Small forwards - what are our trading and draft options?

[Macca 16,173]

We need working key forwards ... 3 of them.  One of them should be T-Mac whilst Weideman has it all ahead of him.  And we need back-up forwards.  Petracca can often act as the 3rd forward depending on match-ups but sometimes a 3rd marking type is required. 

The obsession with the over abundance of NQR midfielder types needs a shift in thinking.  Especially at our club.

Small forwards work off the shirt-tails of good key forwards so we need to put the horse before the cart. 

Ironically using high-end  or middle-area draft picks on forwards of any description is fraught with danger.  There's the good news but lots of bad news.  And the bad news shows up how flawed drafting is in general.  But the bad news can often show us the right way of going about it.

For instance ... a much easier and safer option is to trade for goal kicking talent.  Barring injury,  you at least know what you're getting when going down that path. 

And our needs are immediate.

[rjay 23,888]

Just now, Macca said:

We need working key forwards ... 3 of them.  One of them should be T-Mac whilst Weideman has it all ahead of him.  And we need back-up forwards.  Petracca can often act as the 3rd forward depending on match-ups but sometimes a 3rd marking type is required. 

The obsession with the over abundance of NQR midfielder types needs a shift in thinking.  Especially at our club.

Small forwards work off the shirt-tails of good key forwards so we need to put the horse before the cart. 

Ironically using high-end  or middle-area draft picks on forwards of any description is fraught with danger.  There's the good news but lots of bad news.  And the bad news shows up how flawed drafting is in general.  But the bad news can often show us the right way of going about it.

For instance ... a much easier and safer option is to trade for goal kicking talent.  Barring injury,  you at least know what you're getting when going down that path. 

And our needs are immediate.

I would lock in Fritsch now as our 3rd tall...Trac rotating more in the mids but also spending quality time forward.

The 1st 2 and at least one good small are a problem.

Tmac is a number 2 man...as for the number one man there really is no one available for trade unless Cameron falls out so that leaves Weid and he really must step up next season.

Need to trade in a small, Tiges have the most so at least one should be gettable....

[Macca 16,173]

20 minutes ago, rjay said:

I would lock in Fritsch now as our 3rd tall...Trac rotating more in the mids but also spending quality time forward.

The 1st 2 and at least one good small are a problem.

Tmac is a number 2 man...as for the number one man there really is no one available for trade unless Cameron falls out so that leaves Weid and he really must step up next season.

Need to trade in a small, Tiges have the most so at least one should be gettable....

Fritsch can be a good 3rd forward marking type ... good point.  But we desperately need a No.1.  We needed to replace Hogan with a like for like.  A year later and the need is even more obvious.

If we go with the same type of tall forward set-up we won't improve.  The other teams know that as well that's why they upped the ante on pressing and pressuring our midfielders. 

Knowing that our forwards can't win their own ball allowed the other teams to pick apart our game plan with ease.  Therefore,  our inside 50 conversion rate became abysmal.  And that was all evident early in the season.

We need to make a big play on at least 1 tall forward from elsewhere.  But 1 acquisition may not be enough.  Some creative trading can get it done rjay.  I reckon we need 2 as I'm doubtful on Weideman and T-Mac works best as a float forward/utility forward option. 

Let's face it,  both players failed massively this past season so to go again with the same system doesn't make any sense.  And then there is the injury factor so back-up is required.

As previously stated,  small forwards work best on the back of good key forwards. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by Macca

[Redleg 37,556]

30 minutes ago, Macca said:

Fritsch can be a good 3rd forward marking type ... good point.  But we desperately need a No.1.  We needed to replace Hogan with a like for like.  A year later and the need is even more obvious.

If we go with the same type of tall forward set-up we won't improve.  The other teams know that as well that's why they upped the ante on pressing and pressuring our midfielders. 

Knowing that our forwards can't win their own ball allowed the other teams to pick apart our game plan with ease.  Therefore,  our inside 50 conversion rate became abysmal.  And that was all evident early in the season.

