POSTGAME: Rd 15 vs Sydney

[Fork 'em 6,507]

6 minutes ago, RalphiusMaximus said:

 Obviously those weren't the only goals we missed today, but they were probably the worst.  More importantly, the top sides don't miss those shots.  It's just a fact of life.  If a Geelong mid has a set shot from 45m directly in front, you're going to back them to put it through the middle.  If they have a set shot from 25-20 out, you'd more or less put your house on it.  With us it's always a coin toss and today more of those tosses went the wrong way.   

And they'll miss the ones we need most.
They all go to water with the slightest pressure.

[Binmans PA 25,978]

The ball use was horrendous.

Interesting Max talked about 'bombing it long being in our DNA for nearly two years' and that we'd got that out of our game the last few weeks. It was back tonight and although we were terrible in the second quarter, we failed to convert our dominance in the first quarter (unlike against St Kilda in that first term) and it meant we were playing catch up after that.

 

[Go the Biff 3,127]

MFCSS strikes again. 

[P-man 13,168]

I am loath to make excuses for that dross, but flying up that day to face a team who had been there since Saturday to prepare can’t have helped. They just looked so lethargic from the outset. It was almost like we got the worst traits of every player.

Viney’s selfishness and lack of awareness.

Oliver’s horrendous kicking, at times being lucky to make contact with the ball.

Gawn tapping it to no-one, or failing that, a Sydney midfielder.

Melksham’s DUMB decisions and outright laziness.

Fritta’s total and complete unwillingness to defend.

OMac’s OMacing.

Even Langers god bless him, as well as he played, missed a couple of set shots which he simply had to nail. Kicking has always been the knock against him.

You could run through the entire list. If it was a DrJekyll versus Mr Hyde exercise, there were a hell of a lot of Hydes out there.

Also, the secret recipe when looking at the team sheet never eventuated. There was no rabbit out of the hat coming. We looked too tall down back on paper and so it was on the field. Smith looked out of place and out of his depth yet again

Desperately disappointing performance. One that makes you almost wish we don’t make finals because really, what’s the poin? Somehow I don’t think that will be a concern.

But at the very least, get some fresh, fast legs into the side next week, and only select players who you know will give everything they have to give. 

[RalphiusMaximus 5,993]

1 minute ago, P-man said:

. Smith looked out of place and out of his depth yet again
 

One big wrap for Smith.  He took on three or four opponents for a ground ball and managed to force a ball-up.  It was his one shining moment, but it was something the rest of the team lacked for most of the day.  If he had the skills and football smarts to match his power and athleticism he'd win a Brownlow. 

[dee-tox 4,793]

2 hours ago, Pickett2Jackson said:

Jesus we have picked another bad captain

There were no positives. Not one

He's playing the media game which is what he'd be told to do.

With that said, he again looked a poor leader tonight. Part of the problem and appearing to provide no leadership in the second quarter when we were screaming out for it.

The laughing after the game thing was atrocious.

[Hellofatime 83]

6 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

Goodwin and Richardson in coaches box, near silent for much of the game

Goodwin would've been better on the boundary. At least he'd know the message got through

What message?  He doesn't have the answers.

[Half forward flank 1,022]

Just when you think it could not get any worse. The Goody itch and scratch has extended to his right arm and head.

[forever demons 1,810]

7 hours ago, rolling fog said:

None of the players look too disappointed

because they werent

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,126]

As soon as I saw the weather report I knew we’d get done.

As soon as there’s a slight breeze we fall to pieces.

 

[Deesprate 1,162]

8 hours ago, KLV said:

Just watched Goodwin’s presser, every week, he relates what happened (we know, we were watching) but gives no explanation about why and either what could have been done to prevent the devastating loss or what was the difference in the win. It tells us nothing.

and I’m fixated on the left leg scratch, tonight he tried very hard to try alternatives, like scratching his head.

really, who would be a senior coach?

Damien Hardwick doesn’t mind the caper. Goody speak words that don’t mean anything. Coaching is about leadership and getting the best out of people. Can someone tell me what coaching has gone into Max Gawn kicking since he cost us the game against Geelong three years ago. Nothing the answer. Why is the question I would ask. Gawn look like he just want the season finished.

[Deesprate 1,162]

51 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

As soon as I saw the weather report I knew we’d get done.

As soon as there’s a slight breeze we fall to pieces.

 

Agree wind show up players with poor skills

[pitmaster 3,059]

Unlike some here I didn't mind Oscar going forward. We had to hide him somewhere because he was hurting us so much in defence.

