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Lord Nev

Dermie: Melbourne are downhill skiers

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Thanks 'Capt Obvious' Brereton. Two young players, both with less than 100 games in a team lacking experienced leaders, need to improve parts of their game. Who'd would have thunk it?

Regardless of his onfield success, there are commentators to whom I respect their views about our team. Brereton is not one of them. 

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13 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

I wish we were downhill skiers. 

We're downhill skiers who regularly veer off the course and hit a tree.

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Bring back the Three Wise Monkeys with Coggo and Bluey..... for comedy

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1 hour ago, Supermercado said:

We're downhill skiers who regularly veer off the course and hit a tree.

we need to play our footy in NZ then !!

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1 hour ago, Supermercado said:

We're downhill skiers who regularly veer off the course and hit a tree.

Or we get to the bottom of the run and think wow that was an awesome run, dwell on  that awesome run for a while add a handful of bad runs because we are thinking about the awesome run we had.

It is a glaring issue for our team once the ball leaves that 5-10m of the contest our defensive pressure is terrible we allow teams to run away from the contest, our mids and forwards don't work hard enough outside the contest.

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17 hours ago, Lord Nev said:

In particular, he singles out Clarry and Gus:

“They’ve got some wonderful players and the two that stand out, they’re going to be fantastic in the history of that club, are (Clayton) Oliver and (Angus) Brayshaw.

“Right now, from what I’ve seen this year, I’d rank them, as defensive midfielders, three and a half, four out of ten.

“They’ll tackle if in a pack and somebody just gets the ball and they’re half a metre away from them, but to actually go and hunt a tackle is a different thing.

“They need to step that side of their game up.”

Hard to argue with him

Yet neither apparently is going to cop the ultimate message from the coach, again.

 

Nah.  I usually respect a fair amount of what the Derm brings but IMHO he is off on this as far as Clarry is concerned.

Clarry is our number 1 tackler so far this season (tackle average 6.31) and No.1 last year (6.77).  Ranked No.1 for us in pressure acts averages (24).

Ranked in the top 10 in the AFL this season for tackle averages (10th overall) and 13th in pressure acts!!!

If he has issues in this area then i'm Uncle Bitter's uncle!

Inside 50 Clarry is ranked 9th (1.19) and ranked 4th overall last year (1.09).  Pretty good results given the amount of ground this bloke covers and the amount of contests he impacts.  To put that in some perspective Tracc has spent a stack more time inside 50 and his results from 2019? ..... ranked 8th (1.25) and 2018? .... 21st! (0.48).

Ok, Gus sitting @ 10th (3.44) has dropped off a little, having finished 6th for us in 2018 (4.68).  Ranked 153rd in the AFL. Maybe an under done tank this season and/or lack of leg speed (bit of both)....just can't quite get to opponents often enough to lay a bloody tackle.  So yes, plenty of room for improvement and Derm might have this one correct but did Gus come into 2019 with any niggles?  Can't recall someone might remind me?

Dunkley presently our 2nd best for tackle averages inside 50 (2.00), albeit off a small sample.  Just behind Jeffy at No.1 (2.29)!  Jeffy is No.1 in the AFL also this season and Dunkley No.4!  Doubt he'll be dropped this week just on that strength alone 💪  As an aside Tim Smith sits at 14th in the AFL and 3rd for us (1.67), more than likely part of the reason the coach & FD will be bringing him back this week aside from the fact we presently don't have a genuine key tall forward running around.

Edited by Rusty Nails
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2 hours ago, Rusty Nails said:

Nah.  I usually respect a fair amount of what the Derm brings but IMHO he is off on this as far as Clarry is concerned.

Sensational post mate!

Definitely agree it seems more harsh on Oliver than Brayshaw, but optically it did seem like Oliver lacked defensive intent early in the season, there's been a big noticeable improvement over the last 4-6 weeks or so. I wish they had context stats for tackles, as I think sometimes they can get skewed (a bit like possessions) for players that play as inside midfielders. Would love to know if Champion Data record a stat along the lines of '2nd effort tackles' or something along those lines.

In a similar way, that may have effected Gus' stats given he's playing less in the guts, but again, optically he has definitely seemed off this year, and some of his defensive efforts would have been the type of intent that saw him 'dropped' at the start of last year. There must be some reasoning behind why he hasn't been this year, his form has easily been bad enough from an outsiders perspective. There are enough commentators and analysts now talking about his lack of accountability, particluarly on the spread, that it's a valid point.