We need to make a big play on at least 1 tall forward from elsewhere.  But 1 acquisition may not be enough.  Some creative trading can get it done rjay.  I reckon we need 2 as I'm doubtful on Weideman and T-Mac works best as a float forward/utility forward option. 

Let's face it,  both players failed massively this past season so to go again with the same system doesn't make any sense.  And then there is the injury factor so back-up is required.

As previously stated,  small forwards work best on the back of good key forwards. 

Don't forget Melksham, who is another marking goal kicker, though not a key forward, but similar to Fritter.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Redleg

[Macca 16,173]

2 minutes ago, Redleg said:

Don't forget Melksham, who is another marking goal kicker, though not a key forward, but similar to Fritter.

My main point is that in an ideal world we'd have 2 key forwards of the calibre of Lynch & Reiwoldt (for instance)

All the rest of it takes care of itself if our recruiting is always on the ball.  The add-ons such as Melksham & Fritsch compliment.  Small forwards for the same type of reasoning. 

Richmond missed out on playing in a GF on the back of 1 key forward having a day out.  That's how valuable they are.  Mason Cox couldn't repeat it but he got rid of the Tigers. 

And when you've got good key forwards who can repeat then you're on your way.  Just as long as the numerous other positions are filled with talent as well.

[DistrACTION Jackson 6,418]

11 minutes ago, Macca said:

My main point is that in an ideal world we'd have 2 key forwards of the calibre of Lynch & Reiwoldt (for instance)

All the rest of it takes care of itself if our recruiting is always on the ball.  The add-ons such as Melksham & Fritsch compliment.  Small forwards for the same type of reasoning. 

Richmond missed out on playing in a GF on the back of 1 key forward having a day out.  That's how valuable they are.  Mason Cox couldn't repeat it but he got rid of the Tigers. 

And when you've got good key forwards who can repeat then you're on your way.  Just as long as the numerous other positions are filled with talent as well.

The problem is they are hard to get and there's not many available.

[Macca 16,173]

4 minutes ago, Collar-Jazz-Knee said:

The problem is they are hard to get and there's not many available.

Gotta aim for the stars CJK.

Otherwise you never win.  As an example I was all for the Tilbrook,  Big Carl,  Templeton & Moore acquisitions.  May & Lever the same.

But we needed to keep going with that type of thinking.  Bring in 20 top players over 7 or 8 years like North Melbourne did and you become a power club that wins flags.  Year after year after year.

Meanwhile we languish down at the bottom of the ladder all too often. 

Think and act big.

[Binmans PA 25,996]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

Fritsch can be a good 3rd forward marking type ... good point.  But we desperately need a No.1.  We needed to replace Hogan with a like for like.  A year later and the need is even more obvious.

If we go with the same type of tall forward set-up we won't improve.  The other teams know that as well that's why they upped the ante on pressing and pressuring our midfielders. 

Knowing that our forwards can't win their own ball allowed the other teams to pick apart our game plan with ease.  Therefore,  our inside 50 conversion rate became abysmal.  And that was all evident early in the season.

We need to make a big play on at least 1 tall forward from elsewhere.  But 1 acquisition may not be enough.  Some creative trading can get it done rjay.  I reckon we need 2 as I'm doubtful on Weideman and T-Mac works best as a float forward/utility forward option. 

Let's face it,  both players failed massively this past season so to go again with the same system doesn't make any sense.  And then there is the injury factor so back-up is required.

As previously stated,  small forwards work best on the back of good key forwards. 

Not quite the best option given his age at this stage, but I'd be up for trading our #3 for Ben King. Play King as the #1 with McDonald, Fritsch, Petracca, Melksham, a zippy small and Viney. That's your forwardline. Weideman and McDonald contest for that #2 spot.

[Demonsone 1,596]

Not sure why the mfc hardly ever comes  up when a key player is coming up for trade/free agents. Example Coniglio, Hill, Patton etc. etc 

[Macca 16,173]

2 minutes ago, A F said:

Not quite the best option given his age at this stage, but I'd be up for trading our #3 for Ben King. Play King as the #1 with McDonald, Fritsch, Petracca, Melksham, a zippy small and Viney. That's your forwardline. Weideman and McDonald contest for that #2 spot.

