POSTGAME: Rd 09 vs Port Adelaide

[drdrake 3,035]

One thing that was extremely evident last night was all our players standing behind their opponent, especially wings and half forwards.  It looked like they were just looking for the easy handball over the top but unfortunately Port won the ball at the contest and their wings and  Half backs just charged forward with us 4-5 metres off them.

I'm not critical of the 3 talls up forward, our ball movement was terrible you can't point the finger at these guys, our mids just got smashed.

Salem is interesting, he isn't that run and carry half back , the only time we look dangerous coming off half back is when Hibbard gets the ball, Salem is almost a loose play and doesn't carry the football.

Olivers game was summed up when he had 2 players Gawn and someone else alone 30m in front of him, and he decided to go wide and kicked it directly to 2 Port Players with no Melbourne player with in 5m.  Hate to say it the ball for him is like a hot potato he just wants to flick it out to anyone, just get it away so he doesn't need to kick.

Brayshaw/Jones: As soon as he is on a wing they loses interest, put in the middle different players.  There is something going on here with these 2 and the coach it isn't healthy.

The work rate was really bad.  Work rate is a mind set, the game goes against us we don't increase our work rate, we get lazy and look for easy touches sitting back.

Port did want every team has done against us for 12 years, just put numbers behind the ball and wait for us to turn it over then spread.  Clubs know we can't kick the footy and they know we push to lock the ball in so once they get it there is a lot of space to attack.

[Lucifers Hero 36,983]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Probably because you're just assuming there are fractures.

No doubt that last night was the worst we have played in a very, very long time, and there were some concerning aspects of our overall play, but you're just making assumptions here.  No idea why that may be censored by the mods, but everything you wrote above is nothing more than conjecture.

You trot that out whenever someone posts on internal issues at the club.  It may be news to you but all organisations and families have internal issues form time to time.  It is how and how quickly they are resolved that is important.

So, why is it so inconceivable that mfc might have issues among players or staff?  Or that mfc staff, their families or player families might be demon fans or talk to demon fans.  And that they read or, heaven forbid actually post on DL.  I could probably list 5-6 DL monikers that do.  But I certainly will not.

Posts like the above are belittling and uninformed.  Sometimes I wonder if you are an mfc 'plant' trying to dilute negative posts.  It is tiresome so unless you know for a fact that comments are conjecture then please refrain from discouraging posters.  I can add that the DL posters that have links to internal people, some quite senior, don't comment when internal issues are raised on here.  They just let it roll.

Take a leaf out of their book!

Edited July 30, 2020 by Lucifer's Hero

[John Demonic 4,781]

Too insipid a performance to even post on demonland afterwards. I'm guessing there were hundreds of us just lurking on here reading the posts with an empty feeling in their gut and a shattered feeling in their heart, the last 12 hours. Suckered into building up hope that we could back up our last 3 weeks.

Edited July 30, 2020 by John Demonic

[roy11 2,914]

At least with a Thursday game the Dees wont ruin our Saturday or Sunday.

If we have another fundraiser like that we'll need another fundraiser.

Simultaneously have PROUD TO BELONG and PAY TO BE GONE.

 

 

[The Swimming Dee 1,827]

2 hours ago, —coach— said:

Did a similar thing in 2018, was an awesome 6 weeks, went as far as exmouth, dived with the whale sharks with my 3 and 5yo at the time and if I wasn’t locked down here in Melbourne would do it again in a heartbeat! Enjoy ? 

PS don’t get bogged in the sand at lucky Bay like I did.

Cheers Coach. Ningaloo is an amazing part of the world

[Bring-Back-Powell 13,100]

59 minutes ago, poita said:

You can pretty much guarantee we'll drop at least one of the Adelaide and North games now - that performance will have destroyed any confidence in the group. Another season wasted, with no prospect of adding decent talent at year end.

Absolutely we'll drop one of Adelaide or North.

I'm confident we'll have our obligatory ''backs to the walls" wins in one of the games only to revert back to type the following week.

So predictable following this club.

[Dr. Gonzo 22,398]

1 hour ago, Choko said:

Gosh... If we are 5-5 in 2 weeks with a game in hand, this forum will look a lot different!

