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1 minute ago, Moonshadow said:

I'm not a fan of the Brownlow as a means of rating players, but this team run down illustrates to me that we have a number of excellent players, but the quality drops off remarkably from there. Haven't had a look, but my guess is the Richmond vote spread is less lop sided

When you're regularly carrying cloggers like anb, spargo, Wagner's, hannan and oscar you can't expect to win many games. Our fringe players are the worst in the comp.

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Looks like Oliver has bragging rights over Viney for the Brownlow and the AA squad.  That should be enough to offset any disappointment at being just a few points behind him in the BnF. 9th is re

How many votes does Oliver have to poll for him to stay at Melbourne? 

Well done Christian Polling 6 best on grounds and a 2nd best. A brilliant season and it showed with the umpire's noticing you. Hoping you can take it to the next level again in 2021. 

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3 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

I'm not a fan of the Brownlow as a means of rating players, but this team run down illustrates to me that we have a number of excellent players, but the quality drops off remarkably from there. Haven't had a look, but my guess is the Richmond vote spread is less lop sided

Good to see Bogans like you and Elegt sticking together.

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13 minutes ago, Males said:

Not being a smart [censored] here AF, but do you think he had a better year for us then May? Personally I don’t really pay attention to clubs best and fairest because they all have different point systems etc, without knowing how a clubs system works we can’t get the full picture. 🤷🏼‍♂️

I reckon Petracca, May and Oliver were easily our three best players.

I felt May was slow to get going but was dominant in the second half of the year, whereas Clarry had a difficult patch mid year, but either side of that was usual Clarry eliteness.

Trac struggled in Round 1, but after that was consistently elite.

Hard to split May and Clarry, but I prefer midfielders, so I'd probably lean slightly towards Clarry.

No doubting in my mind that they were easily our three best.

Langdon was 4th, with his consistent gut running and I thought he got better and better as the year went on. 

After that, it was a raffle.

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5 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

I'm not a fan of the Brownlow as a means of rating players, but this team run down illustrates to me that we have a number of excellent players, but the quality drops off remarkably from there. Haven't had a look, but my guess is the Richmond vote spread is less lop sided

This suggests a massive drop off for all teams, look at the Lions top 3

215054AA-D037-4252-8239-5CAD69A9C262.jpegW

Edited by Males
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3 minutes ago, Males said:

Not being a smart [censored] here AF, but do you think he had a better year for us then May? Personally I don’t really pay attention to clubs best and fairest because they all have different point systems etc, without knowing how a clubs system works we can’t get the full picture. 🤷🏼‍♂️

The Bluey has thrown up all sorts of bizarre results over the years.  Flower one it once only and is our best player since the halcyon days.  RDB won it only a couple of times. Danny Hughes beat Gerard Healy in 1985; Laurie Fowler was a multiple winner during Flower's best years; Brian Wilson and Peter Moore both won Brownlow's in the 80's and neither won the B&F in the year they won it. It's a bit of pot luck.  Oliver may be unhappy with his 5th placing, but he got very lucky the previous year when he tied with Gawn.  

 

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11 minutes ago, A F said:

Clarry finishes 9th in the league and doesn't finish top 3 in the BnF. What a joke.

Maybe.

But it’s a completely different voting system.  If anything, it suggests that when the team plays poorly, Viney still plays well.

 

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6 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

I'm not a fan of the Brownlow as a means of rating players, but this team run down illustrates to me that we have a number of excellent players, but the quality drops off remarkably from there. Haven't had a look, but my guess is the Richmond vote spread is less lop sided

As I mentioned the other day, the positioning of our list is very Richmond 2013-2016. An elite core with some decent support players and then a marked drop off at the bottom.

We've now even got the Martin going to North equivalent with Clarry to Carlton. It can turn quickly.

I reckon Richmond's Brownlow spread would have been similar in those aforementioned years to ours tonight.

Fix the system, bring in Yze, two or three other highly rated assistants, add Brown, Smith, Phillips and a speedy pressure forward or two and we'll be in the top 4 mix next year. The competition is soft. Richmond can't keep it going forever, Geelong are getting old. No one else scares me. 

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And well done to Gawn, who was clearly the top vote getter amongst the ruckmen.  His first half of the season was outstanding, until his injury.  Thoroughly deserved his AA.  Interesting the umpires only gave Naitanui 5 votes for his season.  11 marks across the year tells you what the umpires notice and what they don't. 

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10 minutes ago, Males said:

This suggests a massive drop off for all teams, look at the Lions top 3

215054AA-D037-4252-8239-5CAD69A9C262.jpegW

That to me perfectly represents what we have, an elite midfield that we absolutely need to get more bang for our buck from. A decent forward set up and some good outside ball users will help this.

