POSTGAME: Rd 15 vs Sydney

[Skuit 9,109]

2 minutes ago, Pickett2Jackson said:

Who can blame them for being spent early after they carried us over the line against the Saints with very little help

They were our best performers across the day. Oliver and some of our other defenders also helped get us across the line and Langdon didn't stop. Has no relation to what I posted. Langdon looked to have plenty of cookies on Thursday. Heat and humidity will effect different people in different ways. It's accepted as pretty normal fact of civilian life. 

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,100]

“Don’t think it was us rising - more the Dees being flat as a tack.

I haven’t seen a lower-pressure opposition this season”

- some Swans  bloke on bigfooty, 5-9-2020
 

 

[Skuit 9,109]

Saw a dozen broken tackles in the first five minutes and knew we were done. 

 

[Half forward flank 1,022]

I have said it before and had it dismissed and howled down by some. So many long time supporters here have had a raw deal following the Dees for nearly 60 years without a flag.  I dont need to go over the failures in depth again for now. So following Thursdays game, the trinity, Pert, Barlett and Mahoney. Maybe the are hurting too, maybe it is a kind of blow to their professional pride but as none of them were Dees until much later in life it is a very mild version of what we are suffering. How can you hurt as much as us, those who went through their whole school and workplace lives without success. Those of us who cant bear to watch footy classics such a the Grand Final replays each year. Those of us who have lost at the punt either $$$ or fun tipping contests, Those of us who have been to grounds like Carlton on a training day, and seen a Club and supporters with something to call their own,  You can add Goodwin to the trinity but some here will argure that coaches do come from other clubs, true, only remember, A South australian has never coached a non South Australian team to a flag.

As of now another year will finish

without finals success

without a home base

with significant list deficiences

with a question mark over the coaches -plural ability to get the best out of our players

 

Edited September 4, 2020 by Half forward flank

[Mazer Rackham 14,968]

9 hours ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Can someone explain to me why Sydney have played absolutely brilliantly against us 2 years in a row, despite being a bottom 4 side with bugger all to play for in both years.

We were dog diarrhoea yesterday but I’m giving all the credit to Sydney. They attacked us from minute 1 when they ran down Salem after Petracca stupidly handed him the hot potato.

What did Sydney have to gain out of yesterday aside from a bit of pride and the loss of a top 3 draft pick?

I don’t get it?

They smelt blood and knew this was exactly the kind of game we drop. They prepared for that situation and as usual we let the door hit us on the dong on the way in, and on the *rse on the way out.

 

 

Not to mention every club, every club's players and coaches, every club's supporters, all knew this game was set up perfectly for a classic MFC fall-on-your-face effort. Except the MFC players and coaches.

Edited September 4, 2020 by Mazer Rackham

[Kent 2,574]

18 hours ago, Mickey said:

Which we lose after Essendon jump us and kick 7 in the first 10 minutes 

Yes and Goodwin says post match

"I didnt see that coming" or "They Jumped us and we couldn't respond"

Get rid of this low IQ stubborn coach please.

[Mazer Rackham 14,968]

2 minutes ago, Kent said:

Yes and Goodwin says post match

"I didnt see that coming" or "They Jumped us and we couldn't respond"

Get rid of this low IQ stubborn coach please.

"They kept kicking it to each other which shook us to the core. We didn't know you could do that."

"We'll see what learnings we can take away from that and by 2028 we'll be ready for them. If we still have a club that is."

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,132]

I support our schedule fatigue and the day preparations of travelling from Maroochydore that morning would not help for the best output and are likely the reason our intensity and run was off. However you control the things you can like the players selected and the make up of the team. We clearly  went in too tall and lacked run. We continued to persevere with players in Jones and Melksham who are clearly out of form and or had the game pass them by. We could have brought in some youthful energy or a player who might throw his all at a chance like Bedford, Baker or even C Wagner. Sometime you need to manufacture the energy. These were all choices for the coach coming into this game.

