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Pinball Wizard
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26 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

At least @Nudge put some excitement in to this trade period.

There isn't much happening

Agree. Nudge has thrown a good RUMOUR here. Keep them coming as this trade period is as boring as bat [censored].

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47 minutes ago, demoniac said:

The Pies were not far too smart to mismanage their player contracts to such an extent that they appear to need to salary cap dump multiple contracts including a player in his 28 yo season in 2021 with 5 years to go on a contract and dodgy hammies,  which has $900,000 due in 2021 and who they extended and backended to fit in Dayne Beams. They gave a 7 year $7 million contract to a ruckman who'll be 33 in the final year of the deal. They handed out above market contracts to other players after 2018 Grand Final which they're now looking to dump or extend years to smooth the yearly cap hit. Its a giant cluster.   

I think you're putting too much trust in the media. the Pies wouldn't have offered De Goey the deal they did if they didn't have money. i think they're trying to trade Treloar out of a combination of - thinking he'll struggle away from his partner and the feeling that 900k could be better spent on other players 

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8 hours ago, It's Time said:

Would love to know what their theory is on not even making the finals this year. For me it wasn't even about not making finals. It was about the standard of play nearly all season. We've all been waiting for i50's to be fixed since Goody took over the game plan in 2016. Goody says the game plan is based around the contest but we're ranked 15th for clearances and we have Gawn, Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Petracca in the midfield. Where is the improvement going to come from. How is it going to come. Improved coaching, improved players? 

Good post, i would love someone at the club to answer this as I know alot of Dees members have the same questions and we are being feed a bit of dribble. 

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8 hours ago, It's Time said:

Would love to know what their theory is on not even making the finals this year. For me it wasn't even about not making finals. It was about the standard of play nearly all season. We've all been waiting for i50's to be fixed since Goody took over the game plan in 2016. Goody says the game plan is based around the contest but we're ranked 15th for clearances and we have Gawn, Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Petracca in the midfield. Where is the improvement going to come from. How is it going to come. Improved coaching, improved players? 

Been saying the same thing Time

I keep asking fellow dees the same thing Nobody has an answer for me other than faith and hope

What will change??

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27 minutes ago, Kent said:

Been saying the same thing Time

I keep asking fellow dees the same thing Nobody has an answer for me other than faith and hope

What will change??

Yze will be a positive influence from a coaching perspective. Adding Brown improves our forward set-up as well. I'm hopeful we'll be better next year. ?

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8 hours ago, It's Time said:

Would love to know what their theory is on not even making the finals this year. For me it wasn't even about not making finals. It was about the standard of play nearly all season. We've all been waiting for i50's to be fixed since Goody took over the game plan in 2016. Goody says the game plan is based around the contest but we're ranked 15th for clearances and we have Gawn, Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Petracca in the midfield. Where is the improvement going to come from. How is it going to come. Improved coaching, improved players? 

We have good individual players in our midfield, but as a group they are poor.  That is the challenge for the coaching staff getting our players and in particular the ones you mention playing team football rather than selfish football.  I often compare out team to an U9 side they all go to where the ball is and all want to possession, they need to be coached to work for each other, there is only 1 football in play at 1 time means only 1 person can have it.  We need to work harder off the ball to create space, make it easier to for our team mates to win the ball and get a clean possession rather than the under pressure 1m flick handballs.

The forward line just doesn't apply more pressure to keep the ball inside our 50m arc and repeat entries, that is why I'm surprised we haven't been linked to any small pressure forwards  

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24 minutes ago, drdrake said:

We have good individual players in our midfield, but as a group they are poor.  That is the challenge for the coaching staff getting our players and in particular the ones you mention playing team football rather than selfish football.  I often compare out team to an U9 side they all go to where the ball is and all want to possession, they need to be coached to work for each other, there is only 1 football in play at 1 time means only 1 person can have it.  We need to work harder off the ball to create space, make it easier to for our team mates to win the ball and get a clean possession rather than the under pressure 1m flick handballs.

