Are we tanking?

[McQueen 17,862]

Clearly. 

We will be Premiers next year. 

[Dame Gaga 2,453]

OSCAR KICKED A GOAL!!!!! ?No, not tanking. ( Although maybe he didn't get the memo?)

[KingDingAling 3,593]

Omac spent a lot of time forward as a junior. Considering the switch has been beneficial to Petty, its worth a shot to see if it could help Omac. Plus, it worked for Tom Mac to some degree. Not tanking just tinkering around during a year thats already lost. I hope we do rest players now. I wouldnt be risking any players even remotely sore. No point. Season is done. Look to 2020.

[bjDee 1,247]

How did the elephant get in the room??

[dee-eee 231]

 Tanking ???   No, basic skill errors a real problem .   We deserved to lose  but i can still visualise Petracca butchering a couple of gettable ones early and of course Fritsch landing only one from five attempts .

 .

[Mydee 288]

What a terrible thread, it serves no real purpose and can only harm the club. Of all the clubs that have suffered from this accusation Melbourne has possibly fared the worst and largely through the flippancy of one of its paid officials. I had hoped that we were all a little bit more mature these days and yes, that does include the supporters. I don't mind our members and supporters being frustrated with our performance this year and expressing their feelings in the strongest terms. I can understand long suffering members dropping their membership, after all 55 years of  failure is very hard to take. But raising this sort of nonsense is absolutely illconsidered, pathetic and contrary to the club's interests.. Firstly would the person that raised this explain exactly what they mean by tanking, for example does risking our players' health constitute by playing them with niggles constitute tanking,?  Does playing inexperienced kids with potential rather than experienced players who have continually dissapointed constitute tanking? And does selecting players in positions  where they have not played before constitute tanking?  Or does he really mean that the players aren't trying?

Olisik, I have read a lot of your posts and I usually refrain from commenting because others here usually do a good job in rebutting your histrionics, as interesting as they are, but in this case I feel obliged to comment because they serve absolutely no useful purpose and as others have pointed out for a number of reasons that we really have dissapointed this year because of genuine on and off field short comings.

There is a word that rhymes with tanking that comes to mind but I will leave that one aside.

[Redleg 37,556]

1 hour ago, bjDee said:

How did the elephant get in the room??

He put on the number 22 Pies Jumper and no one went near him.

[Adzman 2,085]

If we play Spargo in the ruck then we are tanking. Until that happens we are trying to win.

 

[Kent 2,581]

How in hells' name can you tell?

[ManDee 7,076]

On 8/12/2019 at 6:26 PM, olisik said:

Let’s address the Elephant in the room here, The question has to be asked.

-Playing OMac as full forward.

-No manning up on Sidebottom

-Playing Hore in the VFL

These are the types of moves which raise eyebrows

With the difference between pick 2 and pick 3 this year, have we gone into our old ways.

We are not tanking! Tanking does not exist. I prefer to call it "playing the long game"

We are allowing players to play their best albeit sometimes at Casey, sometimes out of position and sometimes they are told to keep away from certain players presumably for their own good. (Sidebottom may have an infectious disease, caused by leather poisoning) 

No we are not tanking, but if our current selections and coaching is a guide I can understand why you think so. If we are not engaged in "playing the long game" we are in deep poo! 

But in all seriousness I believe we are "playing the long game".

[Dee Zephyr 17,425]

Maybe a better question would be “ Have We Given Up?” It was one of the Real or Overreaction questions on 360 last night. Whateley responded overreaction, he just thinks we aren’t good enough which still kind of stings to hear that even with our dismal record.

He also believes things won’t get any better over the last two rounds. 

[Return to Glory 7,722]

Melbourne v Sydney on Friday night is must-see TV. Two teams desperate to remain in touch of the top eight.

[Smokey 4,126]

[Hunt29 258]

Absolutely not tanking. 

Omac forward as we legitimately have no other options. Unless they went with Keilty again. Hore in the VFL I don’t agree with. He’s best 22. But we already had Frost May and Lever. So I guess they didn’t want to go too tall. 

We just don’t have the depth to cover mass injuries. 

I also think the confidence levels and fitness levels are quiet low. The inconsistent effort week to week is very frustrating. 

[olisik 4,060]

59 minutes ago, Hunt29 said:

Absolutely not tanking. 

Omac forward as we legitimately have no other options. Unless they went with Keilty again. Hore in the VFL I don’t agree with. He’s best 22. But we already had Frost May and Lever. So I guess they didn’t want to go too tall. 

We just don’t have the depth to cover mass injuries. 

I also think the confidence levels and fitness levels are quiet low. The inconsistent effort week to week is very frustrating. 

Why wouldn’t you put May forward and Hore in backline?