One of the things I think is telling with Gus' form is his metres gained. Hard to rank him for clearances, tackles and possessions given he attended 15 more centre bounces last year (despite 3 less games to this point), but he's also tracking at about half of his average for 2018 in metres gained.

I think we'll probably have to wait for the offseason to find out what's been up with Gus. Either he'll request a trade (unlikely) or the club will finally release the info about him playing under duress (as to not make it sound like an excuse by saying so during the year).

He has a massive preseason ahead of him. A very disappointing start to 2018 and an even more disappointing whole of 2019. I believe in him and think he'll put in, but the pressure is on him now.

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1 hour ago, Lord Nev said:

Sensational post mate!

Definitely agree it seems more harsh on Oliver than Brayshaw, but optically it did seem like Oliver lacked defensive intent early in the season, there's been a big noticeable improvement over the last 4-6 weeks or so. I wish they had context stats for tackles, as I think sometimes they can get skewed (a bit like possessions) for players that play as inside midfielders. Would love to know if Champion Data record a stat along the lines of '2nd effort tackles' or something along those lines.

In a similar way, that may have effected Gus' stats given he's playing less in the guts, but again, optically he has definitely seemed off this year, and some of his defensive efforts would have been the type of intent that saw him 'dropped' at the start of last year. There must be some reasoning behind why he hasn't been this year, his form has easily been bad enough from an outsiders perspective. There are enough commentators and analysts now talking about his lack of accountability, particluarly on the spread, that it's a valid point.

One of the things I think is telling with Gus' form is his metres gained. Hard to rank him for clearances, tackles and possessions given he attended 15 more centre bounces last year (despite 3 less games to this point), but he's also tracking at about half of his average for 2018 in metres gained.

I think we'll probably have to wait for the offseason to find out what's been up with Gus. Either he'll request a trade (unlikely) or the club will finally release the info about him playing under duress (as to not make it sound like an excuse by saying so during the year).

He has a massive preseason ahead of him. A very disappointing start to 2018 and an even more disappointing whole of 2019. I believe in him and think he'll put in, but the pressure is on him now.

Thank LN.  I believe second effort tackles that don't quite stick, and the like, are caught in the 'pressure acts' stat by Champion.  Clarry has this well covered in all aspects.  I have purposely watched for these 2nd effort acts and follow ups and there are very few in the league that match Clarry's ability to win or at worst neutralise a loose ground ball contest.

This bloke is in a different league and has been for 2 solid seasons now.  Dermy is way off on Clarry, aside from his disposal coming inside 50 (among others) he is not far away from 'Champion' territory.

As i've said previously this season, Clarry, Big M and to a lessor extent Harmes and Salem are the type you can build a premiership team around.  Viney at his best (with major clean up of disposal by foot) along with a few others starting to find their feet such as Tracc, May, Frosty, Hore and Melksham.

In theory Gus should be in the group with Harmes and Salem IMO but this year has just seen a massive fall from his 2018 2nd half.  His confidence and ability to just gather a loose ground ball with one touch (or even a few) seems to have deserted him.  When that happens you no longer have that little bit of extra time and space you did previously which must put your whole game under extra pressure at the highest level.  In some ways this is where a very good coach comes in.  Form management (see belief/confidence in self/game) is a key component of man management.  A short well constructed and managed stint at Casey overseen by performance or line coach with specific goals to work on may have been just the tonic for Gus earlier in the season when it was clear he was on a downward form spiral.

Maybe he came in to the season carrying an issue LN?  Maybe he's been getting some closer checking from the opp this season also?

Was it the return of Viney to the middle and him getting pushed out again similar to first part of 2018 and he just doesn't have the silk/burst speed to impact as well (offensively/defensively on quicker opponent)?

Interesting times with Gus.  Let's hope he/we can turn it around in 2020.  Maybe more time in the middle is needed.  We seemed to win more often when he played more time through there in 2018.  Unfortunately not so well this season given this year's ordinary disposal.

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Derm rattles on like an old man but u can’t argue with what he says. 

He is spot on and it’s a joke. 

We are still mentally pizzz weak and doesn’t look like changing anytime soon. 

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Derm is wrong about The downhill skiing.

