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"Soft as butter": Bartlett's stinging attack on Melbourne Players



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58 minutes ago, A F said:

This is [censored] and I'm sick of hearing it to be honest.

Millennials are no tougher or weaker than previous generations, they're just more willing to discuss their emotions.

Speaking as a millennial and as someone who often takes criticism in my profession, this sort of blanket statement is sheepish ignorance. 

I'm not sure about this. I'm a baby boomer. I grew up with parents and subsequently had parents-in-law that lived through the Great Depression, the Second World War and the polio pandemic of the 1950s. Their experiences - going hungry, living in war zones, becoming stateless citizens, etc - rubbed off on me and essentially everyone in the baby boomer generation. We haven't passed that on to our children, the so-called millenials, because we didn't experience it first hand and because we would prefer not to do so.

In addition, anyone who is under the age of 40 and has lived in Australia all their lives has no recollection of a recession or interest rates at 17%. 

We baby boomers definitely had it easier than our parents and for that reason, I believe we are not as strong as our parents had to be. I'm now seeing people whinging about 6 weeks of lockdown when our parents had 6 years of deprivation because of World War 2 (and much longer if you add in the Depression or lived in places other than Australia in the 1930s). I doubt very much millenials are as tough as earlier generations, but could prove to be so in time. I just hope they don't have ongoing circumstances which will require them to prove it.

(I also recognise that not everyone in Australia has had a charmed life. For example, some have come from more recent war zones.) 

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Here are some of the choice words he used: "It was disgraceful.  When you pull on a Melbourne jumper, we don't give them out in Weeties packets" "You have to show respect for the jumper and

Here are a few more that I missed: "I have defended our footy department, our coaches and players my whole tenure but I can't defend that.  How can you defend that? "I said at the start of t

Scathing alright.  Never seen him react this way before. I am also glad that internally they're fuming big time.

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24 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I'm not sure about this. I'm a baby boomer. I grew up with parents and subsequently had parents-in-law that lived through the Great Depression, the Second World War and the polio pandemic of the 1950s. Their experiences - going hungry, living in war zones, becoming stateless citizens, etc - rubbed off on me and essentially everyone in the baby boomer generation. We haven't passed that on to our children, the so-called millenials, because we didn't experience it first hand and because we would prefer not to do so.

In addition, anyone who is under the age of 40 and has lived in Australia all their lives has no recollection of a recession or interest rates at 17%. 

We baby boomers definitely had it easier than our parents and for that reason, I believe we are not as strong as our parents had to be. I'm now seeing people whinging about 6 weeks of lockdown when our parents had 6 years of deprivation because of World War 2 (and much longer if you add in the Depression or lived in places other than Australia in the 1930s). I doubt very much millenials are as tough as earlier generations, but could prove to be so in time. I just hope they don't have ongoing circumstances which will require them to prove it.

(I also recognise that not everyone in Australia has had a charmed life. For example, some have come from more recent war zones.) 

This is a far too narrow view of what defines toughness and weakness.

Baby boomers have probably had it the easiest, given the wage growth and living through the golden age of capitalism in the 70s and 80s, but millennials are dealing with a world that has drastically changed, that we're constantly connected to via socials and technology and I'm not sure you can blanketly compare war time experience and living in the modern age. Gen Z probably have it even harder than millennials. 

The Boomer generation haven't particularly lived through wars and/or displacement, although you could argue a little bit with Vietnam and then Gen X having to deal with the ever-present threat of nuclear war and the Cold War.

My point is every generation has to face certain challenges and whilst as a coach and as a person, I dislike some of the parenting of Gen X and millennials with the current generation of children, which I believe is fostering a lack of resilience in some schools and in some households, each generation has their own challenges and generational politics is just [censored].

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2 hours ago, A F said:

This is [censored] and I'm sick of hearing it to be honest.

Millennials are no tougher or weaker than previous generations, they're just more willing to discuss their emotions.

Speaking as a millennial and as someone who often takes criticism in my profession, this sort of blanket statement is sheepish ignorance. 

I should have narrowed it down to AFL discussion. 

Surely you've heard that the modern day young AFL footballer is less willing to receive criticism and responds less favorably than previous generations. Well that's what I hear when I listen to AFL shows on the radio and watch on TV.

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53 minutes ago, A F said:

This is a far too narrow view of what defines toughness and weakness.