[Smokey 4,126]

20 minutes ago, olisik said:

Why wouldn’t you put May forward and Hore in backline?

Id guess the reason could be that we understand Hore is a known quantity and obviously best 22 next year, so we are giving Omac one last look in a new role to see if we can get anything out of him other than being back half depth. That's what I'd be doing at this stage anyway. 

[Hunt29 258]

30 minutes ago, olisik said:

Why wouldn’t you put May forward and Hore in backline?

Personally I’d rather May back. Not only a much better defender than Omac he’s an extremely better ball user. For Omac was a bit of a liability down back. Also he can’t match up on a smaller quicker type May can. 

[olisik 4,060]

Quote From last tanking scandal

“From a coach’s perspective, and I wasn’t privy to the conversations, the positions that players were played in didn’t give us the best opportunity to win games of footy.”

This is why seeing OMac up forward, or slow players on wings concerns me.

Edited August 14, 2019 by olisik

[dazzledavey36 48,708]

1 hour ago, olisik said:

Quote From last tanking scandal

“From a coach’s perspective, and I wasn’t privy to the conversations, the positions that players were played in didn’t give us the best opportunity to win games of footy.”

This is why seeing OMac up forward, or slow players on wings concerns me.

Lol.. you've legit lost the plot now.

We threw Omac forward because as Goodwin said on Saturday, he wants to start building cohesion down back with May, Frost and Lever so that it can flow into 2020, Omac clearly doesn't fit into that bracket now so with Weideman, Smith and Tom McDonald on the injured list, we can't just leave it up to a 19 year old Harry Petty ( who has been impressive). So it was a simple decision of giving us another tall target up forward to help Petty, but also seeing what it could do for Oscars development as it seems now he is on the outer down back. I can see Goodwins logic in maybe trying this position to get him back to form or see if he can actually contribute and maybe add a whole new element to our side. My opinion is that it didn't work personally, but he cracked in and tried hard and I saw that first hand. Omac is a limited player so i didn't expect a great deal.

JKH and Baker on a wings is legit our only options because we have no one else to come in and fill a role due to injuries or no player personal that is quick and plays that position. Hence why we are looking at Hill and Langdon because they fit that criteria. 

Use your [censored] brains for once.

Edited August 14, 2019 by dazzledavey36

[olisik 4,060]

23 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Lol.. you've legit lost the plot now.

We threw Omac forward because as Goodwin said on Saturday, he wants to start building cohesion down back with May, Frost and Lever so that it can flow into 2020, Omac clearly doesn't fit into that bracket now so with Weideman, Smith and Tom McDonald on the injured list, we can't just leave it up to a 19 year old Harry Petty ( who has been impressive). So it was a simple decision of giving us another tall target up forward to help Petty, but also seeing what it could do for Oscars development as it seems now he is on the outer down back. I can see Goodwins logic in maybe trying this position to get him back to form or see if he can actually contribute and maybe add a whole new element to our side. My opinion is that it didn't work personally, but he cracked in and tried hard and I saw that first hand. Omac is a limited player so i didn't expect a great deal.

JKH and Baker on a wings is legit our only options because we have no one else to come in and fill a role due to injuries or no player personal that is quick and plays that position. Hence why we are looking at Hill and Langdon because they fit that criteria. 

Use your [censored] brains for once.

Since you understand Goodwins logic and it makes so much sense, can you share with the class why he didn’t tag Sidebottom?  

Can you also explain why Hore was left in VFL? And before you answer that our backline is too tall, ask yourself do you consider Hore best 22 or not. Personally I think he is regardless of whose fit in our backline. He should be a walk up.

Most would have him ahead of turnover Hibberd right now you would think. But not Goodwin.

Edited August 14, 2019 by olisik

[dazzledavey36 48,708]

7 minutes ago, olisik said:

Since you understand Goodwins logic and it makes so much sense, can you share with the class why he didn’t tag Sidebottom?  

Can you also explain why Hore was left in VFL? And before you answer that our backline is too tall, ask yourself do you consider Hore best 22 or not. Personally I think he is regardless of whose fit in our backline. He should be a walk up.

Hore should have come in for Omac, there is no doubt about that, but then i saw Omac go forward and I understood that logic, and even if that was still the case I still would brought in Marty. I think if Goodwin had his time again he would have selected him and to me Hore sent a statement in the VFL and was then pulled out in the last qtr as i see that as him now officially in for May against Sydney. I agree with you that he should have been playing and I was gobsmacked he was left out.

[Demon Dynasty 15,385]

2 hours ago, olisik said:

Quote From last tanking scandal

“From a coach’s perspective, and I wasn’t privy to the conversations, the positions that players were played in didn’t give us the best opportunity to win games of footy.”

This is why seeing OMac up forward, or slow players on wings concerns me.

