POST MATCH DISCUSSION: Melbourne vs Richmond - JLT 01

[Wrecker45 3,378]

T Mac is one of the best runners at the club.

if his toe or knee is causing him grief he shouldn’t be playing.

If he is, as I suspec,  just short of a run there is absolutely nothing to worry about.

[Engorged Onion 9,239]

Just now, Wrecker45 said:

T Mac is one of the best runners at the club.

if his toe or knee is causing him grief he shouldn’t be playing.

If he is, as I suspec,  just short of a run there is absolutely nothing to worry about.

My standpoint is this ...

TMAC doesn't need to press for a round 1 slot - he will have it.

TMAC is pragmatic as [censored]

TMAC understands JLT is meaningless

TMAC don't give a damn about Rance and having to prove himself....

[ArtificialWisdom 3,844]

4 minutes ago, Stormy Dee said:

His disposal was not first rate. At times it was poor and direct to opposition players.

His ball use by foot is certainly closer to a Tyson than a Salem. But he can also use both sides of his body pretty well which I think balances that out a bit. There was a couple of howlers in a row on his left in the 2nd qtr but it was the first real hitout so I wouldn't stress too much.

[hemingway 7,583]

1 hour ago, Deeminion said:

Was anybody else concerned with Tommy Mac chasing or lack thereof. There were a few instances where Rances played on from a mark and just waltzed past Tom. I know it was hot and just a praccy match but I expect a bit more from the acting captain.

Is there cause for concern regarding the procedure that he just had?

Stood behind the Melbourne goal end each quarter. 

Both he and the Weed had trouble finding the pill.

On most occasions Rance who has a great leap and anticipation, was able to punch the ball away with the support of other defenders. Tigers were quick to get a couple of guys back when Dees were attacking. Our ball movement was poor. 

The ball came down haphazardly and slowly on most occasions, unlike what we saw in the two winning finals. Both Tom and the Weed tended not to lead but drop back where they were covered. Both seemed easy to brush aside and were light in the body compared to their opponents. They are stick thin. 

Tommy would stick his arms up, which were easily knocked away from the pill. He did not get off the ground on too many occasions. I wondered if this was due to his foot/toe.  

[Smokey 4,112]

54 minutes ago, Macca said:

He was under pressure a lot which isn't his fault either. Under the circumstances I thought his disposal was first rate.

Now he could just handpass it like Clarry does but we need to get the ball forward quickly from a congested situation

The real issue is that all our forwards need to relish and fight for the front position because a rushed kick often falls short.

Disposal efficiency stats are often a misnomer ... the eyes have it along with an understanding of the modern game.

I haven't even seen the stats mate, I watched the game and have noted that his disposal could slightly be cleaned up. Slightly is the keyword, I didn't suggest it was poor by any stretch. 

Believe or not - I understand the modern game and have 2 fully functional eyes. 

[faultydet 7,593]

The most surprising, and pleasing thing for me was the effort of Keilty.

Is that the standard of play that he puts together at Casey regularly? He did some bloody impressive things.

 

 

[Smokey 4,112]

16 minutes ago, faultydet said:

The most surprising, and pleasing thing for me was the effort of Keilty.

Is that the standard of play that he puts together at Casey regularly? He did some bloody impressive things.

 

 

Admittedly I don't follow Casey that much, but he has seemingly come out of nowhere and showed plenty 

[Macca 16,173]

1 hour ago, Smokey said:

I haven't even seen the stats mate, I watched the game and have noted that his disposal could slightly be cleaned up. Slightly is the keyword, I didn't suggest it was poor by any stretch. 

Believe or not - I understand the modern game and have 2 fully functional eyes. 

And I just gave you the reason - he often disposed of the ball under extreme pressure. 

So it stands to reason that when disposing of the ball under extreme pressure,  the player can only do his best.  If you want pinpoint accuracy from those situations then you're a hard-marker.

Our problem this year won't be the likes of Brayshaw ... we absolutely need a fully functioning forward line with our forwards displaying the basics as well as top skills.