The next 2 weeks prove nothing. They need to win both games comfortably and that won't be enough to win back the trust of supporters.

That can only be gained by multiple YEARS of consistent performances. Until then it's same old Melbourne

[Scoop Junior 2,963]

It was obviously a horrible performance, up there with the worst we have played in the last four years.

As bad as the skill level was - and it was hardly VFL level let alone AFL level - it was not that surprising given we have seen it many times before. Perhaps not to that extent (in terms of quality and the duration of the game during which it was on show), but it didn't exactly come as a huge surprise to see us miss basic 20m kicks time and time again.

I actually thought we were on top (or at worst level) in terms of winning the ball at the source and getting it inside 50 in the first quarter, but our entries made some of the stuff we did forward of centre earlier in the season look like Hawthorn of 2013-2015. Repeated kicking to the boundary, or to packs, or to one-on-ones where our player would be significantly out-sized, or even straight to Power defenders. As we have seen many times before if you turn the ball over through the middle or across half forward you are out of position and Port just did as they pleased on the rebound.

While that part of the game was somewhat unsurprising, what was really un-Melbourne like (in terms of our previous 4 years) was the effort after quarter time. Say what you want about our skills and inside 50 connection, but we have consistently been a high-energy team that tackles, pressures, outnumbers at the contest, works hard and surges the ball forward. After quarter time we seemed to be totally flat, devoid of any energy whatsoever. I think at one point late in the last quarter we had only had about 10 inside 50s since quarter time.

Was it a 4-day break? Was it a lack of confidence? Was it going into our shells after so many kicking errors in the first quarter and Port punishing us on the rebound? I'm not sure, but we've had periods in games before where we've turned the ball over constantly but have at least responded. In all our losses this year I don't think anyone can say effort was an issue, but last night there was just this complete absence of energy and an apparent acceptance of the loss. At times you could say there were some soft individual acts which is not a trait we've seen from this team over the years.

I'm happy to put this in the mulligan column, however. Most teams have a couple of shockers a season, including the very best teams. This week we've heard about WCE being a premiership favourite and only 6 weeks ago they were absolutely crushed by Gold Coast. Richmond in 2017 were embarrassed by St Kilda mid year and won the premiership. Look at Collingwood last week - 15 goals to 1 since quarter time. In an even competition it happens - the key is whether it becomes a pattern of form or can be consigned to the mulligan column.

Now is not the time to panic and throw the baby out with the bathwater. We're 3-5, the season is not over. We've had a tough draw, playing and losing to WCE, Geelong, Richmond, Brisbane and Port, who all sit comfortably near the top of the ladder. Two of those losses were by a kick and we could've won both despite not being at our best. We have only played one bottom 5 team in Hawthorn. Contrast this with Essendon who have wins against the Crows, Dockers, Swans and Roos - and all by less than two goals.

If we continue to play like we did against Port then there will be some big concerns, obviously. But for mine there is no evidence to say that is our level, in fact the evidence of the season so far mostly suggests we can at least compete with the better teams.

[Rab D Nesbitt 7,041]

Geez. Last night was up there with some of the most disappointing games we've played over the years. To me it felt like one of those season defining losses that makes it hard to come back from and made me wonder if the next nine weeks will now take on the look of a slowly deflating balloon. Christ I hope not. 

[Dr. Gonzo 22,398]

12 minutes ago, Bring-Back-Powell said:

Absolutely we'll drop one of Adelaide or North.

I'm confident we'll have our obligatory ''backs to the walls" wins in one of the games only to revert back to type the following week.

So predictable following this club.

We will not beat North. They play with heart.

[Demonised 1,198]

The thing about being a longtime MFC supporter is that you can always look at a dismal performance like last night and say to yourself, 'Meh. I've seen worse.'

[Wiseblood 24,636]

20 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

You trot that out whenever someone posts on internal issues at the club.  It may be news to you but all organisations and families have internal issues form time to time.  It is how and how quickly they are resolved that is important.