Add to that allowing the Pie's best ball users to run amok, paying them scant respect/attention for pretty much the entire match from what i heard and the little i saw.

Some examples (and i've only seen highlights/lowlights!)...

> Pendles - Gus's eagerness to leave him on at least one occasion while he waltzes inside 50 for an easy goal... well highlighted.

> Sidebottom - Jones starting 30 feet away on the point of square at the bounces, no one else in cooee!  The vision is damning.

> Varcoe - Jones apparently minding at times?  Never a chance of catching him on the burst & starting well off his shoulder from the limited clips i witnessed.  Varcoe also allowed free run at the footy.

Even though this might appear to smell a little fishy my conclusion is it's yet another wonderful example of "how not to win" from our Coach & FD and why i am very skeptical of Goody's coaching ability.

There has been zero cohesion from any of the back 6 all year and Hore is our best defender.  There was absolutely nothing to gain by playing Oscar ahead of Hore unless they wanted to put Hore in cotton wool for 2020.

Hore in for Oscar.  May forward for this match to have any chance of a win.

No brainer.

Edited August 14, 2019 by Rusty Nails

[samcantstandya 918]

4 hours ago, olisik said:

Why wouldn’t you put May forward and Hore in backline?

Because  May's done his hammy.

[samcantstandya 918]

1 hour ago, Rusty Nails said:

Add to that allowing the Pie's best ball users to run amok, paying them scant respect/attention for pretty much the entire match from what i heard and the little i saw.

Some examples (and i've only seen highlights/lowlights!)...

> Pendles - Gus's eagerness to leave him on at least one occasion while he waltzes inside 50 for an easy goal... well highlighted.

> Sidebottom - Jones starting 30 feet away on the point of square at the bounces, no one else in cooee!  The vision is damning.

> Varcoe - Jones apparently minding at times?  Never a chance of catching him on the burst & starting well off his shoulder from the limited clips i witnessed.  Varcoe also allowed free run at the footy.

Even though this might appear to smell a little fishy my conclusion is it's yet another wonderful example of "how not to win" from our Coach & FD and why i am very skeptical of Goody's coaching ability.

Theret has been zero cohesion from any of the back 6 all year and Hore is our best defender.  There was absolutely nothing to gain by playing Oscar ahead of Hore unless they wanted to put Hore in cotton wool for 2020.

Hore in for Oscar.  May forward for this match to have any chance of a win.

No brainer.

Then we have no chance because May won't be playing forward or any other posse till 2020

[titan_uranus 22,290]

4 hours ago, olisik said:

Why wouldn’t you put May forward and Hore in backline?

Because if we stand to gain anything from these last few games, it's trying to get some cohesion as a unit between Lever, May and Frost.

And because the player who went forward needed to ruck as well (and OMac was easier to sacrifice into the ruck than May).

And because OMac's career is floundering so why not see if he could do something different as a forward.

I wanted Hore to play but they made a call with the height of our backline, including Hibberd. Just because we lost and Hibberd struggled doesn't mean we're tanking.

2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

Add to that allowing the Pie's best ball users to run amok, paying them scant respect/attention for pretty much the entire match from what i heard and the little i saw.

Some examples (and i've only seen highlights/lowlights!)...

> Pendles - Gus's eagerness to leave him on at least one occasion while he waltzes inside 50 for an easy goal... well highlighted.

> Sidebottom - Jones starting 30 feet away on the point of square at the bounces, no one else in cooee!  The vision is damning.

> Varcoe - Jones apparently minding at times?  Never a chance of catching him on the burst & starting well off his shoulder from the limited clips i witnessed.  Varcoe also allowed free run at the footy.

Even though this might appear to smell a little fishy my conclusion is it's yet another wonderful example of "how not to win" from our Coach & FD and why i am very skeptical of Goody's coaching ability.

There has been zero cohesion from any of the back 6 all year and Hore is our best defender.  There was absolutely nothing to gain by playing Oscar ahead of Hore unless they wanted to put Hore in cotton wool for 2020.

Hore in for Oscar.  May forward for this match to have any chance of a win.

No brainer.

Not great analysis, Rusty.

Brayshaw didn't show "eagnerness" to leave Pendlebury. That's one example, highlighted in slow motion, and not even that bad of a decision from Brayshaw.

Jones wasn't just leaving Sidebottom for the sake of it. Goodwin was trying to bring run off the back of the square. This has been done to death now.

Varcoe did kick two goals but had no real influence on the game otherwise. At any rate, which speedy player should we have played on him anyway, if you're that concerned by his pace? We're slow whether we're "tanking" or not.

The Oscar v Hore thing is explicable. I'd have played Hore anyway, but they weren't going to ruck Hore, or May, so someone had to play that second ruck role (and I do not agree that May is a good option for that role).