value of Oliver...well, Trac for one plays a lot better footy when he's around.

Trac might be the glory boy, but Oliver is the engine room.

Spot on mate. Oliver is our best player by such a big margin, it's laughable how some Melbourne supporters talk about him. Sure, he can still improve, but his average game is an A+ game for anyone else, outside of probably May, Petracca and on their days Viney or Brayshaw.

I hope Lever gets a proper run at it this year, because if he can play 22 games alongside Steven May again, I'll have less concerns about our backline. Tomlinson doesn't have to do much but keep his player quiet and allow May and Lever to intercept. Our backline needs much better run and dash though, so that appears to have been identified again and that's why Hunt looks to be playing off half back. That's where he should stay IMO.

I'd love Beveridge as a coach, but alas we have Goodwin. It'll be interesting to see for how long. Our forwardline is an absolute disaster if we don't get first use or surprise a side on the counter, but it's an unsustainable plan. Hopefully with Oliver, Viney and Brayshaw back in there we'll be able to increase supply to a winnable level.

Edited March 11, 2021 by A F

[SPC 2,778]

Just watched the replay.. I know people have knocked Jordan and the recruiting of that draft. I think Jordan will make it as will Chandler and Bedford. Sparrow might make a good defensive small over time. 
Hard game to read, biggest disappointment for me was Trac. He was  well below his standard.

[Deemania since 56 6,119]

On 3/9/2021 at 3:17 PM, buck_nekkid said:

So beating the premiers is worth......

...far call

[Binmans PA 25,892]

On 3/9/2021 at 11:43 AM, Axis of Bob said:

Garry Lyon is the worst commentator out there. An impossibly self-important lightweight. 

I often wonder if he lives in constant fear that everyone's going to realise that he doesn't know what he's talking about anymore, although I suspect that that he probably doesn't have the self-awareness for that.

Most of your words are gold, Bob, but I disagree with this. I find myself often agreeing with Gary. You might say that says a lot about me, but he points out the moments that are simply not good enough from our perspective. He's hard on Melbourne, but if the game play isn't good enough, it isn't good enough.

As for your comment @Pollyanna about playing a defensive player on Daniels, 100% concur. To me that's a very obvious move. One you'd make very early in your plan to stifle the Bulldogs movement. The other would be ensuring that Bontempelli is marked at stoppages and isn't allowed to run around by himself. His scoring shots were embarrassingly easy. Okay, so we're playing Jordon in the midfield, but it simply wasn't VFL standard the amount of room we constantly gave Bontempelli. Yes, smart player and all that, but come on.

It'll be interesting to see if we inject any adventure to our game style in Round 1. I'm also over the 'back our guys to win it' approach. We need to plan for the opposition and very deliberately try to curb dangerous influences on the game. 

[P-man 13,154]

On 3/9/2021 at 10:28 AM, Salems Lot said:

Don't care what anyone says, when you play a full strength team whilst missing 8 first picked players of your own you will get spanked most times.

Yep, I’ll save my outrage for when we get smashed with a full strength side.

[Hellish Inferno 992]

Just watched the "video of the week" on the Demonland homepage and have to say, although we scored a goal, gee it epitomises so many of our problems, particularly f50 entry and forwardline craft

Starts with Jones anticipating the play well and runs forward for a Trac handball. The first good thing up until ANB scores the goal.

Vanders follows Jones, fails to shepherd and in facts gets so close that Jones is probably unsure if he's an opponent, so kicks long inside f50 when they could have run it through the middle.

By kicking long to Fritsch as a target, Jones has kicked it over the head of many*, including TMac who is caught out of position. His opponent reads the play better, backs back and fortuitously two Bulldogs players spoil each other.

* I can see how this play might work, if we had a gorilla forward, forget the loose defensive man often inside our f50, and if our smaller forwards actually get to the drop of the ball.

But then, the ball spills and a Bulldogs defender runs onto it (Spargo trailing) and gets a bad bounce off his chest into the arms of ANB who slots the goal. Meanwhile Fritsch catches the Bulldog player high not lucky to not get a free called against.

If we rely on getting lucky, freakish goals like this every game, we're toast

[Bay Riffin 1,413]

5 hours ago, Hellish Inferno said:

Just watched the "video of the week" on the Demonland homepage and have to say, although we scored a goal, gee it epitomises so many of our problems, particularly f50 entry and forwardline craft

Starts with Jones anticipating the play well and runs forward for a Trac handball. The first good thing up until ANB scores the goal.

Vanders follows Jones, fails to shepherd and in facts gets so close that Jones is probably unsure if he's an opponent, so kicks long inside f50 when they could have run it through the middle.

By kicking long to Fritsch as a target, Jones has kicked it over the head of many*, including TMac who is caught out of position. His opponent reads the play better, backs back and fortuitously two Bulldogs players spoil each other.

* I can see how this play might work, if we had a gorilla forward, forget the loose defensive man often inside our f50, and if our smaller forwards actually get to the drop of the ball.

But then, the ball spills and a Bulldogs defender runs onto it (Spargo trailing) and gets a bad bounce off his chest into the arms of ANB who slots the goal. Meanwhile Fritsch catches the Bulldog player high not lucky to not get a free called against.

If we rely on getting lucky, freakish goals like this every game, we're toast

Let’s see how we go with kozzie back in with McDonald and Jackson playing deeper. 

[SPC 2,778]

On 3/8/2021 at 9:22 PM, SPC said:

We won’t lose a game till we play Richmond 

I am hopeful my prediction is wrong.. 

[Sir Why You Little 34,407]

49 minutes ago, SPC said:

I am hopeful my prediction is wrong.. 

damm you!!!!!

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,100]

12 hours ago, SPC said:

I am hopeful my prediction is wrong.. 

Amazing prediction by you. I thought we'd be 2-4 after that horrid showing against the Dogs.

I'm hoping we weren't taking that game seriously as opposed to losing badly just because we were missing Oliver and Salem.

[Gator 16,891]

On 3/10/2021 at 12:28 AM, Hannibal Inc. said:

Petty should be playing ahead of Tomlinson in the back-line.  May, Lever, Petty is optimal.

That said, you're right.  Without Brown and Weideman, Petty as a fill-in key forward makes sense.  McDonald, Jackson with Gawn floating forward isn't the answer.  

We ned to be flexible and Petty forward is a better option.  Even if only for a few weeks.

Well I got that utterly wrong.

The club has nailed every selection decidion this year.

Let's hope they keep the balance right for Richmond on Saturday night.