The forward line just doesn't apply more pressure to keep the ball inside our 50m arc and repeat entries, that is why I'm surprised we haven't been linked to any small pressure forwards  

Its like the FD is entirely happy with the list

there are still holes in it as many on here believe

As to the coaching Dr this has been a problem for years and has never been addressed

Yze nor any other messiah wont fix it Goes to the heart of the game plan and coaches expectations and ability

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6 minutes ago, Kent said:

Its like the FD is entirely happy with the list

there are still holes in it as many on here believe

As to the coaching Dr this has been a problem for years and has never been addressed

Yze nor any other messiah wont fix it Goes to the heart of the game plan and coaches expectations and ability

This is why I'm open to trade Oliver or Brayshaw, I don't want to get to the end of 2021 and be having the same discussions about our midfield group and I think these 2 and Viney need a massive re-education on playing team football, I'm not sure they will be able to adjust.

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3 minutes ago, drdrake said:

This is why I'm open to trade Oliver or Brayshaw, I don't want to get to the end of 2021 and be having the same discussions about our midfield group and I think these 2 and Viney need a massive re-education on playing team football, I'm not sure they will be able to adjust.

Last time I checked you can never have too many good AFL quality players - trading them away is not the answer - teaching them how to work cohesively and as a collective weapon is - its the coaching that needs a big kick

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3 minutes ago, Sydee said:

Last time I checked you can never have too many good AFL quality players - trading them away is not the answer - teaching them how to work cohesively and as a collective weapon is - its the coaching that needs a big kick

Only if they can be taught and we either haven't been teaching correctly or players not listening, we don't have the midfield depth to know which one is true, I would say a mixture of both.  A team will always beat a team of individuals no matter how good those individuals are, our back 6 are I think we saw last year with May as the General back there started to really work for each other this season.  Our mids and forwards don't show any signs that they have progressed in the team football approach.

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3 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Only if they can be taught and we either haven't been teaching correctly or players not listening, we don't have the midfield depth to know which one is true, I would say a mixture of both.  A team will always beat a team of individuals no matter how good those individuals are, our back 6 are I think we saw last year with May as the General back there started to really work for each other this season.  Our mids and forwards don't show any signs that they have progressed in the team football approach.

I have said on here previously Dr and been mocked

I had a conversation with Plapp family member and he  thought that there were some that were uncoachable

For what its worth! Maybe that's right, maybe the coaches are no good but one thing for sure there has to be a radical change in approach to get this mob playing as a team

 

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12 minutes ago, Kent said:

I have said on here previously Dr and been mocked

I had a conversation with Plapp family member and he  thought that there were some that were uncoachable

For what its worth! Maybe that's right, maybe the coaches are no good but one thing for sure there has to be a radical change in approach to get this mob playing as a team

 

Sadly I have to agree. It's where we're currently at and what we need to change. Good list, poor team.

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9 hours ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

I think you're putting too much trust in the media. the Pies wouldn't have offered De Goey the deal they did if they didn't have money. i think they're trying to trade Treloar out of a combination of - thinking he'll struggle away from his partner and the feeling that 900k could be better spent on other players 

The 900K and then the 4 subsequent years on his contract? No club in their right mind is going to take on that contract without Pies ponying up hundreds of thousands of dollars of payments that go against their cap. Its not just the 900K due in 21 in his 28yo season, its the 4 subsequent years for a player who has had problems staying on the park due to soft tissue injuries. Its a terrible contract.

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1 hour ago, demoniac said:

The 900K and then the 4 subsequent years on his contract? No club in their right mind is going to take on that contract without Pies ponying up hundreds of thousands of dollars of payments that go against their cap. Its not just the 900K due in 21 in his 28yo season, its the 4 subsequent years for a player who has had problems staying on the park due to soft tissue injuries. Its a terrible contract.

the pies may well pay 200k of that money but they'd certainly prefer 200k to 900K and the dogs may view a 700k adam treloar as a bit of a bargain 

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1 hour ago, Kent said:

I have said on here previously Dr and been mocked

I had a conversation with Plapp family member and he  thought that there were some that were uncoachable

For what its worth! Maybe that's right, maybe the coaches are no good but one thing for sure there has to be a radical change in approach to get this mob playing as a team

 

Then, logically it refers to high profile players. if it was lesser players they would be regularly dropped and delisted. My view is some big possession players do not respect low profile coaches no matter how good they may or may not be. It also gets to the game plan. Maybe if the game plan is best served by you getting twenty possessions and defending instead of thirty possessions doing your own thing so think, stuff it. I think Yze has instant credibiliity that may have been lacking. 