Baby boomers have probably had it the easiest, given the wage growth and living through the golden age of capitalism in the 70s and 80s, but millennials are dealing with a world that has drastically changed, that we're constantly connected to via socials and technology and I'm not sure you can blanketly compare war time experience and living in the modern age. Gen Z probably have it even harder than millennials. 

The Boomer generation haven't particularly lived through wars and/or displacement, although you could argue a little bit with Vietnam and then Gen X having to deal with the ever-present threat of nuclear war and the Cold War.

My point is every generation has to face certain challenges and whilst as a coach and as a person, I dislike some of the parenting of Gen X and millennials with the current generation of children, which I believe is fostering a lack of resilience in some schools and in some households, each generation has their own challenges and generational politics is just [censored].

Well argued (even though it's against me!).

By the way, aren't millenials and Gen Zs the same thing by a different name?

 

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13 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

I should have narrowed it down to AFL discussion. 

Surely you've heard that the modern day young AFL footballer is less willing to receive criticism and responds less favorably than previous generations. Well that's what I hear when I listen to AFL shows on the radio and watch on TV.

I reckon it's how the message is delivered.

Deliver it constructively and most people will cop it on the chin.

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7 hours ago, spirit of norm smith said:

Effort was not the issue.  It’s the skills.  Kicking.  Handballing.  Not enough concentration.  Not smart enough to kick it to advantage. It’s needed work for how many years. Countless. 

Agree. But there's a limit to how much those skills can be improved. Most players are never going to have the foot skills, control and decision making of a Salem or Watts, no matter how much it's worked on.

Equally, it can be maximised, and Steven May touched on it in his after-match comments when he spoke of the need for more concentration. Which then comes back to your first point: it's not a question of physical effort, but mental effort.

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17 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Well argued (even though it's against me!).

By the way, aren't millenials and Gen Zs the same thing by a different name?

 

Nope, millennials are Gen Y and Gen Z is the generation below that. A lot of our younger players coming through, so soft types like Pickett and Oliver are Gen Z and Viney is on the cusp.

The Liberal Government has attacked young people in general for close to a decade, appealing to the boomer voting populace. Their ABC plant and one of the largest Liberal Party funderaisers Ita Butross (now chairperson of the ABC) trotted out this rubbish the other day and said millennials needed a hug. Pretty easy life when you grow up in Potts Point. 

This will start to change when all the boomers have retired over the next 5-10 years and they are no longer taxpayers. You can't keep attacking taxpayers, elections are won and lost off hip pocket.

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2 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Agree. But there's a limit to how much those skills can be improved. Most players are never going to have the foot skills, control and decision making of a Salem or Watts, no matter how much it's worked on.

Equally, it can be maximised, and Steven May touched on it in his after-match comments when he spoke of the need for more concentration. Which then comes back to your first point: it's not a question of physical effort, but mental effort.

Hoping for a response against Adelaide like the announcement by Hogan that he had cancer. Expecting more of what we have seen against the essendon seconds a couple of years back

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3 hours ago, binman said:

And the fact that the players were not mentally ready and didn't work hard enough is of course on the players but the coach has to take his share of responsibility too. A big share in my opinion.

Disagree. If professional footballers can't get themselves "up" for a match, there's nothing coaches - or anyone else - can do. Jordan Lewis was mentioned earlier in the thread - doubt if anyone ever had to read him the riot act about not being mentally ready. 

Steven May (again) also referred to this in his post-match comments, where he spoke of players thinking it'll all just happen.

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37 minutes ago, bing181 said:

Disagree. If professional footballers can't get themselves "up" for a match, there's nothing coaches - or anyone else - can do. Jordan Lewis was mentioned earlier in the thread - doubt if anyone ever had to read him the riot act about not being mentally ready. 

Steven May (again) also referred to this in his post-match comments, where he spoke of players thinking it'll all just happen.

The coach does not have a responsibility to make sure his players are mentally ready?

Sure things have changed but the coach doesn't have an important role in motivating the players, in psyching them up, in getting inside their heads and in the right frae of mind to go out and attack the opposition and execute the game plan?

If true this fella would hate what has become of modern footy coaching:

 

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1 hour ago, binman said:

The coach does not have a responsibility to make sure his players are mentally ready?

Sure things have changed but the coach doesn't have an important role in motivating the players, in psyching them up, in getting inside their heads and in the right frae of mind to go out and attack the opposition and execute the game plan?