I don't ever look at the general importance of 1 spot on the list.  Considering there are often 20+ expendable types in any given year with any given club with any given list, what's 1 spot? 

I'd play Jones and/or Viney as small forwards to fill a need.  At least we know they'd both fight hard for the ball and would get to the right spots.  Jones will almost certainly be in his last year anyway whilst Viney might surprise.  The other current options aren't good enough.

So we could go for 3 or 4 tall forward types.  1 might turn out right whilst another might fill a need.  It's trial and error or ... make a play for a big gun forward.  Or perhaps 2 gun forwards over a 2 or 3 year period.

Instead of all that we still.place too much importance on untried high school age draftees.  Often to zero effect.

We did it with May & Lever so why not shore up our forward line?  Supporters get too pre-occupied with small forwards.  I'm hoping the club is thinking a lot bigger than that. 

[Macca 16,173]

Yet many questioned as to why Pail McNamee was prepared to make a play for Jono Brown back 11 years ago.

Brown was exactly the type of key forward that we needed (to replace Neitz) and I was all for it.  Was only going to be for 4 or 5 years but Steven May falls into the same bracket in terns of probable years of service.

In the ensuing years the closest we came was with Hogan but his value was underplayed and understated.  Measuring the value of a good key forward changed once the game became congested (along with crowded forward lines)

Some players are just no good in confined spaces & circumstances.  And when the bright lights shine others just aren't up to it.  Others relish the contest and relish the front position (as key forwards)

And that is what we desperately need in our forward line.  Crumbing forwards are the add-ons.  3rd & 4th forwards largely the same. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by Macca

[FlashInThePan 1,893]

Having awesome tall forward(s) is one way to go, but it isn't the only way to go. Bulldogs had little more than a resting ruckman in their premiership year, Richmond had Riewoldt as their only tall forward. For large parts of that year they did it with no recognised tall forward at all. 

I don't think our problem has been not having a power forward, it has been the way we have structured up, pressing very high and crowding out our forward line. Not only has this made it next to impossible to lead into space or create a 1 on 1, it has meant that teams get over the back of us regularly and undo all the pressure we created in our forward half. All that crowding in our forward line makes it very hard to score even from stoppages. Almost every game I watched this year our forward line looked super crowded and then when the ball went back the other way there was all the space in the world for the opposition to lead into. We can fix this by backing off on the press and backing ourselves to intercept and slingshot the ball back quickly.

I agree with Macca, I think we should move Jones to a forward pocket. He can pressure well and is a good kick for goal, it will be easier on his body and will help the team. Along with Fritsch, Melksham and possibly Joel Smith all good at ground level as well as being able to mark I think we will be fine. TMac will be there and one of Weideman, Preuss or Tim Smith (maybe even Tomlinson if we trade well) we have a forward line that could really work. We just need to deliver it in there better and stop choking up our own forward half of the ground with all 18 players (plus most of the opposition).

[DeeSpencer 23,113]

2 hours ago, Macca said:

Fritsch can be a good 3rd forward marking type ... good point.  But we desperately need a No.1.  We needed to replace Hogan with a like for like.  A year later and the need is even more obvious.

If we go with the same type of tall forward set-up we won't improve.  The other teams know that as well that's why they upped the ante on pressing and pressuring our midfielders. 

Knowing that our forwards can't win their own ball allowed the other teams to pick apart our game plan with ease.  Therefore,  our inside 50 conversion rate became abysmal.  And that was all evident early in the season.

We need to make a big play on at least 1 tall forward from elsewhere.  But 1 acquisition may not be enough.  Some creative trading can get it done rjay.  I reckon we need 2 as I'm doubtful on Weideman and T-Mac works best as a float forward/utility forward option. 

Let's face it,  both players failed massively this past season so to go again with the same system doesn't make any sense.  And then there is the injury factor so back-up is required.

As previously stated,  small forwards work best on the back of good key forwards. 

Disagree. Key forwards rarely win finals. It's great when they do but it doesn't happen all that often these days. Nick Riewoldt was a champion for years on end, but finished with 41 goals in 17 finals. He rarely dominated a final and certainly not a grand final.

