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Give the bloke a break! He is hard as nails...

Foot injuries are quite serious and rehab and training to build his fitness base to compete with the elite takes time. 

Jack will be a lot fitter and raring to rumble next season! Watch out 2020! His best is very very good.

I do however believe he needs to take a step back from the Captaincy to concentrate solely on his game as does Jonesy.

Gawn to Captain! Viney and May to VC.

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In one post people demand persistence and desire to die for the jumper.  The bets example of that is Viney and people want to trade him.  Love watching Viney play, yes he's been injured and not properly prepared for the season like many players.  I expect him to bounce back after two injury interrupted years.

He's not a silky player nor should he try to be.  As for his eloquence in language not all great captains have been.  It is dedication, desire and blood for the club which elevates him as someone to follow, as we lack that from many of our players.  

Looking forward to a better 2020 from Jack. 

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I’m not ready to give up on Viney, but I think he will need to play a tagging hff role from time to time, Brayshaw is better in the mid than Viney and should have more time as an inside mid which prob pushes Viney out abit.

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The biggest concern I have with Jack is that he's stopped pivoting on his feet when laying tackles.  I think they concluded that the driving action in his aggressive tackling was conveying too much pressure through his feet and exacerbating his injury.  His tackling has fallen away dramatically and lost its impotency as a result.  A great shame as it was his one wood.

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I would like to see him played as a tagger. Harmes is a better user of the ball and better when resting forward and I believe he is past his tagging days save for a special occasion. 

We saw Viney in the early days thrive when given specific jobs on Ablett, Dangerfield and Selwood. He is a natural tackler and hunter of the ball, so tagging seems to be right for him. His ball use is simply trash when left to his own devices. 

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8 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

Huh... did Jack employ his Dad?

Did Todd get his son the gig?

Is the need to grow up referring to the poster?

Did jack say, hey Dad this is the AFL not the U/13 ?

Did Todd get his son the job?  Well the Viney name helped.

Is the need to grow up referring to the poster? No, try again.

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10 hours ago, Megatron said:

That’s what no pre season does to ya

Two (or is it three?) pre-seasons.

Worth remembering that the only competitive hit-out Viney had before this season started was "reduced time" in a Casey practise match a week before Round 1.

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Another plodder. Should look to trade at season’s end. Unfortunately for Jack, he wouldn’t be in the starting midfield for most clubs.

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I am one of Viney's biggest critics.

My criticism is based on what I see is him trying to do too much at times when he should be bringing teammates into the game, not getting in the way, clearing space, understanding his limitations.

I don't think he should have been made captain and said so at the time. I believe he should step down and concentrate on his game.

However, you would think he can't play, doesn't deserve to be on the list, the worst player to pull on a boot for the club....etc...if you read a lot of the posts on this thread.

Jack can play, he's obviously hampered by injury and that's effecting his game.

If we can get Jack fit, harness his ferocity at the ball, get him to play as part of a team and use him in bursts then he will be a valuable team member.

Currently I think Goody and the FD are not helping him by not using his strengths...they also didn't seem to learn from the errors made with the other Jack (Trengove), let's hope it's not too late.

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10 hours ago, Sorry kids said:

Needs to stop having his Dad at work. Grow up.

Again Sorry remind what Todd brings to the club .

What is his  actual job??

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12 hours ago, grazman said:

I think a combination of a loss of power, (presuming his foot still isn't right) and the opposition knowing how he plays means he's getting tackled a lot more with (and without) the ball.  I like the idea of trialling him as a small forward.  He will create turnovers. 

I remember his final against the Hawks last year with  27 disposals and 8 clearances as vintage Viney.  He's as tough and competitive as they come,  he will be more disappointed than any posters on here about his form this year.  He'll be back.

Loss of power may not be from his foot, but the time restricted eating thing he was doing https://m.afl.com.au/news/2019-04-20/why-you-cant-meet-jack-viney-for-breakfast

TRE works as the body uses all its glycogen stores by around 8-12 hours so for the last 4-8 hours it burns fat. Several articles state do moderate exercise only after fasting to accelerate fat burning, but never do high intensity exercise..  If you do intense exercise your body can’t burn fat quickly enough to supply energy, and it starts burning and destroying muscle.  Last I looked, the morning preseason training sessions that Viney did powered by nothing but black coffee were pretty intense.

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7 hours ago, Jaded said:

I would like to see him played as a tagger. Harmes is a better user of the ball and better when resting forward and I believe he is past his tagging days save for a special occasion. 

We saw Viney in the early days thrive when given specific jobs on Ablett, Dangerfield and Selwood. He is a natural tackler and hunter of the ball, so tagging seems to be right for him. His ball use is simply trash when left to his own devices. 

Harmes is also our only outside receiver. Why we continue to play so many players boundry side with our only runner tagging the opposition's best player is beyond me.

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2 hours ago, bing181 said:

Two (or is it three?) pre-seasons.

Worth remembering that the only competitive hit-out Viney had before this season started was "reduced time" in a Casey practise match a week before Round 1.

This.

He has clearly been playing injured this year. Again.

And coming of an interrupted preseason nowhere near his peak fitness. Again.

He is the perfect metaphor for the team as a whole.

He deserves to have an injury free preseason and the opportunity to come into round 1 2020 cherry ripe.

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2 minutes ago, binman said:

This.

He has clearly been playing injured this year. Again.

And coming of an interrupted preseason nowhere near his peak fitness. Again.

He is the perfect metaphor for the team as a whole.

He deserves to have an injury free preseason and the opportunity to come into round 1 2020 cherry ripe.

If he is injured then DONT PLAY HIM

 

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Just now, Kent said:

If he is injured then DONT PLAY HIM

 

Right. Using that logic we would have about 3 players available. 

