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Sole Captaincy?

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Jones came 4th in our B&F and is an incredible (and underated) endurance athlete

Viney struggles to stay on the park.

Stick with the two. There is no downside.

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As much as I'd love to have Viney as sole captain - it doesn't make much sense until we can be sure he can stay uninjured for a decent period of time. 

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1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

 

Stick with the two. There is no downside.

Agree Jr

And on the flipside there is possible downsides to taking the captaincy off him eg sending a signal his career is coming to an end, annoying his senior (and no doubt loyal) colleagues etc

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We have to handle Jones final years with respect and integrity. He deserves nothing less, and that also goes for the captaincy issue. Nothing to be gained and possibly some damage by making Viney sole skipper. 

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I think it is time to continue the changing of the guard which started when Viney became co-captain.  We need to enable the young group to take us to our next flag. Viney sole captain makes sense to me as he is our best leader. Jones VC with Lever/Gawn as LG.

Jones is legend of the MFC but is past his best although still playing good footy on the wing. it is no insult to pass the baton to a young leader when you are in the last years of your career. He should be proud that he is passing the baton when we are in such good shape.  he will still be there to lead and to captain should viney be unlucky with injury again. It will also give Jones the chance to concentrate on his game without the weight of captaincy

I like the idea of one leader at the top and have never taken to the co-captaincy where a final decision is not always easy and quick to get

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11 minutes ago, DubDee said:

I think it is time to continue the changing of the guard which started when Viney became co-captain.  We need to enable the young group to take us to our next flag. Viney sole captain makes sense to me as he is our best leader. Jones VC with Lever/Gawn as LG.

Jones is legend of the MFC but is past his best although still playing good footy on the wing. it is no insult to pass the baton to a young leader when you are in the last years of your career. He should be proud that he is passing the baton when we are in such good shape.  he will still be there to lead and to captain should viney be unlucky with injury again. It will also give Jones the chance to concentrate on his game without the weight of captaincy

I like the idea of one leader at the top and have never taken to the co-captaincy where a final decision is not always easy and quick to get

Good line of argument but still leave alone for 2019. Use the season to evaluate for 2020 and beyond. Jonesy may well wish to handover end of next season if he is struggling for form or a place in the side. 

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3 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Jones came 4th in our B&F and is an incredible (and underated) endurance athlete

Viney struggles to stay on the park.

Stick with the two. There is no downside.

The only downside I can think of is the captaincy may make Goodwin and co more reluctant to drop him than they otherwise might be when it gets to that point, but given Jones’ finish in the B&F, that point is probably further away than many think.

That’s just me trying to come up with a counter-argument; I agree with your post.

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If we are going to have one captain, surely it should be Jones. Viney is fantastic when fit, but he is no good to anyone when he is playing ten games a year. At least Jones plays and trains with his teammates each week.

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Joint captaincy fine if they could be relied upon to play at their best. Trouble is there is some doubt about injury or form.

Should Tom Mc Donald be added to the mix?

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Its working fine, no need for change yet. Just keep revevaluating at the beginning of each season.

Edited by Win4theAges
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Gawn/Viney as co-captains for mine. We want to be able to play our best 22 all year. Nathan will still be voted vice-captain and deservedly so.

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I think the fact he finished 4th in the b&f indicates the coach thinks he is comfortably best 22, the assessment of some erstwhile do posters notwithstanding. 

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33 minutes ago, binman said:

I think the fact he finished 4th in the b&f indicates the coach thinks he is comfortably best 22, the assessment of some erstwhile do posters notwithstanding. 

A year is a long time in football and if we're serious about a flag in 2019, we won't want to be playing players if their form dips, just because they're a leader. We've come further than that. 

I concur with Jay Clark (dangerous, I know) in that this needs to be handled delicately. 

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Of course it has to be handled 'delicately' AF  and I'm sure it will be.

I saw Jones slowing in the last couple of games - as he did last year. 

His day s are numbered and we will be looking to Angus Brayshaw for our next captain. 

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Co captains worked well this year. Let Viney get a full year playing 20 plus games, under his belt before being the only captain in 2020.

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12 hours ago, Smokey said:

As much as I'd love to have Viney as sole captain - it doesn't make much sense until we can be sure he can stay uninjured for a decent period of time. 

It's too soon just Yet, for Viney as soul captain.

And there is no reason why someone else may pop up for leadership stakes,  during the next 12 months.

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There is a time and place for everything and l believe it is not the time to be making any changes to the format or standing down a captain. In this case it would be Jones who in the bad and gloomy  times he stood out and led from the front and became our loyal Melbourne champion. ,He stayed to make us better when he could have left us for a better club with a chance to play finals at his peak.       One Captain  one VC and one DVC what is wrong with that format? .  For now the two are good for each other and while Jonesy can hold his own l wouldn't tamper with it.  They both deserve to hold that Premiership most of all Nathan Jones.

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If anything I'd lean towards keeping the two co-captains we have, mostly out of respect for Jones.  Even if he were to drop down the list in terms of his onfeild performance, I think his on-feild leadership qualities would be worthwhile keeping him jointly at the helm.  Having said that, his onfeild leadership has never been obviously brilliant to the naked eye of the average supporter (including myself), in the same way as someone who more clearly plays 'the onfeild general' type of role like a Hodge or even perhaps Lewis type of player (though I think Lewis has actually credited O Mac as playing that role dowm back for us).  The one invaluable leadership quality I think Jones does have in spades is the 'never say die' lead by example aspect and it's clear he has the respect of the playing group, which is hugely important.

As a small asides, a few of my favorite moments of our finals victories this year we're watching Viney and Jones walking side by side, leading the team down the internal passageways of the G and into the rooms in victory.  Was great to see the reward for Jones and Jack Viney looked every bit comfortable and in his rightful place along side Jones as captain of a victorious MFC.  I could handle watching alot more moments like that in the next few years.

Whilst I think  a lot of people could struggle to know when to let go of the captancy, I get the impression that Jones will probably concede the role himself when the time is right.  Will probably make it easier knowing that he has a ready made replacement to take on the role in his own right, waiting in the wings with Jack.

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Jay Clark reported a refutation that the Hogan deal wasn't 8 years, but 3 though. Seemed to have taken our side and reported against the WA media lies.

Edited by John Demonic

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The operative word in captaincy transfer is  'yet'.  I am a firm believer that Jack should be the sole leader of the Demons at some stage.

However, there are human relationships to manage. We, of all the clubs in the AFL, should be aware of the importance of treating long term servants with respect before calls are made.

 

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I am ordinarily against a co-captain model but, in this case, it would be befitting for Jones to retain a part of the captaincy so that he might be the one to raise the cup should we achieve the ultimate victory.

To deny him the possibility of this major honor would be intolerable given his dedication, service and leadership over the bad years. No one in our history (other than Robbie) would deserve this more.

Viney (or whoever) can then focus on their own games and provide the lift in spirit when needed. We should actively seek and develop multiple leaders who can provide dynamic on field leadership and/or cool heads and on field direction. 

 

 

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Part of being a leader is knowing not only when it’s your time to lead but when it’s your time to step aside. I can’t see the club making a change for next season but it has to be Jones last in an official leadership  role. You don’t go from captain back to vice captain, if anything you from captain to purely playing and being there as a mentor to your successor. For me this situation feels weird because pre Roos, Jones was a rock in our team, he always led the way even though he wasn’t our most talented player, we were getting flogged every week and was overlooked for Grimes/Trengove. Over the last couple of seasons he seems to go missing in the big games. I hope this time next year we don’t have another Grimes debacle all over again.

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