So, why is it so inconceivable that mfc might have issues among players or staff?  Or that mfc staff, their families or player families might be demon fans or talk to demon fans.  And that they read or, heaven forbid actually post on DL.  I could probably list 5-6 DL monikers that do.  But I certainly will not.

Posts like the above are belittling and uninformed.  Sometimes I wonder if you are an mfc 'plant' trying to dilute negative posts.  It is tiresome so unless you know for a fact that comments are conjecture then please refrain from discouraging posters.  I can add that the DL posters that have links to internal people, some quite senior don't comment at all when internal issues are raised on here.

Take a leaf out of their book!

His post was conjecture.

So if you see two married people walking along the street, not holding hands, you instantly assume they have conflict or internal issue?

And by the way, it's not inconceivable.  I never said that.  You are absolutely superb at putting words in people's mouths, and you love to jump down my throat any chance you get.  I never said there wasn't conflict.  I just said that what he posted was based off watching a few things on the field, and then even speculating about what's going on in the rooms.  He isn't there.  So it's conjecture.  Unless he is there it can't be anything but.

So, mum, I'll respond how I see fit when people post that stuff.  You don't like then you can jog on for a change.  Cheers.

[Sir Why You Little 34,407]

1 minute ago, Wiseblood said:

His post was conjecture.

So if you see two married people walking along the street, not holding hands, you instantly assume they have conflict or internal issue?

And by the way, it's not inconceivable.  I never said that.  You are absolutely superb at putting words in people's mouths, and you love to jump down my throat any chance you get.  I never said there wasn't conflict.  I just said that what he posted was based off watching a few things on the field, and then even speculating about what's going on in the rooms.  He isn't there.  So it's conjecture.  Unless he is there it can't be anything but.

So, mum, I'll respond how I see fit when people post that stuff.  You don't like then you can jog on for a change.  Cheers.

You have no idea whether Leon has any internal connections within the club. It is not the first time he has mentioned anything like this. 

[DeePressed 114]

Fundamentals a disgrace. ?

Disposal - Flatfooted, also passing it to someone who is flat footed. 

Kicking - Across the body, poor technique, lazy. Correct me if i'm wrong but i'm sure it's called football? Fundamental #1. If i was this bad at my job i'd be sacked. What's a word worse than abysmal?

Tackling - Poor technique, attack the rib cage pin the arms. Too many broken. Go and watch Storm practice. 

Positioning - Mids forwards forever out of position. Then call for the ball in a worse position.

Movement - As above flat footed. Is there no property steward to check if there's concrete stuck to the bottom of there boots? Opposition circling packs like sharks and we stand there often with back to goal and wonder why we get caught over and over.

Football smarts - Is there any? Was there any? Has it been trained/learning'd out of them.

Awareness - Zero, on most fronts.

Selection - 3 talls? Playing out of form players. They still have no idea what our best 22 looks like. Which means they don't really have a proper system to play?

Leadership - I question this on field. Gawn/Viney yes they bust their guts but are they leaders? Can they see patterns/trends mid game and fix/foresee problems, coach on field.

Coaching - Far far too easy to coach against.  "Operation kick it to Max" has been found out... This is a whole other topic..

Wet footy - Train all this week with the sprinklers on. Some lads need to swap the Nivea for resin.

Hunger - That was a must win game. It speaks volumes.

??????

[Spargonicus 419]

Well, lots said here of course.

My particular take is that they just don't often stand up to intense pressure. When things are going well - 'downhill skiing' - the can look great; free-flowing football, their own intense tackling and pressure, confidence play.

But Port are the top team and put on immense pressure - perceived and real, and here's the thing: our players clearly haven't embedded their skills enough, because it all comes apart and they revert to old, instinctive ways (hand-balling to someone under pressure, bombing out of the centre/into 50, over-committing too many players to the contest, no-one well-positioned at ground level etc.)

Some of this is certainly lack of skill and natural awareness/footy brain, but I'm confident most of the players have enough skill to embed these habits deeper.

Of course, the rest is a mental fortitude problem. Again, they sometimes show grit, but without the above skills, momentum is quickly taken away and doubt sets in, then effort lags. Although, the lack of effort I saw last night at times was hard to believe.