Maybe Goodwin has worked out that we cannot afford him.

[layzie 28,672]

Stupid morning after ?

[Fat Tony 4,397]

As much as our selection and tactics were diabolical and some of our fringe players were terrible, we really lost this game for 2 reasons. 
 

1. Oliver and Petracca had horrible disposal. 
 

2. Unacceptable goal kicking. 
 

Unless our best midfielders start using the ball better and our forwards kick straight, we can never expect to win. 

[old dee 22,843]

And so another year of irreleventance draws to a close. 

[Kent 2,581]

what the hell was wrong with Petracca last night?

[Demon Dynasty 15,365]

57 minutes ago, pitmaster said:

Unlike some here I didn't mind Oscar going forward. We had to hide him somewhere because he was hurting us so much in defence.

Maybe Goodwin has worked out that we cannot afford him.

I doubt it.  We would need SG to go to see No-Mac out of the team in a permanent sense i reckon.  Him & Macca seemed to back No-Mac in big time over Dunny years back and SG would lose face if this one fails.

These two are way too pally for my liking, regardless of how good or ordinary the player might be.  And most would know my thoughts on No-Mac here.  Not a good look.

Why would you put No-Mac up forward last night?  If you were gonna sacrifice down back it had to be May up forward and shortly after half time if we were to have any chance of turning it around.  Better to pull No-Mac and just play Tomlinson in this place if he had nowhere to hide him surely.

Anyone watching till half time could see Weid was having a mare (along with most up forward but he's the focal point and where you generate most of your goals from either directly or off the contested spill...we got neither).

As witnessed last night, no matter how good May is as a defender, if you team defence sucks AND your forward line fails to fire you are completely stuffed at both ends, even against mediocre opposition who decide to put in their best effort.

Melk, Fritta & Weid ... Zero goals between them!

Didn't watch the last 10 min but when did May come on?  Immediately we got a result?  As much as Melk is handy up the field for hitting a target inside 50, aside from the odd cameo on rare occasions which makes him handy in a downhill sense, if the team isn't flying he can be bog ordinary, especially defensively.

Fritta another one trick pony.  Both of those blokes the ball hits the deck what do we get 95% of the time?

Weid not much better at ground ball gets but not expected to be given the size/position, passable if given the ball on the receive.  Very lazy Weid last night? playing from behind and not getting to the drop when players are coming out of the middle under pressure.  And not the first time?  Wants it on a platter or not at all?

Seriously when you have to think about (and in an emergency do) switching your best defender up forward because your forward line has completely failed (and not just once, last week was barely much better aside from a couple of conversions from Weid) means we are still in a world of trouble forward of centre.

I've said it before and i still wasn't convinced even after winning 4 of the 5 up till the Saints, we STILL don't have a reliable genuine KF who we can depend on week in week out to kick at least a couple and clunk a few much needed marks up forward.

I tell you what though, there is one bloke who can and could do it if we had one more dour defender of his size down back and that bloke is Steven May.

This bloke has ticker and can play forward and seems (from what i've witnessed) to be a VN kick.  Reads the ball beautifully and knows how to position himself to outmark / outpoint his opponent.

This season to me is pretty much shot.  What the hell would we do even if we managed to get it in the eight?  We'd be straight out with this inept forward line i reckon.

Why not consider May up forward and play Tomlinson in his place?  Might be the coaching move of the season.  Ok so it might fail as well.  We would know pretty quickly i'd think.

What have we got to lose if it comes off?  What have we got to gain if it works?  May would be hard to stop up forward imo and also get ball to the drop more often vs Weid (more a lead up forward).

Would certainly set the cat amongst the opp pigeons.  A few defenders might be hearing footsteps with him running at full tilt.

Would also add some much needed leadership and a fabulous focal point for our blokes to get it to, especially if they know he will kick 3 to 4 on occasions and quite possibly be the edge on the day (incentive).

Let's face it... whatever we have now aint gonna cut it against most in the eight, bar maybe GWS and/or the Pies IF we get them at a lowish ebb.  And after that?  We'll get crunched as we stand now with this forward line up.

Edited September 3, 2020 by Rusty Nails

[binman 37,924]

1 hour ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

As soon as I saw the weather report I knew we’d get done.

As soon as there’s a slight breeze we fall to pieces.

 

This. 

I thought the report looked fine.

But one i started watching pre game and they were talking about the strength of the wind i had a sinking feeling.

And that's because we simply have two fey decent kicks and too may sub AFL standard kicks.