We then fell for the oldest one in the book and did not know how to use a wind or defend a wind. That wasn’t lack of energy particulartly in the first half it was lack of the right type of play. Again mostly in the coaches control. I will give some credit to Goodwin in the second half that at least he threw the magnets about a bit to generate something. However this was more a game lost by the coach than things out of his control.

I am hoping finally Goodwin takes the loss and the shortbreak as an opportunity to right some things, but it doesn’t seem to be his way. Our backline should be May, Lever, Tomlinson with running backs. Bring run and difference into our midfield with Baker at minimum on a wing and Melksham or Wagner or Bennell instead of Viney into the mix. Two tall forwards with proper smalls (Pickett and Bedford) that pressure inc Viney as a high half forward. We can only afford one of Fritsch, Melksham and Hannan and I would go Fritsch on notice.

I think we can learn a lot from the Freo game and if we win then the Giants game becomes a  final without officially being one. 

Let’s se what we learn but I don’t hold much hope.

Edited September 4, 2020 by big_red_fire_engine

[My name is legion 158]

Why do posters on here think fringe VFL players like Bedford, the Wagners, and Baker are the solution to our problems? They’re not. They should be delisted and we should get some more elite players in.

[mauriesy 6,783]

They're not the solutions to our problems. But maybe a fresh Bedford, Baker or Wagner is still better, for at least a match or two, than a tired or flagging Jones or Melksham.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 10,132]

17 minutes ago, My name is legion said:

Why do posters on here think fringe VFL players like Bedford, the Wagners, and Baker are the solution to our problems? They’re not. They should be delisted and we should get some more elite players in.

Because they have a different set of attributes that could change the dynamic of the side and solve some our overall deficiencies. It is obvious we lack run and are one paced. Bedford, C Wagner and Baker serve this well and between them have less than 30 games development. I would prefer to shift the dynamic and see if one or more rises to the occasion with consecutive games of development. The alternative is to persevere with players who have had plenty of chance to develop and show consistent output (ANB, AVB, Hunt, Hannan) or have validated the game has seen their best (Jones, Melksham, Jetta).   

Edited September 4, 2020 by big_red_fire_engine

[DeeZee 6,718]

It’s all about  run and zip and we only have one player in Langdon doing that so we need more 

Bedford and Baker have those attributes 

[Deemania since 56 6,119]

3 hours ago, Half forward flank said:

I have said it before and had it dismissed and howled down by some. So many long time supporters here have had a raw deal following the Dees for nearly 60 years without a flag.  I dont need to go over the failures in depth again for now. So following Thursdays game, the trinity, Pert, Barlett and Mahoney. Maybe the are hurting too, maybe it is a kind of blow to their professional pride but as none of them were Dees until much later in life it is a very mild version of what we are suffering. How can you hurt as much as us, those who went through their whole school and workplace lives without success. Those of us who cant bear to watch footy classics such a the Grand Final replays each year. Those of us who have lost at the punt either $$$ or fun tipping contests, Those of us who have been to grounds like Carlton on a training day, and seen a Club and supporters with something to call their own,  You can add Goodwin to the trinity but some here will argure that coaches do come from other clubs, true, only remember, A South australian has never coached a non South Australian team to a flag.

As of now another year will finish

without finals success

without a home base

with significant list deficiences

with a question mark over the coaches -plural ability to get the best out of our players

 

A real cause for concern (s). It is now endemic, historical, anticipated, ignored. Someone thinks they know better and have failed to prove it for too long. 

[Deemania since 56 6,119]

7 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

It’s all about  run and zip and we only have one player in Langdon doing that so we need more 

Bedford and Baker have those attributes 

....and it is being denied for the likes of Sunset Man (Jones) and OMac (Snail).

[Demon Dynasty 15,186]

22 hours ago, GCDee said:

They haven't learnt the lesson after being burnt time and time again. They are either not serious about winning or don't believe in the system.

GC, personally i believe most are just in it for the ride / coin and actually happy to just be (and when needed try and stay) in the system that is the AFL circus.

A few, genuinely passionate about bettering themselves and taking their game to the next level, maybe finals and a GF if lucky.