In summary: back to fundamentals. Drill, drill, drill. Built trust in each other. Do the endless 1 percenters. Never take anything for granted.

My fear is that even if they get a run on over the next few games, they'll go back to a "we're awesome" mindset again and then hit another brick wall and cop a beating.

[jnrmac 18,914]

10 hours ago, DemonOX said:

You watch we will give the crows their first win next week. 
 

Only Melb would lose to a side who has lost all games this season and are on the bottom of the ladder. 

I am still haunted by losing to Sydney at the MCG after Sydney had lost 26 games in a row.

 

[Watts the matter 1,235]

21 minutes ago, Scoop Junior said:

It was obviously a horrible performance, up there with the worst we have played in the last four years.

As bad as the skill level was - and it was hardly VFL level let alone AFL level - it was not that surprising given we have seen it many times before. Perhaps not to that extent (in terms of quality and the duration of the game during which it was on show), but it didn't exactly come as a huge surprise to see us miss basic 20m kicks time and time again.

I actually thought we were on top (or at worst level) in terms of winning the ball at the source and getting it inside 50 in the first quarter, but our entries made some of the stuff we did forward of centre earlier in the season look like Hawthorn of 2013-2015. Repeated kicking to the boundary, or to packs, or to one-on-ones where our player would be significantly out-sized, or even straight to Power defenders. As we have seen many times before if you turn the ball over through the middle or across half forward you are out of position and Port just did as they pleased on the rebound.

While that part of the game was somewhat unsurprising, what was really un-Melbourne like (in terms of our previous 4 years) was the effort after quarter time. Say what you want about our skills and inside 50 connection, but we have consistently been a high-energy team that tackles, pressures, outnumbers at the contest, works hard and surges the ball forward. After quarter time we seemed to be totally flat, devoid of any energy whatsoever. I think at one point late in the last quarter we had only had about 10 inside 50s since quarter time.

Was it a 4-day break? Was it a lack of confidence? Was it going into our shells after so many kicking errors in the first quarter and Port punishing us on the rebound? I'm not sure, but we've had periods in games before where we've turned the ball over constantly but have at least responded. In all our losses this year I don't think anyone can say effort was an issue, but last night there was just this complete absence of energy and an apparent acceptance of the loss. At times you could say there were some soft individual acts which is not a trait we've seen from this team over the years.

I'm happy to put this in the mulligan column, however. Most teams have a couple of shockers a season, including the very best teams. This week we've heard about WCE being a premiership favourite and only 6 weeks ago they were absolutely crushed by Gold Coast. Richmond in 2017 were embarrassed by St Kilda mid year and won the premiership. Look at Collingwood last week - 15 goals to 1 since quarter time. In an even competition it happens - the key is whether it becomes a pattern of form or can be consigned to the mulligan column.

Now is not the time to panic and throw the baby out with the bathwater. We're 3-5, the season is not over. We've had a tough draw, playing and losing to WCE, Geelong, Richmond, Brisbane and Port, who all sit comfortably near the top of the ladder. Two of those losses were by a kick and we could've won both despite not being at our best. We have only played one bottom 5 team in Hawthorn. Contrast this with Essendon who have wins against the Crows, Dockers, Swans and Roos - and all by less than two goals.

If we continue to play like we did against Port then there will be some big concerns, obviously. But for mine there is no evidence to say that is our level, in fact the evidence of the season so far mostly suggests we can at least compete with the better teams.

Unfortunately our poor start to the season didn't give us space to have this game.

[Leoncelli_36 2,264]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Probably because you're just assuming there are fractures.

No doubt that last night was the worst we have played in a very, very long time, and there were some concerning aspects of our overall play, but you're just making assumptions here.  No idea why that may be censored by the mods, but everything you wrote above is nothing more than conjecture.

I have inside mail and have proven it time and time again. I need to justify nothing here. Demonland were worried about defamation when I told this forum what was up with Hogan, I pointed out it’s not defamation if true. 
 