If true this fella would hate what has become of modern footy coaching:

 

Smithy’s Good Mate...

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On 8/2/2020 at 3:00 PM, Rusty Nails said:

Some good highlights and explanations there Ox, especially the T-Mac side and Harmes losing his man also.  Both have not played much defence (T-Mac in recent times i mean) and it would appear to be showing here.  Not sure why we are trying to turn Harmes into a defender at this stage of his career.  He is a big game stopper in mid field who revels at the challenge of playing on the opp's better mids and pushing hard forward at times when the opportunity arises to punish his direct opponent and/or make him work his butt off and expend energy, even if he doesn't hit the score board.

Looking at that first screen shot, i would have thought O-Mac needs to at least be maintaining "touch" on his opponent if he isn't keeping an eye on him so he knows when his opponent has left his side surely.  Really basic blunder right there from where i'm sitting, especially given everyone was man on man until just before Dixon kick and little zoning going on to that point.

He seems incapable of keeping touch on his opponent. It seems the first thing a defender should do when the opposition has the ball is the stop your opponent from getting it. Not Oscar. And in fairness a lot of players do this. Drives me spare. You cannot give players 3-5 meters and expect to shut them down.

It has to be on instruction otherwise we would have stopped doing it 4 years ago.

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2 hours ago, binman said:

The coach does not have a responsibility to make sure his players are mentally ready?

Sure things have changed but the coach doesn't have an important role in motivating the players, in psyching them up, in getting inside their heads and in the right frae of mind to go out and attack the opposition and execute the game plan?

If true this fella would hate what has become of modern footy coaching:

 

worth remembering that this was a game in which the hawks were belted

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Loosing the next game may not be the worst thing for the MFC. Winning may just maintain the status quo. The last thing this club needs is more of the same. We need a large number of changes to the FD starting with a new chief of football and coach. The talent level is not as bad as these results suggest. We are no better than when Roos finished. We are going to hand North a very early pick. Which shows that particular gambit failed.

Tough decisions are needed, fiddling at the edges time has passed.

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50 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

He seems incapable of keeping touch on his opponent. It seems the first thing a defender should do when the opposition has the ball is the stop your opponent from getting it. Not Oscar. And in fairness a lot of players do this. Drives me spare. You cannot give players 3-5 meters and expect to shut them down.

It has to be on instruction otherwise we would have stopped doing it 4 years ago.

Accountable football Jnr ✔️   Roos says hello

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7 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

Accountable football Jnr ✔️   Roos says hello

I was at Roos' last game in charge where we lost by 100 down at the Cattery. We weren't particularly accountable that day. 

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Just now, A F said:

I was at Roos' last game in charge where we lost by 100 down at the Cattery. We weren't particularly accountable that day. 

Yes not a great finish AF but by that stage i think Roos and hence the boys, were all boarding the bus...

hawaii GIF

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1 hour ago, Rusty Nails said:

Accountable football Jnr ✔️   Roos says hello

Contest out football. Load up on contested ball winners. Don't worry about recruiting elite foot skills. Drum that philosophy into your successor. Roos say hello

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18 minutes ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

According to Leigh Matthews who was playing in it 

So they did. The 1975 grand final, beaten by the Roos by 55 points.

 Great speech though. Here is the text in full and a a bigger snippet of the audio:

https://speakola.com/sports/john-kennedy-dont-think-do-1975

 

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Tom Morris was just on otc and said something like he has it on good authority (people that he trusts very much) that if we don’t make finals Goodwin a job is not safe. 
The board is restless, members are restless and the president is restless. 
Gerard Healy said that Bartlett is a lawyer specialising in contract law and that maybe there is a clause in Goodwins contract that would save us paying him out in full. 
 

Wednesday nights game is huge. 

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2 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

Tom Morris was just on otc and said something like he has it on good authority (people that he trusts very much) that if we don’t make finals Goodwin a job is not safe. 
The board is restless, members are restless and the president is restless. 
Gerard Healy said that Bartlett is a lawyer specialising in contract law and that maybe there is a clause in Goodwins contract that would save us paying him out in full. 
 

Wednesday nights game is huge. 

I'm not convinced Tom Morris knows anything about the club.

The article he wrote the other day didn't feature anything, it was clickbait.

He may be right about what he's saying, I'm just not so sure he's got any "good authority" on it.

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