Farewell Sam Frost

[Diamond_Jim 11,670]

3 minutes ago, Yung Blood said:

I'm a novice at this stuff but what do we get for someone who is out of contract?

simple.... if he stays out of contract and is not traded he goes into the PSD where any club (in order of bottom to top) can elect to take him at his stated price. If that happens we get nothing but Frost is not guaranteed to get to his desired club.

The alternative is that whoever wants him trades for him

[Young Blood 1,970]

thanks @Diamond_Jim and @whatwhatsaywhat

 

[Ethan Tremblay 28,277]

35 minutes ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

everyone carrying on like we are losing the second coming of peter knights needs to calm down a bit

frost is a classic 'good, ordinary' kpp

he's never shown any consistency in his play from quarter to quarter let alone season to season

there is PLENTY of time for it all to play out in the wash before trade period is over

i'm not fussed if we keep him or he goes; we'll get something for him, particularly if other clubs are keen on his services

i still think we massively overpaid for him as a second round pick

Agreed. He’s becoming more of a cult figure due to his frostballness which I think is clouding people’s judgment. 

Edited September 11, 2019 by Ethan Tremblay

[Stretch Johnson 2,568]

It would be disappointing to lose an athletically gifted kpd on an upward trajectory.   Depends on what comes back I suppose. 

[TGR 1,367]

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

So you're off Plough now?

I reckon Plough would have done more than Bails and Neeldy, and even Goody.

The only MFC coach that came close to doing what Plough did at the dogs in the last 50 years is Northey; yet Northey wasn't successful at Richmond either.

Plough wasn't successful at Richmond, but at least there was some foundation there for future success....Like Barass from 81-85 if you get my drift.

 

 

I back my coaching selections (Roos, Plough, Lyon, Ratten) over 17 years on these forums over those that the club employed (Lyon) and the many simpletons like yourself who wouldn't have a flaming clue.

 

 

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by TGR

[whatwhat say what 18,743]

Daniher >>> Suntan

 

[Mental Demons 136]

The fact that Hawthorn want him is enough reason to keep Frost. Last year, we had the worst draft-trade period in living memory. We generally don't get our draft picks right and our mature recruiting is pitiful. Hawthorn may be the best at these things going around.

 

[Fork 'em 6,505]

Yeah, I think about that too.
They see a big bloke who runs like a gazelle that gives 100% they can work on.

 

[red&blue1982 252]

I had a bad feeling the other day that a club like Hawthorn would definitely want him and support him to the next level. It's like a recurring nightmare. Us giving up talent for some low (who cares) draft pick and Hawthorn scouting talent from everywhere. The thought is making me sick.

[Redleg 37,441]

If we have made a real low ball offer, as one journo said, it is a signal to Sam he is not valued.

[Mr Steve 3,820]

Could never understand why frost was not given a go on the Wing. 

[Dee Watcher 71]

A good idea for a team with no pace (particulary around the footy and in the back half) is to not re-sign the quickest bloke in our back 6

Lets not get this wrong next years when May & Lever still can;t get on the park and we are seeing way to much Omac & Wag's getting constantly run away from lets remember we let him walk! 

[Wiseblood 24,636]

4 minutes ago, Dee Watcher said:

A good idea for a team with no pace (particulary around the footy and in the back half) is to not re-sign the quickest bloke in our back 6.

I think Frosty was great this year, but this idea that we need to sign him purely based on his pace is kind of strange.

Yes, he has some pace on him, but as stated earlier his disposal is barely average and his turnover numbers are horrible.  What is the point of someone having some pace if they then turn the ball over downfield, only for it to go back over their head for a score?

Pace is only useful if you can also hit a few targets, which is something Frosty doesn't do nearly enough of.

[Red and Blue realist 2,026]

4 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I think Frosty was great this year, but this idea that we need to sign him purely based on his pace is kind of strange.

Yes, he has some pace on him, but as stated earlier his disposal is barely average and his turnover numbers are horrible.  What is the point of someone having some pace if they then turn the ball over downfield, only for it to go back over their head for a score?

Pace is only useful if you can also hit a few targets, which is something Frosty doesn't do nearly enough of.

I also think Frost has great speed when he's up and going, but he's that quick off the mark (might be related to his footy brain though). He regularly had players mark in front of him on the lead where a player with speed off the mark would have got closer. I imagine some want to push him to the wing to use that pace, but he's not that smart a player so would get lost too often.

[Bay Riffin 1,413]

8 minutes ago, Wiseblood said:

I think Frosty was great this year, but this idea that we need to sign him purely based on his pace is kind of strange.

Yes, he has some pace on him, but as stated earlier his disposal is barely average and his turnover numbers are horrible.  What is the point of someone having some pace if they then turn the ball over downfield, only for it to go back over their head for a score?