 

[Clintosaurus 6,409]

If Andrew McLeod and Tyson Edwards can play in 2 flags together, and there is no Lachie Hunter/Bailey Smith type stuff going on, then I can 't see why some players not liking every player should be an impediment to playing winning football regularly.

Edited July 31, 2020 by Clintosaurus
Edwards

[Sir Why You Little 34,407]

Just now, Clintosaurus said:

If Andrew McLeod and Tyson can play in 2 flags together, and there is no Lachie Hunter/Bailey Smith type stuff going on, then I can 't see why some players not liking every player should be an impediment to playing winning football regularly.

Except at The MFC it seems Clint

i have heard similar rumblings about our 2 past Captains, but i cannot verify it. 
 

Would certainly split the room down the middle though. Exactly why 2 Captaincies should never even be considered, let alone implemented!

[jnrmac 18,914]

9 hours ago, Watts the matter said:

 

On the Melbourne website. May had a weird game, did some good stuff and some shocking stuff, just saw the replay of Rozee goal where he makes a goal spoil on Dixon then let's the ball between his legs and then completely ignores the ball and focusses on Dixon allowed Rozee easy access.

Thats the difference between a team playing on instinct and a team playing with confused instructions in their head. And players worried about their own opponent - like kick chasers they want to look at the stats sheet and say 'I beat my man tonight' or 'I got 23 touches'.

Goodwin can't coach. PLayers don't know what to do. Thye aren't playing for each other. They aren't running their guts out. There is no leadership.

They are headless chooks with a coach that has no idea about how to fix the problem.

Why does it take the string blowtorch for the AFL community before these hacks put effort in?

Why does Melbourne always have these absolute blow out games where they get smashed? Coaching and leadership

[Binmans PA 25,892]

39 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

His post was conjecture.

So if you see two married people walking along the street, not holding hands, you instantly assume they have conflict or internal issue?

And by the way, it's not inconceivable.  I never said that.  You are absolutely superb at putting words in people's mouths, and you love to jump down my throat any chance you get.  I never said there wasn't conflict.  I just said that what he posted was based off watching a few things on the field, and then even speculating about what's going on in the rooms.  He isn't there.  So it's conjecture.  Unless he is there it can't be anything but.

So, mum, I'll respond how I see fit when people post that stuff.  You don't like then you can jog on for a change.  Cheers.

Wow, poor effort this post. So patronising and gendered. Would you dismiss Saty by calling him dad?  

[drdrake 3,035]

11 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

Thats the difference between a team playing on instinct and a team playing with confused instructions in their head. And players worried about their own opponent - like kick chasers they want to look at the stats sheet and say 'I beat my man tonight' or 'I got 23 touches'.

Goodwin can't coach. PLayers don't know what to do. Thye aren't playing for each other. They aren't running their guts out. There is no leadership.

They are headless chooks with a coach that has no idea about how to fix the problem.

Why does it take the string blowtorch for the AFL community before these hacks put effort in?

Why does Melbourne always have these absolute blow out games where they get smashed? Coaching and leadership

I have been saying this for a number of years it starts at the players we draft and trade, with either have picked up players that can get the footy but can't kick or skilful players that can't get the ball.  Then it flows into development, we just don't seem to see players progressively improve, Petracca and Max is the exception build has been great but is that more the build from the injury.  The rest seem to come in and stay at the same level a few peaks but these are short bursts of games and can't continue to build season on season.

Then game plan, we are predictable nothing changes, we have to many 1-2m handballs that just add pressure instead of releasing the running player.  Teams know we will self destruct our skills will let us down with a little bit of pressure.  They allow us to outnumber at the contest and sit back waiting for the errant kick which will come.

[Wiseblood 24,636]

4 minutes ago, A F said:

Wow, poor effort this post. So patronising and gendered. Would you dismiss Saty by calling him dad?  

If I didn't have him on ignore.

[Hellaintabadplacetobe 4,089]

For the second time this year we have witnessed the opposition bench openly laughing while having a rest. I have never seen this before and this time they were all kids!

At the same time our bench resembled a wake with Brayshaw's body language in particular a real concern.

If anyone thinks there are not some issues ongoing within the playing group /coaching group, it's time to take the rose coloured glasses off.