69 goals in 24 finals looks great for Buddy but he kicked 7 in his first final and 8 against a hapless Dogs backline the year after, take those 2 out and he's 54 in 22. In the big finals he's mostly been well held especially since the rise in zone defending in the 10's.

Tom McDonald was absolutely the main key forward last year, with or without Hogan. 53 goals in 20 games and plenty of marks. He's not in the top 6 key forwards but he's not far off if he gets back to 2018 form. He'd be the best key forward for Collingwood, Brisbane, the Dogs, Essendon so at least 4 of the finalists. Surely there's still belief he can get back to 2018 form?

Jury is out on Weideman and if there's a chance to upgrade from him that's a good idea but we've got a heap of gaps to fill. A desperation ploy at a replacement now (and who?) doesn't make sense. Bringing in competition for his spot and depth is absolutely important but not with a wild swing.

De Goey is the Pies full forward and Stephenson is their plan B. Charlie Cameron is the Lions full forward. Dusty still does stints at full forward for the Tigers. We need a 40+ goal kicker no matter the size.

And we need small forwards because the cupboard is incredibly bare right now. It's a vital position because they are the front line of defensive pressure that creates turnovers and turnovers lead to scores. I wouldn't make an aggressive trade move for a small unless they are a Charlie Cameron 40+ goal type but I'd absolutely look to trade for someone like Dan Butler and to keep drafting more options. I look at the Eagles adding Liam Ryan and Willie Rioli and suddenly going from fringe finals side to premiers as well as the Tigers turn around in 2017 with their smalls creating so much pressure. Slow, poor overhead, creative/unskilled midfielders up forward doesn't get the job done.

[Moonshadow 16,161]

On 8/30/2019 at 8:06 PM, Demon Disciple said:

We could always just get a player to legally change his name

Whiskers Rioli???

[Macca 16,173]

On 9/1/2019 at 3:36 PM, DeeSpencer said:

Disagree. Key forwards rarely win finals. It's great when they do but it doesn't happen all that often these days. Nick Riewoldt was a champion for years on end, but finished with 41 goals in 17 finals. He rarely dominated a final and certainly not a grand final.

69 goals in 24 finals looks great for Buddy but he kicked 7 in his first final and 8 against a hapless Dogs backline the year after, take those 2 out and he's 54 in 22. In the big finals he's mostly been well held especially since the rise in zone defending in the 10's.

Tom McDonald was absolutely the main key forward last year, with or without Hogan. 53 goals in 20 games and plenty of marks. He's not in the top 6 key forwards but he's not far off if he gets back to 2018 form. He'd be the best key forward for Collingwood, Brisbane, the Dogs, Essendon so at least 4 of the finalists. Surely there's still belief he can get back to 2018 form?

Jury is out on Weideman and if there's a chance to upgrade from him that's a good idea but we've got a heap of gaps to fill. A desperation ploy at a replacement now (and who?) doesn't make sense. Bringing in competition for his spot and depth is absolutely important but not with a wild swing.

De Goey is the Pies full forward and Stephenson is their plan B. Charlie Cameron is the Lions full forward. Dusty still does stints at full forward for the Tigers. We need a 40+ goal kicker no matter the size.

And we need small forwards because the cupboard is incredibly bare right now. It's a vital position because they are the front line of defensive pressure that creates turnovers and turnovers lead to scores. I wouldn't make an aggressive trade move for a small unless they are a Charlie Cameron 40+ goal type but I'd absolutely look to trade for someone like Dan Butler and to keep drafting more options. I look at the Eagles adding Liam Ryan and Willie Rioli and suddenly going from fringe finals side to premiers as well as the Tigers turn around in 2017 with their smalls creating so much pressure. Slow, poor overhead, creative/unskilled midfielders up forward doesn't get the job done.

It's all about the X's & O's in certain games not about the actual output.  Although from an overall perspective it is about output.

But if you're measuring things by goals kicked  by key forwards in certain games it's a short-sighted view in today's footy (crowded forward lines etc)

To me a forward line starts and finishes with key forwards who have a presence,  can take a mark and can kick straight.  But they can't do it all the time these days.  But the 'threat' has to be there.  Stuff that is hard to measure. 