Pace is only useful if you can also hit a few targets, which is something Frosty doesn't do nearly enough of.

he gives us a point of difference. I think he could become a good back packet in a lock down role on the most athletic dangerous forward. if he learns to kick, which is still terrible.

 

Maybe 'frost ball' is a function of bad coaching and Clarko can teach that out of him. a lot of it is just calming down a bit.

[Moonshadow 16,099]

33 minutes ago, red&blue1982 said:

I had a bad feeling the other day that a club like Hawthorn would definitely want him and support him to the next level. It's like a recurring nightmare. Us giving up talent for some low (who cares) draft pick and Hawthorn scouting talent from everywhere. The thought is making me sick.

Who are the talented players we gave up to the Hawks for some low draft pick? We got 3 for Frawley as a FA. Fitzy? Cheney? Yeah nah.

[DeeSpencer 23,051]

Hawthorn would do with Frost exactly what they did with James Frawley. They'd try to have him play zone defending, probably end up moving him forward when he can't get the hang of it or keeps turning over the ball then eventually have him just sit on a man and bring the ball to ground. If he picks it up he handballs or kicks it simple and often sideways. In fact he'd probably just end up replacing Frawley at some stage in the next 24 months.

I'm in the camp of keeping Frost because we don't have depth of back pockets or lock down key defenders but the idea that the Hawks are going to turn him in to star or capitalise on his pace to make him an attacking player don't seem right.

 

[DubDee 20,320]

Why isn't Frost a RFA?   

he has played 8 seasons

[Wiseblood 24,636]

10 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Why isn't Frost a RFA?   

he has played 8 seasons

I may be wrong, but it could be because he hasn't played all of those 8 seasons at the same club.

[AshleyH30 566]

11 minutes ago, DubDee said:

Why isn't Frost a RFA?   

he has played 8 seasons

Not 8 seasons at Melbourne, 8 Seasons in total. You have to play 8 seasons for 1 club to be a FA or be 28 years old.

[DubDee 20,320]

1 minute ago, Wiseblood said:

I may be wrong, but it could be because he hasn't played all of those 8 seasons at the same club.

you could be right but that would be bizarre.  why are a players rights lessened because they may have been traded to another team?

this will be Frosty's last good contract so it's fair enough he is trying for the best and longest deal possible

[AshleyH30 566]

6 minutes ago, DubDee said:

you could be right but that would be bizarre.  why are a players rights lessened because they may have been traded to another team?

this will be Frosty's last good contract so it's fair enough he is trying for the best and longest deal possible

It's why the players are pushing for it to be reduced to 6 years. Concurrently, Clubs are arguing to be able to trade their players while in contract to whoever they want if the players want to reduce the free agency age to 24.

Basically, it would mean that the clubs have power while in contract, but once out of contract, the players have control of where they go.

Edited September 11, 2019 by AshleyH30

[Wiseblood 24,636]

Just now, AshleyH30 said:

It's why the players are pushing for it to be reduced to 6 years. Concurrently, Clubs are arguing to be able to trade their players while in contract to whoever they want if the players want to reduce the free agency age to 24.

I'd love to see clubs have more of a say in where players end up.  If they want to go back to their home state then they go to the club that can do the best deal.

[AshleyH30 566]

1 minute ago, Wiseblood said:

I'd love to see clubs have more of a say in where players end up.  If they want to go back to their home state then they go to the club that can do the best deal.

Unfortunately, the AFLPA hold too much power over the AFL. The only way I ever see it happening is if all player wages were doubled. But right now the AFLPA want their cake and to eat it too.

[Young Blood 1,970]

1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

I think Frosty was great this year, but this idea that we need to sign him purely based on his pace is kind of strange.

Yes, he has some pace on him, but as stated earlier his disposal is barely average and his turnover numbers are horrible.  What is the point of someone having some pace if they then turn the ball over downfield, only for it to go back over their head for a score?

Pace is only useful if you can also hit a few targets, which is something Frosty doesn't do nearly enough of.

This is so key. As a backman its so important to hit targets. Turning the ball over from the back half just hurts you so much in todays game. He has improved his kicking somewhat but it does little for you if your decision making and timing is still poor. I'm not saying this can't improve but I think its going to be difficult for him to find the balance of when to use his pace and when to slow up and hit up the right option accurately. His rebound 50 numbers were good but clangers were high.

Frost regularly kicks or handballs directly back to the opposition. I just had a look at leaders in Clangers this season and he's sixth among defenders with 64 for the year. The previous year he was averaging about the same with 34 across 13 games for the season. It's definitely a concern with him. If he does stay its an area of his game that he will need to continue to tidy up. 

Don't get me wrong I think he's still important especially as he can play on smalls and talls it will definitely effect our backline depth if he departs.