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9 minutes ago, Kent said:

If he is injured then DONT PLAY HIM

 

7 minutes ago, binman said:

Right. Using that logic we would have about 3 players available. 

Imaging if we ruin our next preseason by playing injured players when the best we're hoping for is to finish 16th...

Plenty of players could do Viney's role atm, it's not like we're short for inside mids.

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9 hours ago, Dee tention said:

Give the bloke a break! He is hard as nails...

Foot injuries are quite serious and rehab and training to build his fitness base to compete with the elite takes time. 

Jack will be a lot fitter and raring to rumble next season! Watch out 2020! His best is very very good.

I do however believe he needs to take a step back from the Captaincy to concentrate solely on his game as does Jonesy.

Gawn to Captain! Viney and May to VC.

Common sense, the bloke hasn't done a pre-season in 2 years, has had long spells off legs.  Most injuries you can get moving on your feet pretty quickly, even knee reco your up walking straight away.  The injury this guy had he basically meant long periods of moon boots limited walking let alone running.

He is a mile behind the competition fitness wise.  The issue the club faces is managing him over the next 6 months, he will want to be on the track all day everyday to get to the level needed, his work loads will need to be monitored closely to minimise the risk of another foot injury, my opinion any more stress related fractures in his feet would almost certainly end his career. 

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19 minutes ago, Watson11 said:

Loss of power may not be from his foot, but the time restricted eating thing he was doing https://m.afl.com.au/news/2019-04-20/why-you-cant-meet-jack-viney-for-breakfast

TRE works as the body uses all its glycogen stores by around 8-12 hours so for the last 4-8 hours it burns fat. Several articles state do moderate exercise only after fasting to accelerate fat burning, but never do high intensity exercise..  If you do intense exercise your body can’t burn fat quickly enough to supply energy, and it starts burning and destroying muscle.  Last I looked, the morning preseason training sessions that Viney did powered by nothing but black coffee were pretty intense.

Darren Burgess should be all over this.

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9 minutes ago, binman said:

Right. Using that logic we would have about 3 players available. 

Remember me ;)  

Your glib response requires more clarity surely.

We all know at any given time there are managed injuries out there. The point surely is that some natures of injury are far more susceptible to becoming much worse than others. We've all seen surely the catastrophe that Foot problems can become if poorly managed.

It actually concerns me that Viney may never fulfil his potential because of recurrences. That would be a shame. I rate him highly as a player, no so much as a captain.

But as Kent suggests...some players just ought not be played ...sometimes.

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1 minute ago, grazman said:

Darren Burgess should be all over this.

Going to be fascinating to see what mercurial spells he can cast over our lot.

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3 minutes ago, drdrake said:

Common sense, the bloke hasn't done a pre-season in 2 years, has had long spells off legs.  Most injuries you can get moving on your feet pretty quickly, even knee reco your up walking straight away.  The injury this guy had he basically meant long periods of moon boots limited walking let alone running.

He is a mile behind the competition fitness wise.  The issue the club faces is managing him over the next 6 months, he will want to be on the track all day everyday to get to the level needed, his work loads will need to be monitored closely to minimise the risk of another foot injury, my opinion any more stress related fractures in his feet would almost certainly end his career. 

If we're going down this road then:

1) He shouldn't be playing. He should be getting right for next year.

2) He should give up the captaincy given he's such a risk and is apparently not around for most of the preseason.

3) He should have learned from how he handled his injury the first time that he's being selfish if he doesn't listen this time.

Trust is one of the biggest things in footy clubs, how much can we say we trust Jack to do all those things?

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15 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

 

Imaging if we ruin our next preseason by playing injured players when the best we're hoping for is to finish 16th...

Plenty of players could do Viney's role atm, it's not like we're short for inside mids.

Exactly Lord

In fact it appears to me that the midfield is better without him playing

Jack is not essential far from it.

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Posted (edited)

Like his co-captain buddy his major weakness is momentum killing ball use. More often than not when he or Jones  are in contested situations and get their hands on the ball, it becomes another stoppage or it gets turned over. Sharing and quick ball movement are not in their DNA. I would be shocked if I ever will see a clever tap to advantage from these blokes. 

Edited by america de cali
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6 minutes ago, america de cali said:

Like his co-captain buddy his major weakness is momentum killing ball use. More often than not when he or Jones  are in contested situations and get their hands on the ball, it becomes another stoppage or it gets turned over. Sharing and quick ball movement are not in their DNA. I would be shocked if I ever will see a clever tap to advantage from these blokes. 

A problem with Jack is not actually of his own doing but that of the imagined style of our contested footy.  A warrior/terrier like Jack was in the minds of some most suitable for a role in our Gladiator Game. This was more concerned apparently about getting the ball than actually doing anything profitable with it. In this Jack was sublime. See ball ....get ball.....it was that next bit  ;)

He might still have a role as an inside mid at times. We do need them, it's just that there's currently no balance with outside run. Is that Jack's fault ? Not in my mind.

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Posted (edited)

Sometimes I think I'm a negative poster, but then I read threads like these and it's an eye opener. 

Viney at his best is easily in our top 5 most important players. At his best, his intensity, pressure and tackling ability at the coalface are simply unmatched and that is why he is so important to our side. The issue for Viney is that if he doesn't bring his one wood to every game, he can look second rate due to his limitations in other areas of his game. Adding to this is the fact that ballistic and one-dimensional players like Viney who are really only suited to play one (extremely important) role absolutely need to complete a full pre-season load. And that is the major hurdle he faces going forward. 

Posters calling for him to be traded are 'ignore' button worthy. 

Edited by stevethemanjordan
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