The rest, just do enough to keep their mouths close enough to the trough to get an occasional snout into the swill.

It's no surprise the bulk of them pick and choose whether they'll show up on game day.

So many of the also rans keep getting a game week in and week out, regardless of how they perform.  Why would they bother to turn it on every week when they know it really doesn't matter either way, they'll be strapping their boots on and running out in the next match or worst case the one after, maybe a two week break tops.

Who cares what happens on game day.  Crocodile tears from those who CGAFF i reckon.  Probably also applies to most at top brass admin level as well.  A rare exception here or there but most are just in it for the ride / coin (President aside).  And that last part would apply to most clubs, we aren't alone there.

As i say before every season with this mob... "hope for the best but be very prepared for the worst".

Edited September 5, 2020 by Rusty Nails

[old dee 22,807]

5 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

GC, personally i believe most are just in it for the ride and actually happy to just be (and when needed try and stay) in the system that is the AFL circus.

A few, genuinely passionate about bettering themselves and taking their game to the next level, maybe finals and a GF if lucky.

The rest, just do enough to keep their mouths close enough to the trough to get an occasional snout into the swill.

It's no surprise the bulk of them pick and choose whether they'll show up on game day.

So many of the also rans keep getting a game week in and week out, regardless of how they perform.  Why would they bother to turn it on every week when they know it really doesn't matter either way, they'll be strapping their boots on and running out in the next match or worst case the one after, maybe a two week break tops.

Who cares what happens on game day.  Crocodile tears from those who CGAFF i reckon.

As i say before every season with this mob... "hope for the best but be very prepared for the worst".

Sadly I have to agree with you RN. The most mystifying thing for me is why we all keep coming back for more every year. 

[Coq au vin 754]

4 hours ago, big_red_fire_engine said:

Because they have a different set of attributes that could change the dynamic of the side and solve some our overall deficiencies. It is obvious we lack run and are one paced. Bedford, C Wagner and Baker serve this well and between them have less than 30 games development. I would prefer to shift the dynamic and see if one or more rises to the occasion with consecutive games of development. The alternative is to persevere with players who have had plenty of chance to develop and show consistent output (ANB, AVB, Hunt, Hannan) or have validated the game has seen their best (Jones, Melksham, Jetta).   

So you don’t think we should have persisted with Petracca and Gawn then?
These fringe players will never be any good. This is why MFC is a joke even recruiting them!

[Demon Dynasty 15,186]

4 hours ago, old dee said:

Sadly I have to agree with you RN. The most mystifying thing for me is why we all keep coming back for more every year. 

Personally my reasoning is ....the stars might all perfectly align in the next 25 years or so, IF i last that long, and a miracle season occurs a la the Swans in 2005 OD.  Each year that goes by i hope for better but expect the usual collapse/fail at some stage or potentially worse.

Following the MFC is like being in a ground hog day sports fan movie.  Every year is VERY predictable and nothing ever changes.  A good year for us seems to be...still being in the finals race post Rnd 6.

One thing we are very good at though, is our consistency and penchant for failing.  I must look to take out more betting options in this regard and cash in a little more often like some do on here.  Clever cookies they are.

[titan_uranus 22,218]

6 hours ago, My name is legion said:

Why do posters on here think fringe VFL players like Bedford, the Wagners, and Baker are the solution to our problems? They’re not. They should be delisted and we should get some more elite players in.

It's so simple!

All we have to do is have 44 elite, best 22 players on our list!

[dpositive 1,547]

On 9/4/2020 at 11:40 AM, BillyBoy said:

I have been following MFC since the early 1960s and have been a long-time paid up Member (in high tier of the membership commitment).

I live in NSW but up until this year I have attended 16 games a year in Melbourne (as per home-and-away Membership).

I don't think I will renew my membership again this time around.

Why?