It's like not having a proper ruckman ... someone like T-Mac,  Weideman,  Tim Smith or Watts will eventually be outpointed to a point where the opposition can only lose if their coaching is incompetent.  A journeyman ruckman like Nankervous will suffice though because he's a proper ruckman.

So if you've got 2 dud key forwards the same sort of outcome can occur.  As we saw this season. 

Not playing key forwards isn't going to work either as the opposition will find another way to gain a strong advantage in that situation (unless you've got 3 or 4 champion other forwards like Chapman,  Johnson et al)

Our lot apart from our key forwards are below average as well.  Petracca is our best but he has goal kicking issues.   So describing our forward line as dysfuntional isn't overstating things.  Our issues are quite identifiable if the truth be known.  But fixing things is easier said than done because of the restrictions with recruiting.

I can remember when the club (and the supporters) thought our troubles were over when we recruited John Tilbrook.  We placed him on a half forward flank in a dysfuntional forward line devoid of talent.  And then the players wouldn't kick it to him.  Starvation corner had a whole new meaning

And then the supporters blamed Tilbrook!  That's how it works but I see things way differently. 

You put a gun small forward into our dysfuntional forward line right now and he'd be wasted somewhat.  Surround him with a couple of top-notch gun key forwards and it's a different story.  So one comes before the other.  Working from the opposite way is high risk.

We'd be easy to coach against and the outcomes indicate that as well.

You put Lynch & Reiwoldt into our forward line this season and we'd be playing finals again.

[old dee 22,848]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

It's all about the X's & O's in certain games not about the actual output.  Although from an overall perspective it is about output.

But if you're measuring things by goals kicked  by key forwards in certain games it's a short-sighted view in today's footy (crowded forward lines etc)

To me a forward line starts and finishes with key forwards who have a presence,  can take a mark and can kick straight.  But they can't do it all the time these days.  But the 'threat' has to be there.  Stuff that is hard to measure. 

It's like not having a proper ruckman ... someone like T-Mac,  Weideman,  Tim Smith or Watts will eventually be outpointed to a point where the opposition can only lose if their coaching is incompetent.  A journeyman ruckman like Nankervous will suffice though because he's a proper ruckman.

So if you've got 2 dud key forwards the same sort of outcome can occur.  As we saw this season. 

Not playing key forwards isn't going to work either as the opposition will find another way to gain a strong advantage in that situation (unless you've got 3 or 4 champion other forwards like Chapman,  Johnson et al)

Our lot apart from our key forwards are below average as well.  Petracca is our best but he has goal kicking issues.   So describing our forward line as dysfuntional isn't overstating things.  Our issues are quite identifiable if the truth be known.  But fixing things is easier said than done because of the restrictions with recruiting.

I can remember when the club (and the supporters) thought our troubles were over when we recruited John Tilbrook.  We placed him on a half forward flank in a dysfuntional forward line devoid of talent.  And then the players wouldn't kick it to him.  Starvation corner had a whole new meaning

And then the supporters blamed Tilbrook!  That's how it works but I see things way differently. 

You put a gun small forward into our dysfuntional forward line right now and he'd be wasted somewhat.  Surround him with a couple of top-notch gun key forwards and it's a different story.  So one comes before the other.  Working from the opposite way is high risk.

We'd be easy to coach against and the outcomes indicate that as well.

You put Lynch & Reiwoldt into our forward line this season and we'd be playing finals again.

 

 

Last line says it all for me macca.

[Redleg 37,556]

4 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Not sure why the mfc hardly ever comes  up when a key player is coming up for trade/free agents. Example Coniglio, Hill, Patton etc. etc 

May, Lever! To a lesser extent, Melsham, Hibberd.

[Macca 16,173]

19 minutes ago, Redleg said:

May, Lever! To a lesser extent, Melsham, Hibberd.

