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Bartlett, Pert, et al

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11 minutes ago, Sorry kids said:

I do not follow your logic and the way you add words to change a post. Where did the word"automatically come from, as in automatically get the best out of the players" from you, not me. You also do not understand the subtleties of pressure. It could be as simple as having a coffee and saying to Goodwin, have you considered this or that. You seem to confuse pressure with more extreme words like ultimatum or strong arm tactics. As I said I find your way of arguing against the spirit of the posts. I  will not respond to you again. Same goes for drysdale.

But thats not pressure? Thats just someone giving Goodwin some ideas on how to try something different.

I can guarantee right now they WON'T be putting any pressure on Goodwin this year.

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, DeeZee said:

So the plan is to keep playing injured players till the end of the season then put them in for surgeries from which they will come back not quite ready for round one.

Groundhog day.

With the spectre of 'tanking' still hanging over our heads Barlett has no choice but to say we will not put players in for surgery or play the kids.  He needs to protect the broader interests of the club. 

The irony is we don't need to tank as we probably have a top 5 pick.  But that wouldn't stop the media 'click bait' articles on 'tanking if he had said otherwise.  The club would be fighting spot fires all over the place and that is the last thing we need.

I'm guessing Bartlett is getting push-back from sponsors, members and other stakeholders.  And, Jaguar are only a one year contract so Bartlett is probably trying to extend that as we speak rather than leave it to the end of the year, again. 

Bartlett must keep the faith, at least publicly but as I noted above he seems worried.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
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1 minute ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

With the spectre of 'tanking' still hanging over our heads Barlett has no choice but to say we will not put players in for surgery or play the kids.  He needs to protect the broader interests of the club. 

Excellent point, and one that i probably wouldnt have considered in my current foul mood with our team.

Thanks for the face-slap.

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Injuries are not an excuse is the standard response.

injuries are an excuse when you have a finite number of players on your list, 15 players go in to post season surgery & miss large parts of the the pre-season, you suffer so many injuries during the season your VFL team is depleted to 3 AFL listed players for a game.

We stood no chance.

i don’t like Pert and think he cause unnecessary damage internally but nothing can be blamed on him at this stage.

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1 hour ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

From Olisks post:

Bartlett: “But I have spent a bit of time in the footy department, which I hadn’t before, spent a day down there..."

That he has done this for the first time in the six years he has been at the club says he is worried.  Not panicked but worried.

A review doesn't mean having some external people coming in looking over people's shoulders.  Pert has fresh eyes and is very capable of undertaking a review.  Pert has said he has spent a lot of time in player and football department meetings. 

I suggest a 'review' is already happening by Pert.  As I've said for sometime I will be shocked if we don't have football department structure and assistant coach changes.

Definitely. 

Having worked in the corporate world including the pro sport world (but not AFL) for my entire adult career, rarely do board members, execs and VPs venture down to see how the grunts are. They send their little gophers -- or "operational managers" -- to check on things. 

I've worked extensively in the service area and have never once seen the head/vp/director of a service department actually come and see the operational elements of the frontline. They have managers and team leaders for that.

That a board member even needs to go down to check out the football department is extremely worrying.

Goodwin and the entire department is on notice. Make no mistake.

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Was good to hear from Goodwin that the objective was to win as many games as possible & best 22 would be picked for each game squashing any thoughts of tanking etc 

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We would be stupid not to “list manage” the season out. We would be stupider to declare publicly that we will be doing so. Learn from your mistakes kids! 

No club goes from prelims to bottom 4 and doesn’t have an internal review take place. Just because we don’t leak information anymore doesn’t mean we don’t do anything behind closed doors. 

I would be shocked if we retain more than 20% of our assistant coaches heading into next year. 

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4 minutes ago, Demonsone said:

Was good to hear from Goodwin that the objective was to win as many games as possible & best 22 would be picked for each game squashing any thoughts of tanking etc 

Tanking is not a factor anymore now that the priority pick is not auto-granted. 

The top 5 picks will all be elite prospects. It's a raffle who will turn out the best.

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2 hours ago, rjay said:

Sounds like Goodwin who thought we didn't need to review the prelim.

Glenn, we need a review...

I would be very surprised if there are not changes made after this season on the back of a review.

What sort of review do you want rjay?  A REVIEW? explanation? All clubs have reviews at the end of the season. Be specific.

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5 minutes ago, nosoupforme said:

What sort of review do you want rjay?  A REVIEW? explanation? All clubs have reviews at the end of the season. Be specific.

Read my comments on the Writing on the Wall thread. I give a bit more detail there.

 

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2 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

Injuries are not an excuse is the standard response.

injuries are an excuse when you have a finite number of players on your list, 15 players go in to post season surgery & miss large parts of the the pre-season, you suffer so many injuries during the season your VFL team is depleted to 3 AFL listed players for a game.

We stood no chance.

i don’t like Pert and think he cause unnecessary damage internally but nothing can be blamed on him at this stage.

Can you elaborate on the internal damage Wrecker? 

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3 hours ago, DeeZee said:

So the plan is to keep playing injured players till the end of the season then put them in for surgeries from which they will come back not quite ready for round one.

Groundhog day.

Think it is more about not appearing to be tanking 

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4 hours ago, Jaded said:

We would be stupid not to “list manage” the season out. We would be stupider to declare publicly that we will be doing so. Learn from your mistakes kids! 

No club goes from prelims to bottom 4 and doesn’t have an internal review take place. Just because we don’t leak information anymore doesn’t mean we don’t do anything behind closed doors. 

I would be shocked if we retain more than 20% of our assistant coaches heading into next year. 

The season was well and truely gone after the Richmond game, playing for meaningless wins now would be the epitome of stupidity.