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2 minutes ago, A F said:

As I mentioned the other day, the positioning of our list is very Richmond 2013-2016. An elite core with some decent support players and then a marked drop off at the bottom.

We've now even got the Martin going to North equivalent with Clarry to Carlton. It can turn quickly.

I reckon Richmond's Brownlow spread would have been similar in those aforementioned years to ours tonight.

Fix the system, bring in Yze, two or three other highly rated assistants, add Brown, Smith, Phillips and a speedy pressure forward or two and we'll be in the top 4 mix next year. The competition is soft. Richmond can't keep it going forever, Geelong are getting old. No one else scares me. 

In the last 4 years I've regularly thought we haven't seen the 'worst' 6-8 on our list improve much.

I say worst becsuse anyone on an AFL list is obviously a reasonable footballer, to start with

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5 minutes ago, Moonshadow said:

In the last 4 years I've regularly thought we haven't seen the 'worst' 6-8 on our list improve much.

I say worst becsuse anyone on an AFL list is obviously a reasonable footballer, to start with

We need to turn over that bottom 10 or so and if we can add 4 or 5 best 22 players and maintain fitness, there's no reason we can't give 2021 a good shake.

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If you could have wished for Petracca to smash Dangerfield and Dusty in the Brownlow medal count at the beginning of the year every single person on Demonland would have taken it.

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17 minutes ago, Swooper1987 said:

The Bluey has thrown up all sorts of bizarre results over the years.  Flower one it once only and is our best player since the halcyon days.  RDB won it only a couple of times. Danny Hughes beat Gerard Healy in 1985; Laurie Fowler was a multiple winner during Flower's best years; Brian Wilson and Peter Moore both won Brownlow's in the 80's and neither won the B&F in the year they won it. It's a bit of pot luck.  Oliver may be unhappy with his 5th placing, but he got very lucky the previous year when he tied with Gawn.  

 

I forgot about when Danny Hughes beat Healy. I hope he reminds Gerard every time he sees him! 

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4 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

Cause Swanny was a real oil painting.

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5 minutes ago, A F said:

We need to turn over that bottom 10 or so and if we can add 4 or 5 best 22 players and maintain fitness, there's no reason we can't give 2021 a good shake.

Correct. We need to stop holding onto depth players and players who aren’t up to the grade hoping they’ll come good for so long.

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9 minutes ago, A F said:

Cause Swanny was a real oil painting.

Swanny is still upset that Oliver doesn't think he's cool.

#Swannytryingtostayrelavent

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29 minutes ago, Swooper1987 said:

And well done to Gawn, who was clearly the top vote getter amongst the ruckmen.  His first half of the season was outstanding, until his injury.  Thoroughly deserved his AA.  Interesting the umpires only gave Naitanui 5 votes for his season.  11 marks across the year tells you what the umpires notice and what they don't. 

 

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3 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

The umpires are the worst people to judge the Brownlow.

When the award was minted it made sense but not any more.

 

I personally think the coaches’ award is the one to watch for real insight.  With that said, there’s not many times the Brownlow has gone to an undeserving recipient.

 

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Such an ambiguous award in so many ways. 
 

It really should be a combination of coaches and umpires because they both see it completely different - how that can be calculated I have NFI. 
 

The AA team is a popularity contest for the best part. 
 

I hate being so critical of individual awards but in an ultimate team sport these are all open to all types of interpretations. 

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46 minutes ago, A F said:

As I mentioned the other day, the positioning of our list is very Richmond 2013-2016. An elite core with some decent support players and then a marked drop off at the bottom.

We've now even got the Martin going to North equivalent with Clarry to Carlton. It can turn quickly.

I reckon Richmond's Brownlow spread would have been similar in those aforementioned years to ours tonight.

Fix the system, bring in Yze, two or three other highly rated assistants, add Brown, Smith, Phillips and a speedy pressure forward or two and we'll be in the top 4 mix next year. The competition is soft. Richmond can't keep it going forever, Geelong are getting old. No one else scares me. 

You could definitely see the drop off in quality with the lions last night too. A good core but some pretty ordinary players amongst them.

As you say, tweak the list and get the system / process working well so that the second and third tier players start to look like champs too.

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1 hour ago, america de cali said:

image.thumb.jpeg.a0fc4eb7fa3cb99e436e399b712eaa53.jpeg

Is this his partner or a "date" a lot of boys go with a model if they don't have a partner etc  Always a glamorous  lady who wants to go out for thew evening and get some publicity. 

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