We have been quite active in recent years Redleg and who is to say we won't bring in a couple of ready made players again.  To my way of thinking I'd like to see 4 new 'good' players all-up.  Hard to do though and I reckon we've only done that once in the last 15 years  (2014 - Brayshaw,  Petracca,  Frost & Harmes)

The top end pick this year might take a year or 2 to hit his straps if we draft a midfielder type with that pick but we might be able to swing a few moves with this year's 2nd rounder and next year's 1st and/or 2nd rounder.  Plus there's trades however elaborate. 

I'm expecting quite a bit of activity from the club and we might see up to 10-11 new faces. 

[Demon Dynasty 15,383]

18 hours ago, Macca said:

Fritsch can be a good 3rd forward marking type ... good point.  I reckon we need 2 as I'm doubtful on Weideman and T-Mac works best as a float forward/utility forward option. 

Let's face it,  both players failed massively this past season so to go again with the same system doesn't make any sense.  And then there is the injury factor so back-up is required.

As previously stated,  small forwards work best on the back of good key forwards. 

I would argue Fritsch is our 2nd at this point Macca.  2nd who can genuinly compete (great overhead) & convert effectively at least.

T-Mac No.1 till we find that needle in a haystack genuine KF.

Personally, unless he has a brilliant  2020,  i think the Weid is a bust at AFL level other than for fringe depth in a rock solid team that's already up and going and needs a fill in for a few weeks or so to cover one of the first two up there.

KFs that could take over the No.1 mantel don't grow on trees.

Realistically i can't see us snagging Cameron and that leaves Patton with his dodgy knee.

Anyone thinking Jenkins will turn us around must be on the turps.

We might have to go small small small and just get it to ground wherever possible.  Do a Richmond and hope for some decent cameo performances in between by our only tall in T-Mac (if he can work his way back to 35-40 goal type form as the No.1) and the two genuine medium forwards...Melk & Fritshkreig.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Rusty Nails

[rjay 23,888]

17 minutes ago, Rusty Nails said:

We might have to go small small small and just get it to ground wherever possible.  Do a Richmond and hope for some decent cameo performances in between by our only tall in T-Mac (if he can work his way back to 35-40 goal type form as the No.1) and the two genuine medium forwards...Melk & Fritshkreig.

If we're going to go small 'Rusty' then we had better bring in a couple of quality small forwards.

Money needs to be on the line for Bolton and one other...

[Demon Dynasty 15,383]

18 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Not sure why the mfc hardly ever comes  up when a key player is coming up for trade/free agents. Example Coniglio, Hill, Patton etc. etc 

It's partly by design Demonsone.  How does a highly rated player like Lynch end up at a club that won a premiership only two seasons ago and has the biggest following in the League?...

When we lost the likes of T$ and Frawley were we duly compensated?

The NFL compensatory system attempts to put a value on any such free trade loss....

Compensatory free agents are determined by a proprietary formula, developed by the NFL Management Council, which considers a player’s salary, playing time and postseason honors.

The value of the compensatory free agents gained or lost by each team is totaled, and a team is awarded picks of equal value to the net loss of compensatory free agents, up to a maximum of four

Compensatory picks may be traded.

The AFL has a formula also but as far as i understand it only compensates once a free agent has hit veteran status (10 years) and for restricted free agents it's 8 years minimum.

I'm no expert on either compensatory system but to me the NFL one looks like it's capturing all free agent losses rather than leaving certain windows open where a club potentially receives none if it doesn't deal in the year prior to a player hitting his free agency trigger point.

Edited September 1, 2019 by Rusty Nails

[Demon Dynasty 15,383]

52 minutes ago, rjay said:

If we're going to go small 'Rusty' then we had better bring in a couple of quality small forwards.

Money needs to be on the line for Bolton and one other...

I reckon the RTOT value would be more wisely spent in this area than chasing the elusive KF rabbit rjay.

Much more likely to find a few decent options unable to push their way in to the Tiger's line up and one or two other clubs with strong quality depth.  Bolton as you say is a potential get.

Ideally we need both but the KF options are either NQRs or a bridge too far (for us) imv.  This might change if we can make finals in the next year or two but until then beggars can't be choosers.