1. I did not withdraw my membership this year even though I knew there would be no possibility of attending games. I did write to the MFC asking them to reciprocate by negotiating cheap Kayo subscriptions for members, particularly those in NSW, who rarely are able to even watch the games on TV (7 Mate only carries a few games up here). MFC declined that suggestion. So I concluded the loyalty in these difficult times was one-way - me to them.

2. Irrespective of the fact they mistakenly renewed the senior coaches contract for some years it is clear he is consistently out coached by smarter operators. He needs to be replaced. He appears inflexible and is often outwitted by other strategies (the Footscray game was a classic example of that).

3. His game plan, inasmuch as there is one, relies on skill levels that our players do not seem to have. I cannot tell whether that is a basic talent issue (player problem) or a lack of player development issue (coaching problem).

4. They consistently select players that are incapable of the standard. Hiding Oscar in the forward line yesterday was embarrassing.

5. I did manage to see a game in Sydney this year. Melksham was playing poorly and at one stage he came off the field to the interchange and a supporter (there weren't many) shouted something about getting a move on (nothing offensive) and Melksham replied something like "come down here you [censored]" (threatening the spectator) which summarised his disdain for those who support the club through thick and thin. He rarely sets the world on fire with his play, often doesn't contest and is clearly a product of poor decision-making from the coach via his Essendon connection.

6. The fact they select players who cannot compete with the better teams and/or (most importantly) lesser teams that display more earnest indicates a recruitment problem. Despite all the fanfare about Lever, for example, the rate of return to the club from his contract is very low, and I am not including his injury period (which was not his fault) in that assessment. He talks a lot about leadership but is not worth the fee. Steven May is clearly playing well and apart from his initial misadventure (overweight/undertrained etc) has contributed strongly to the club. But he is also expensive. That outlay might have been justified if we were that close to contesting the GF. But we are light-years from that now and we should have used that cash to develop some younger talents. Some of the other recruitment decisions and trading away draft picks are mind-boggling.

7. I can cope the team losing - we have been loyal for decades with that the norm - but when I saw players not even running last night as Sydney players broke tackles with ease - then one has to question why I pay several hundred dollars a year to fund that sort of player commitment. There is a disconnect somewhere and it doesn't seem to be getting any better. The post-match analysis from the journalists often highlight the lack of two-way run from many of our players, who often seem to be coasting. I have seen that a lot.

These are reasons among others why I find it difficult to continue. I thought things were on the improve with Jackson/Roos. But whatever development work they put in seems to have been squandered by a series of poor followup decisions, including the senior coach appointment.

It is very hard psychologically to remain anything other than detached from what is going on with the MFC. And, footy after all is just a game that we seek a bit of fun away from our other, more serious endeavours in life.

Two things the club should do to change this:

1. Get an established senior coach who has demonstrated their skills. If the club asked me to put in an extra hundred bucks or something to help them pay out existing contracts I would do that in a flash.

2. Stop talking about brands and all that hype and admit that the team is nowhere near being a successful finals club with its current list and use that cultural shift to renew the list. St Kilda and Carlton are now ahead of us in prospect and Sydney and Fremantle will next overtake us.

 

 

 

I understand all you say and agree with all but point 2.

The current list has enough depth and variation that we should be a successful finals club. That we lost to Brisbane and Geelong by less than a kick, shows we can be.

Port was similar to Dgs  and Sydney where the players just did not participate for 100%.

Richmond and West Coast were contests we lost that should be analysed to replace the players or structures that failed.

We needto use the total squad at the appropriate time, and have a variety of structures and game practices to match our opponents.

Goodwin may still be able to retain his base game plan and be flexible enough with selection and game day tactics to salvage the season, some of that may well be reliant on a culture change, indeed may bring about the cultural change, but I believe you are correct that without that cultural change the club will slowly bleed and lose valuable members, who, as this site recognises have much to offer.

[old dee 22,807]

On 9/5/2020 at 9:44 AM, DeeZee said:

It’s all about  run and zip and we only have one player in Langdon doing that so we need more 

Bedford and Baker have those attributes 

First you have to get the ball, neither are high in that at Casey level. I am not against trying them but don’t expect too much.