By the way,  Brayshaw often favours his left side to wrong-foot the opposition but even with taking that option,  he was still (yesterday) under a lot of pressure on numerous occasions. 

If he goes to his preferred side he may not get the kick away at all ... and again,  our players forward of the ball need to be reading the play and position themselves accordingly.

Edited March 4, 2019 by Macca

[Macca 16,173]

1 hour ago, Stormy Dee said:

His disposal was not first rate. At times it was poor and direct to opposition players.

The way I saw it a lot of his kicks were under extreme pressure but he (Brayshaw) was still trying to direct the ball to the 'hot' spot ... only for that area to be often occupied by Richmond players.

If our forwards stopped trying to take the easy option of leading to the boundary line or playing from behind,  they may have been on the end of those rushed kicks to the hot spot area.  Basic footy 101. 

We made it easy for their backman by not sticking to the basics ... and Brayshaw often had no option but to kick it forward when under pressure - the other option is to get caught in possession or to handpass it to another player who could end up under the same pressure.

Surround Brayshaw with the 9 good players who missed yesterday and you'll see his disposal efficiency skyrocket.  By the way,  Brayshaw doesn't quite have the turn of foot that Martin/Dangerfield/Judd has but he's a different sort of player.

We need our forwards to play in front and lead to space or to the hot spot ... cause & effect at play here except Brayshaw isn't the cause of ineffectual forward play.  We need to own the hot spot if we're to dominate games.  Constantly leading to the boundary line just makes it easy for opposition backmen.  

If our forward line fires,  we can win big.  The midfield isn't the issue nor is the backline a problem either (with the acquisition of Lever & May)

Edited March 4, 2019 by Macca

[Drunkn167 5,093]

51 minutes ago, faultydet said:

The most surprising, and pleasing thing for me was the effort of Keilty.

Is that the standard of play that he puts together at Casey regularly? He did some bloody impressive things.

Yeah. There is s a reason he was in the top 6, 8 out of the last 10 games for Casey last year. He puts in a lot of effort and is usually a very solid player in the VFL. Hopefully he gets an opportunity sometime this year and we can see if he can really handle it at the top level.

[ding 5,126]

After having a read through this thread, most of what i was going to say has been covered. I found that standing behind the goals meant that you miss a lot more than you could see on TV. Especially when the ball was mostly at the Tigers scoring end for so long, and i chose to be at our end. Oh well.

The main points to stand out for me from the game were, in no particular order

*The playing surface was in spectacular condition.

*Considering the amount of time the ball went inside Richmonds Fwd 50 with little to no pressure, i thought our makeshift backline did quite well. That felt like a much bigger loss than 2 goals.

*Preuss has major timing issues with his jump at ball-ups. He is a monster though.

*Clarry and Angus are Manna from heaven. Ball magnets both, although Brayshaw needs to clean up his disposal on the left foot.

*I thought Jeffy was having a real crack until injured. I have a couple of images from that actual contest, but not on the actual dislocation. One Richmond player patted him on the backside on his way off the ground which was nice to see. Poor bugger must have been in a lot of pain.

*JKH was better than just ok. His improvement has been noticeable and he is now a genuine depth option, not just an emergency backup IMO.

*Jordan showed some promise. Not as lost as i expected him to be.

*Charlie Spargo might not be the most skilled, but his work ethic was really good. Did quite a bit more off the ball than i expected. Not as bad a day as some posts might have indicated.

*Harmes is in for another great year. I love his attack on the ball, and oppo players. 

*Trac doesnt do much off the ball, but get him in a pack and his hands are almost as fast as Olivers. Get him fit and stick him in the guts. Much better there than deep forward, as his set shots are still very ordinary. Room for improvement, but he has the tools.

*One bloke behind the goals at the MFC end was wearing a Dec Keilty badge... the only one on his jumper.  Keilty and Harrison were much better than i expected. Decs work in particular was quite nice.  

*Tmac must have been a bit crook, as he had so little impact and looked really flat. Just a bad day for him.