I myself am a moguls man as are many of us who don’t suffer knee problems.

Ive spoken to Dermie about this in the chalet but he was more concerned about trying to appear intelligent to take the message in.

 

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perhaps we are but seriously you have to wonder about cliche commentators. Does dermie actually have any ability to think for himself or just real of the usual bland statements echoed by other media personalities. What is the point of parroting others. Any good media personality would show some originality. Maybe dermie is just a downhill skier in the media, a media lightweight.

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Is the modern game. Look hard and most sides are the same. Up down from week to week.  The days of toughness are gone. Now ut is how fat is my wallet and coaches who want a friendly caring relationship with their players.

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22 hours ago, Pennant St Dee said:

Listened to it in its full context, he was on the money and he was cautious in his approach very much talking about the now, he was glowing in his future expectations of Clarrie and Gus

Agree. He recently analysed petracca and why expectations are too high. Interesting insights most times. 

He thinks trac is caught between being a midfielder with poor engine and key position with wrong body shape.

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Obviousl;y Dermie is empowered by Trumpism in that when you feel not enough notice is taken of you AND you are frightened about not being the centre of the universe, then you come out with some b@#$%% t idea.

Well .....it keeps Mathew Lloyd, Chis Judd, Newman, Tom Morris , RObbo,And Stevo in Jobs !!!

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On 7/18/2019 at 7:43 PM, beelzebub said:

Are they likely  to be dropped  ? 

There's  your  answer 

There is a player nowhere near their ability who is never dropped, so why should they be?

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2 hours ago, Demon17 said:

Agree. He recently analysed petracca and why expectations are too high. Interesting insights most times. 

He thinks trac is caught between being a midfielder with poor engine and key position with wrong body shape.

Trac should be like a chunky De Goey,  running amok and terrorising defenders. He's being asked to think too much. Should be going on instinct.

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The stats say our problems are up forward. The midfield is still winning contests and clearances but conversion inside 50 is woefull. We know delivery has been haphazard for much of the season, just bombing it long to a pack and hoping for a mark from TMac, Weid or Max if he is there. For 90% of those bombs the ball has spilled to ground and come straight back out and shown up our lack of two way running. Time and time again I have asked where are our crumpers, goal sneaks, they don’t seem to exist unfortunately. 

Now it has occurred to me that the 20 or so times I have attended training this year I have never seen us simulate what is happening every game day, that is having our small forwards roving off packs to shark the spilled ball and kick a goal. All our game simulation has us moving the ball quickly and finding a forward target. Great practice but it is not happening game day and our small forwards are not learning or practicing to crumb off a pack.

Just an observation, we are not practicing like we are playing up forward. 

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To be downhill skiers you need to beat poor teams so I don’t think we make the grade 

we are just shizen

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13 hours ago, Mazer Rackham said:

Trac should be like a chunky De Goey,  running amok and terrorising defenders. He's being asked to think too much. Should be going on instinct.

You actually raise a point I have thought about. Our "style" , i fear, for many natural footballers is of itself very  counter instinctive.

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Danny Frawley today on SEN: “It’s just amazing how they haven’t copped any scrutiny, I’ve just never seen a bigger fall from grace. They’re totally irrelevant."

 

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1 minute ago, Lord Nev said:

Danny Frawley today on SEN: “It’s just amazing how they haven’t copped any scrutiny, I’ve just never seen a bigger fall from grace. They’re totally irrelevant."

 

Imagine how Roosy feels....

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1 minute ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Imagine how Roosy feels....

I've posted elsewhere what I've heard about that. Obviously rumour, but he's not happy.

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7 minutes ago, Lord Nev said:

I've posted elsewhere what I've heard about that. Obviously rumour, but he's not happy.

I would be furious if it was me. 3 years of hard work, early mornings and long days. 

 

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We haven't had a player that can take charge of a game for some time. Perhaps Neita was the last player that could will us across the line through the strength of his play and leadership. I thought TMac was heading that way last year but maybe not.

Certainly we haven't had a dominant mid for eons that could do that in the mould of a Cripps. Oliver may get there and he is an amazing talent but he doesn't do the damage that a Cripps does.

Its a real failing of us as a club.

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To be a fair dinkum downhill skier there is one thing you need in abundance. Guts. On this issue I believe Brereton to be wrong.

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