[DemonLad5 1,637]

19 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Not sure why the mfc hardly ever comes  up when a key player is coming up for trade/free agents. Example Coniglio, Hill, Patton etc. etc 

In the last 2 years respectively we've arguably secured the two highest profile players to switch clubs (May and Lever). We were linked to Hill but he doesn't wanna play for us!!

[Macca 16,173]

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

I would argue Fritsch is our 2nd at this point Macca.  2nd who can genuinly compete (great overhead) & convert effectively at least.

T-Mac No.1 till we find that needle in a haystack genuine KF.

Personally, unless he has a brilliant  2020,  i think the Weid is a bust at AFL level other than for fringe depth in a rock solid team that's already up and going and needs a fill in for a few weeks or so to cover one of the first two up there.

KFs that could take over the No.1 mantel don't grow on trees.

Realistically i can't see us snagging Cameron and that leaves Patton with his dodgy knee.

Anyone thinking Jenkins will turn us around must be on the turps.

We might have to go small small small and just get it to ground wherever possible.  Do a Richmond and hope for some decent cameo performances in between by our only tall in T-Mac (if he can work his way back to 35-40 goal type form as the No.1) and the two genuine medium forwards...Melk & Fritshkreig.

If I was part of the recruiting team I'd find a way.  By hook or by crook (To bring in 2 decent key forwards over a 2 or 3 year period)

As a collective our forwards play from behind,  they don't lead enough or lead to space,  can't kick straight and don't play as a team within a team.  And the marking skills are well below par and they don't 'relish' the front position.

As individuals you could make a case for any number of them but as a collective,  we fail.  Ironically the bloke who does play in front and who does make multiple leads and make position is too small for the task (Spargo)  And Spargo isn't quick enough nor does he have the kicking skills to be a decent small forward.

Our forward line deficiencies first reared its ugly head after half time at Port Adelaide in 2018.  Hinkley decided to pressure & press our midfielders and the rest is history.  Sooner or later all the other clubs were going to cotton-on and that's what has happened.

A hurried or haphazard kick into a forward line can still be retained if all our forwards get to the front position and relish doing it.  But we play from behind and won't adhere to the fundamentals.

We also need cleaner delivery from our midfield and those issues can be addressed with more skillful midfielders,  pace,  outside run,  spread etc etc

 

[Demon Dynasty 15,383]

1 hour ago, Macca said:

If I was part of the recruiting team I'd find a way.  By hook or by crook (To bring in 2 decent key forwards over a 2 or 3 year period)

As a collective our forwards play from behind,  they don't lead enough or lead to space,  can't kick straight and don't play as a team within a team.  And the marking skills are well below par and they don't 'relish' the front position.

As individuals you could make a case for any number of them but as a collective,  we fail.  Ironically the bloke who does play in front and who does make multiple leads and make position is too small for the task (Spargo)  And Spargo isn't quick enough nor does he have the kicking skills to be a decent small forward.

Our forward line deficiencies first reared its ugly head after half time at Port Adelaide in 2018.  Hinkley decided to pressure & press our midfielders and the rest is history.  Sooner or later all the other clubs were going to cotton-on and that's what has happened.

A hurried or haphazard kick into a forward line can still be retained if all our forwards get to the front position and relish doing it.  But we play from behind and won't adhere to the fundamentals.

We also need cleaner delivery from our midfield and those issues can be addressed with more skillful midfielders,  pace,  outside run,  spread etc etc

 

No arguments on needing them and the present bunch, aside from Hunt & Melk, not working hard enough to get front position Macca.  Which is why i'd keep Hunt for at least next year.

It's been an issue for years and makes you wonder about whoever is teaching these blokes the craft.  Shocking stuff with most.  Melk about the only one who seems like  a natural but his forward craft probably comes from his days at the Bombers.

I don't think we're much of a chance of picking a Cameron up and imv the other KFs are NQRs.

Get two decent smalls in and get the ball to ground for the likes of Tracc, lockhart (wait & see), chandler (early days) and two decent quality small recruits to mop up.

If we ever get some cred back we might then be a chance of trading in a decent KF in the following trade period ie; a year or two away at best.

Edited September 2, 2019 by Rusty Nails