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2 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

Then, logically it refers to high profile players. if it was lesser players they would be regularly dropped and delisted. My view is some big possession players do not respect low profile coaches no matter how good they may or may not be. It also gets to the game plan. Maybe if the game plan is best served by you getting twenty possessions and defending instead of thirty possessions doing your own thing so think, stuff it. I think Yze has instant credibiliity that may have been lacking. 

I hope to God you are right HFF?

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11 minutes ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

the pies may well pay 200k of that money but they'd certainly prefer 200k to 900K and the dogs may view a 700k adam treloar as a bit of a bargain 

$700K for Adam Treloar is full or over market value. And then there is the 4 years post 2021 which take him to his 32 yo season. With his history of soft tissue injuries any club taking on the 5 year contract would have to mitigate risk that he won't be available consistently. That mitigation would be Pies paying part of contract of each of the remaining 5 years or Treloar agreeing to contract variation. But why would he? Pies have twice pushed back money owed to him.

The Grundy contract is another shocker. 7 years at million a year ending at his 33 year old season.

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1 minute ago, demoniac said:

$700K for Adam Treloar is full or over market value. And then there is the 4 years post 2021 which take him to his 32 yo season. With his history of soft tissue injuries any club taking on the 5 year contract would have to mitigate risk that he won't be available consistently. That mitigation would be Pies paying part of contract of each of the remaining 5 years or Treloar agreeing to contract variation. But why would he? Pies have twice pushed back money owed to him.

The Grundy contract is another shocker. 7 years at million a year ending at his 33 year old season.

The pies signing Grundy long term makes sense because they were going to struggle to keep him otherwise, though i agree 7 years is excessive. 

in terms of Treloar, it's a big contract, and they'd know they're going to have to pay some of that salary moving forward. but i think there are teams that would take a punt on him at 700k. i don't agree that Treloars contract was as irresponsible as some are saying though. the reality is that if the trade scenario never came up, noone would be talking about it. and it's been widely understood he's been on big money for a long time. 

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1 hour ago, drdrake said:

Only if they can be taught and we either haven't been teaching correctly or players not listening, we don't have the midfield depth to know which one is true, I would say a mixture of both.  A team will always beat a team of individuals no matter how good those individuals are, our back 6 are I think we saw last year with May as the General back there started to really work for each other this season.  Our mids and forwards don't show any signs that they have progressed in the team football approach.

Great posts Dr. Interesting thing is nearly all supporters you speak to are basically seeing and saying the same things.

All I want to see in the first practice game next season is low passes from the midfield to nice clear leads in the forward line. Plus everything you said about the midfield. Not too much to ask is it?

 

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1 hour ago, Kent said:

I have said on here previously Dr and been mocked

I had a conversation with Plapp family member and he  thought that there were some that were uncoachable

For what its worth! Maybe that's right, maybe the coaches are no good but one thing for sure there has to be a radical change in approach to get this mob playing as a team

 

I don't think there is any fear of the coach in the players, we are all buddy buddy, there has to be a element of fear, if you don't follow team instructions there will be consequences.  As mentioned though we don't have the depth to hold some players accountable

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1 hour ago, Lord Nev said:

Oh boy...

"Instead, it’s more likely Treloar stays at the Pies for one more year, giving his camp and rival clubs time to plan for a move this time next year. It’s not ideal, but it’s the best card in the bad hand that he has been dealt by his own club."

Treloar staring down the barrel of awkward Collingwood return

 

Yep. No Club is going to pay that Contract 

It may be similar in a years time. Those Hamstrings will be watched very closely 

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