*Weid is much bigger than last year, but seeing him up close right next to Rance showed how much he still has to bulk up. Very big difference in size and strength was obvious. Even Tmac looked skinny next to Rance.

*Cotchin is a D-bag. A big one.

*Nev is a champ, and i was a pathetic fanboi when he let me take a photo of him with my daughter. I was like a giddy little pre-teen at their first concert.

Nothing lost yesterday other than the injury to Jeff. Hope he makes it back soon. The margin should have been much greater, but with our outs i didn't care one bit. Finally, our pre-season form really IS irrelevant.

Edited March 4, 2019 by ding
The usual typos

[Macca 16,173]

1 hour ago, Wrecker45 said:

T Mac is one of the best runners at the club.

if his toe or knee is causing him grief he shouldn’t be playing.

If he is, as I suspec,  just short of a run there is absolutely nothing to worry about.

T-Mac was cut out of the game yesterday by a very good player in Rance ... with Hogan gone T-Mac is now almost certainly the main focus for opposition teams.  He'll be double-teamed as well as not many teams have a backman as good as Rance.

We really missed Melksham yesterday but we need Weideman to stand up and become a consistent 2nd tall option.  If he does that,  opposition teams will have 2 talls to concern themselves with. 

If both talls fire along with Petracca & Melsham,  we're more than half-way there.  The small forward and/or the 5th forward option can shine if the base is strong.

 

[Demonland 64,416]

8 minutes ago, ding said:

*One bloke behind the goals at the MFC end was wearing a Dec Keilty badge... the only one on his jumper.  Keilty and Harrison were much better than i expected. Decs work in particular was quite nice.  

@Drunkn167 ???

[Drunkn167 5,093]

Just now, Demonland said:

@Drunkn167 ???

Hahaha no I'm not that much of a nuffie. Although Dec has done some work with the cheer squad so he has a lot of fans amongst that group. 

[hemingway 7,583]

10 minutes ago, ding said:

After having a read through this thread, most of what i was going to say has been covered. I found that standing behind the goals meant that you miss a lot more than you could see on TV. Especially when the ball was mostly at the Tigers scoring end for so long, and i chose to be at our end. Oh well.

The main points to stand out for me from the game were, in no particular order

*The playing surface was in spectacular condition.

*Considering the amount of time the ball went inside Richmonds Fwd 50 with little to no pressure, i thought out makeshift backline did quite well. That felt like a much bigger loss than 2 goals.

*Preuss has major timing issues with his jump at ball-ups. He is a monster though.

*Clarry and Angus are Manna from heaven. Ball magnets both, although Brayshaw needs to clean up his disposal on the left foot.

*I thought Jeffy was having a real crack until injured. I have a couple of images from that actual contest, but not on the actual dislocation. One Richmond player patted him on the backside on his way off the ground which was nice to see. Poor bugger must have been in a lot of pain.

*JKH was better than just ok. His improvement has been noticeable and he is now a genuine depth option, not just an emergency backup IMO.

*Jordan showed some promise. Not as lost as i expected him to be.

*Charlie Spargo might not be the most skilled, but his work ethic was really good. Did quite a bit more off the ball than i expected. Not as bad a day as some posts might have indicated.

*Harmes is in for another great year. I love his attack on the ball, and oppo players. 

*Trac doesnt do much off the ball, but get him in a pack and his hands are almost as fast as Olivers. Get him fit and stick him in the guts. Much better there than deep forward, as his set shots are still very ordinary. Room for improvement, but he has the tools.

*One bloke behind the goals at the MFC end was wearing a Dec Keilty badge... the only one on his jumper.  Keilty and Harrison were much better than i expected. Decs work in particular was quite nice.  

*Tmac must have been a bit crook, as he had so little impact and looked really flat. Just a bad day for him.

*Weid is much bigger than last year, but seeing him up close right next to Rance showed how much he still has to bulk up. Very big difference in size and strength was obvious. Even Tmac looked skinny next to Rance.

*Cotchin is a D-bag. A big one.

*Nev is a champ, and i was a pathetic fanboi when he let me take a photo of him with my daughter. I was like a giddy little pre-teen at their first concert.