Wirh no exaggeration rhey had a kid who kicked his first goal in afl footy wo has a better technique and is a better kick that close on to 35 blokes on our list.

 

[titan_uranus 22,284]

1 minute ago, binman said:

This. 

I thought the report looked fine.

But one i started watching pre game and they were talking about the strength of the wind i had a sinking feeling.

And that's because we simply have two fey decent kicks and too may sub AFL standard kicks.

Wirh no exaggeration rhey had a kid who kicked his first goal in afl footy wo has a better technique and is a better kick that close on to 35 blokes on our list.

 

I'm not sure the weather exacerbated our poor kicking.

But I am sure it exacerbated our poor decision making.

Whether it's on the coaches for failing to make sure we knew what we were doing going into the game, or on the players for their ineptitude, we were just mindlessly kicking it long to hope the wind did the job for us.

[Ethan Tremblay 28,358]

The wind/weather had nothing to do with it, Sydney’s disposal wasn’t great either, they simply wanted it more and went in with a plan. 

[Lucifers Hero 36,991]

I apologise to Max in advance because I love him.  But I am frustrated with some parts of his game.  The 'misdirected' taps I've mentioned earlier.  The other part is lack of handball when he takes a mark or gets a free kick.

9.5 time of 10 he takes the kick.  He almost never hand passes to a runner along side (usually there is no runner alongside) nor does he look for a runner.  The very best ruckman have this in their tool kit.  Not necessarily to be used all the time but it would make Max less predictable if he had it or used it more often.

Our best ball movement is when we have overlap players running forward.  Max hand balling from a mark/free kick would greatly facilitate that.  Kicking it just allows time for the op to set up their defence.  Now Max isn't the best kick going round and often the ball ends up marked by the op. 

I'm not raising this because we lost.  It is the way he and the team play.  When we played more of the play-on-at-all-costs football Max would just take his kick faster.  He didn't handball.  I can only assume it is a coaching direction to go back an kick rather than handball.  

Goldstein nearly always handballs.  Nic Nat and Grundy probably 50/50.

Has anyone else noticed Max's lack of handball vs kicking?

[Half forward flank 1,022]

I am not being overly defeatist but if we fail to make it this year success in 2021 is in serious doubt without significant change. If we are stuck with Goody someone needs to get in his ear, maybe someone not even connected to the Club. Someone with life experience he will listen to. There are certain players that need to move on and will destroy this coach and the next. Some are reasonable footballers in their own right but not a fit for our team. Nothing will change with them.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

Right, having had time to sleep on it, I've come to a few conclusions... even if I still have a dirty taste in my mouth from last night!

I've seen it mentioned in another thread, and in here, that we only flew up to Cairns the day of the game, while the Swans were there for a few days prior.  Now, that might have had an impact on us, but you know what?  The really good sides find a way to win regardless.  I know teams will lose games, but it wasn't as if we were playing a Top 4 side last night.  If it had of been Brisbane, or Port, or the Tigers etc, then you could understand the outcome a little more.  But the Swans are a bottom 4 side, missing some of their very best players.  We can't use it as an excuse.  If we're a good side, then we find a way to win and move on.  Instead, we served up some absolute slop and coughed up four important points.

On the flip side, the one thing we can hold on to, is that we aren't out of the finals race by an means.  I know that we could possibly fall over the line and get knocked out in the first round, but getting back there could have a really positive effect on the club in numerous ways - experience, membership, confidence etc.  I don't want to get there to just be a one and done side, but I can't write us off just yet.

Last thing - if last night showed us anything, it's that we have the opportunity to make some big calls on the list this off season.  There are still plenty of players out of contract that we can let go and move on from.  If we want to go from a good side to a very good side, then we need to make the tough calls while we can.

[Die Hard Demon 1,152]

34 minutes ago, Fat Tony said:

As much as our selection and tactics were diabolical and some of our fringe players were terrible, we really lost this game for 2 reasons. 
 

1. Oliver and Petracca had horrible disposal. 
 

2. Unacceptable goal kicking. 
 

Unless our best midfielders start using the ball better and our forwards kick straight, we can never expect to win. 

You’re first reason is why I can never see Melbourne under Goodwin being a successful side. We just rely WAY too heavily on our best players getting us across the line. Did you watch Richmond on Wed night? Dusty had a stinker.. but they have 21 other blokes who play a role & play it well. Last week we don’t beat Saints if Trac, May & Gawn don’t play. We’re so predictable.. Shut down our best & we go to water. 

Edited September 3, 2020 by Die Hard Demon