Probably why Tmac, Jeffy, Wagner bros,  are still getting a run and Pruess is not being picked. 

Would also be shocked if we dont [censored] all the assistants off bar Greg Stafford.

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5 hours ago, Win4theAges said:

The season was well and truely gone after the Richmond game, playing for meaningless wins now would be the epitome of stupidity.

Probably why Tmac, Jeffy, Wagner bros,  are still getting a run and Pruess is not being picked. 

Would also be shocked if we dont [censored] all the assistants off bar Greg Stafford.

lol do you seriously believe the reason Preuss isn't selectes, is for the sake of list management? 

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8 hours ago, Hell Bent said:

Can you elaborate on the internal damage Wrecker? 

Well before Pert was at Melbourne I heard from a passionate Collingwood supporter, who both he and his wife had seperate business dealings with Pert, that Pert was toxic. I won’t give specific details but I was given them at the time and they were damning.

Pert leaves Collingwood and all of a sudden they are unified. He comes to Melbourne and...

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11 hours ago, Demonsone said:

Was good to hear from Goodwin that the objective was to win as many games as possible & best 22 would be picked for each game squashing any thoughts of tanking etc 

Except he isnt picking best 22 each week and if he stubbornly refuses to modify his game plan he wont be capable of winning games. So delusion as to the state of affairs! Is that tanking?

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If anyone believes our coaches didn't review the Prelim or our football department isn't being reviewed you are living in Fairy land.  Like any business you are continually reviewing the performance of your departments, each board meeting you will have Pert delivery the admin Josh the footy side and questions will be asked.  Is it an extensive review no but questions will be asked on what is going on what are we doing to turn it around and what additional resources are need to turn it around.

There will be on going discussions about Football department staff , then closer to season end you will make decisions all football staff positions, just like players.

The Prelim, I will guarantee it was extensively reviewed by the coaching staff, players not so much but the coaches would have. 

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Demonland: "Why isn't Pert out here saying things to make us feel better"

Also Demonland: "They're just words, I'm sick of words, I want action, I want results, I've never seen a flag blah blah blah" 

Rinse. Repeat. 

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15 hours ago, Wrecker45 said:

Injuries are not an excuse is the standard response.

injuries are an excuse when you have a finite number of players on your list, 15 players go in to post season surgery & miss large parts of the the pre-season, you suffer so many injuries during the season your VFL team is depleted to 3 AFL listed players for a game.

We stood no chance.

i don’t like Pert and think he cause unnecessary damage internally but nothing can be blamed on him at this stage.

Can’t use injuries as an excuse for the pathetic skill level though Wrecker. 

Auskick sides have more skill than our team atm. 

We are meant to be a professional footy club and our team can’t kick, mark or handball to save itself. 

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Whether you like Pert or not, he has a record of both action and inaction.

Moved Malthouse on when it was the unpopular decision, proved to be the correct call, genuine crackpot that butchered his next coaching job. 

Stuck with Buckley when it was even less popular (partly because of the previous Malthouse decision).

Both calls while against the grain and unpopular at the time, were absolutely the right calls, let's give the bloke a little more than 5 minutes to prove his worth, or not.

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Posted (edited)

Bartlett on SEN this morning:  Bartlett talks with Whateley

Some good questions by Whateley.  I think he read this thread beforehand 😉  Good to see Bartlett on the front foot and talk to fans thru the media.

-He said our position is we will go out to win every game.  imv said to deflect any ref to 'Tanking'.  But that still leaves the door open to prepare players and the team for 2020. 

-He said definitely won't have a formal external review.  I'm ok with that.  I think Pert is in a good position to do it.  In fact, I think he started about round 3. 

Given the Board only meets monthly I would say the staff and structure decisions needed have been or are being presented.  We, supporters need to wait till August-October to see the outcomes.  Assistant coaches must be advised by end of Aug if not needed.  Other staff, including non-coaching football staff in the months after.

Something that might restrict our ability to make changes to the assistant coaches is the end of contract dates.  We aren't in a position to payout contacts.  A move to fill a football department vacancy until their contract expires is feasible. 

Edited by Lucifer's Hero
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26 minutes ago, Captain_Jack said:

Whether you like Pert or not, he has a record of both action and inaction.

Moved Malthouse on when it was the unpopular decision, proved to be the correct call, genuine crackpot that butchered his next coaching job. 

Stuck with Buckley when it was even less popular (partly because of the previous Malthouse decision).

Both calls while against the grain and unpopular at the time, were absolutely the right calls, let's give the bloke a little more than 5 minutes to prove his worth, or not.

Was it the right call though? 

Malthouse would argue that his tenure was destabilised and usurped while on the cusp of back to back flags and shot down in the midst of what might’ve become an even longer premiership window than that.

Buckley has won nothing yet.

Mick may be a self-obsessed SOB but that “crackpot” has three flags in his trophy cabinet. N.Buckley has 0.

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As much as we all think hearing from the CEO would make a difference, I think it's a good sign Pert is staying behind the scenes a bit more given some of the criticism about his time at Collingwood was that he made it about himself too often. Perhaps shows that he's learned from his time there and has put those lessons into practice with us.

Failure can be a valuable experience if learned from.

 

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25 minutes ago, Lucifer's Hero said:

He said definitely won't have a formal external review.  I'm ok with that.  I think Pert is in a good position to do it.  In fact, I think he started about round 3. 

I'm not ok with that.

We need an external person to come in and review everything that has happened this year.

Pert is part of the club now and needs to also come under review even though he has only been here for just the year.

It has been a disappointing year, we need to look at everything.

We can't get half way through next year and realise we've made mistakes.

We need to shake out any problem areas asap and get on with it.

 

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