Nothing lost yesterday other than the injury to Jeff. Hope he makes it back soon. The margin should have been much greater, but with our outs i didn't care one bit. Finally, our pre-season form really IS irrelevant.

great summary ding , and I agree the surface of the ground was superb, I suspect better than the AFL grounds they play on.

the locals should be very proud.

[ding 5,126]

4 minutes ago, Drunkn167 said:

Hahaha no I'm not that much of a nuffie. Although Dec has done some work with the cheer squad so he has a lot of fans amongst that group. 

Mate, if my brother was on an AFL list i would have his number on my back, his badge on my jumper and a signed poster on my wall. 

Bugger what anyone thought.

[Demonland 64,416]

7 minutes ago, Drunkn167 said:

Hahaha no I'm not that much of a nuffie. Although Dec has done some work with the cheer squad so he has a lot of fans amongst that group. 

Nothing Nuffie about supporting the family.

[Drunkn167 5,093]

35 minutes ago, ding said:

Mate, if my brother was on an AFL list i would have his number on my back, his badge on my jumper and a signed poster on my wall. 

Bugger what anyone thought.

I do wear a Melbourne cap with his signature on it but that's as far as I'll go.

[Demonland 64,416]

3 minutes ago, Drunkn167 said:

I do wear a Melbourne cap with his signature on it but that's as far as I'll go.

You asked your brother for his signature? ?

[dieter 3,325]

8 minutes ago, Demonland said:

You asked your brother for his signature? ?

Dare I say it: well, someone had to? No, I didn't say that, it was meant in fun. I've spoken to Keilty during a break in a practice match when he was injured. He is a terrifically amiable young man and I wish him all the best. It would be great to see him asked to step and and see him perform well.

[nomed 107]

9 hours ago, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

I'd just about bet my house on him playing somewhere in the ballpark of 8 - 16 games.  It's not about him being the best ruckman in the league and more about the chop out that he will give Max.  Max is an athletic freak for a guy his size, but many of the teams we will play this year will play two against him and he will be shot by Rd 15 if we don't provide some way of giving him a break.

Preuss is a very different beast to Max (with beast being an appropriate way to describe him), but he can still add heaps of value to the team.  If he can get in there and smash a few bodies around like big Mumford does for GWS, then that would be handy.

Conversely he has spent quite a few years on an AFL list to accumulate all those 8 games, with Goldstein who was a pretty capable ruck being there as a mentor.  Still rucks do typically take a lot longer to develop and hopefully the change of scenery will do him good.

Jake Spencer 2.0?

[DV8 2,271]

22 hours ago, Diamond_Jim said:

they did have 12 more scoring shots....

the final score flattered us

Workrate (Re the scoring Numbers) is only a question mark... as we really just wanted to put competitive miles kilometers into our legs, under contested pressure,  to see how we look...  and to study the opposition.

Mostly a fitness blowout,  pre H&A

 

Next week is a serious hitout.

[DV8 2,271]

21 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

The reason for concern was from about 10 minutes in to the 2nd quarter until 3/4 time we couldn't lay a glove on the Tigers. There's areas we should be much stronger in come the real stuff - midfield depth, ruck, almost the whole backline, but there's no excuse to keep turning the ball over out of the backline without even trying to switch or counter, to not even be close to locking the ball up forward and to struggle with simple things like not committing 2 players to tackle one opponent with the ball and leaving a free option. The middle quarters were like the Prelim last year in terms of style.

IF any of our players were under MisGuided thinking,  that things will just go our way from 2019 forward... then I hope that mindset has been opened a new viewing window, with a can opener.

Time now to start to work harder again.

 

And I hope the suger-free challenge....  spreads across our other midfielders. no names.

[DV8 2,271]

21 hours ago, Skuit said:

@ding - do you have any hi-res close-ups of Cristian Petracca's waist?

 

22 hours ago, ding said:

[DV8 2,271]

20 hours ago, Deestar9 said:

  20 hours ago, buck_nekkid said:

LoL... throwing weight's around, literally.