Changes v Hawthorn - Semi Final

[The Stewster 218]

1 hour ago, Demon17 said:

Spargo did a couple of good things in tight traffic early showing he wasn't overawed for an 18 year old and remained composed in defence zone. The current lineup got the team into final - west coats game etc and all deserve to remain in barring injury. - Tyson included .

I've watched the game a couple of times, Spargo is doing a bit of work off the ball to clear a path for the ball winners. It might be just a small bump or shove here or there, but enough to prevent the opposition tackling the ball winner and help the clearance. It's small stuff but enough to keep Jeffy out. 

[Miles from Nowhere 199]

The problem for Jeffy is that the version most people want in is 2016 not 2018.

[dazzledavey36 48,610]

16 minutes ago, Jaded said:

I would love nothing more than for Weids to give him a bath. Hate the turncoat. 

Me too, absolutely despise him as a footballer and a person.

[My name is legion 158]

36 minutes ago, Wollongong Demon said:

The only change I would want is a goal sneak that can kick a bag. Part of me longs for the return of Jeff Garlett but his form this year except for the lions game has been way down. I recall him kicking 4 against Hawthorn 2 years ago and he has the ability to explode.

Dom was  very good prior to breaking his arm. Spargo although not a prolific possession player has been good with disposal and helped set up several goals. Unlike JG his chasing and pressure is his signature game. Alas JG hasnt had as much game time so all up I guess, no change for me. Perhaps Hannan will add 4. He has the ability and last week was his first back.

Would like to see Vanders or Oliver in the goal square for a few minutes each quarter. Great to see Weid playing so well and congrats to Goody for persisting with him. He may not be playing if Hogan wasnt injured but all of his prior games haved helped his confidence. Some intense goal practice for Petracca is advised.

Win or lose it is clear as day that this group of mostly young players is going to the top for quite a while. Go Dees.

Not necessarily.

There are multiple examples in recent years where a team is up one year and down the next.

[DV8 2,271]

23 hours ago, A F said:

Fritsch's game, much like his past month or so, was error-riddled again. I'm sure he was at one point, but I can't remember him being clean with the footy on Friday. Seems overawed by playing in the back half to me, but without Lever, he is needed to intercept and kick. Let's hope he remains calmer this week.

And no change for me. Bring the same pressure and kick straighter and we comfortably account for the scum.

He's tired, fatigued. mishandling ball, and kicks. But he's getting to the right places and contests.

[rpfc 27,380]

1 hour ago, Jaded said:

I would love nothing more than for Weids to give him a bath. Hate the turncoat. 

We didn’t want to keep him and got Brayshaw out of him...

 

[kev martin 8,804]

12 hours ago, dpositive said:

Haven't seen any mention of Pedersen.

i would consider his older harder body more value than the lighter Spargo who is a beauty but can be rested for future.

Pedo can play forward or back to relieve Weds or Fritsch who are younger and lighter.

000

• Demon
•  
• 
• Members
•  695
• 164 posts

•  
•  
•  #100

Posted Saturday at 10:58 PM

We also have Cam Pederson if we need some height and a strong body

[Fat Tony 4,348]

Spargo is a good young player but lacks the body strength required at this stage. IMO we would be better off with JKH coming in. A case could also be made for Hunt, Joel Smith or even Vince being the inclusion if he is fit.

We also need to think about how we tag Issac Smith this week. Tyson on the wing is not a good match up and he could be omitted due to the opposition.

[What 18,810]

36 minutes ago, rpfc said:

We didn’t want to keep him and got Brayshaw out of him...

 

Far out.     We turned James Frawley into Angus freakin' Brayshaw.

Frawley is now a cooked 30 year old fossil whos lost all his dash and Angus is a 22 year old kid whos has had a brilliant season and just dominated his first ever final.

Let the good times roll, folks.

[Jaded No More 57,566]

1 hour ago, rpfc said:

We didn’t want to keep him and got Brayshaw out of him...

 

Sure. We won.

Still hate him!

[Deespicable 2,538]

"We didn't see that coming."

It was the most memorable line of Mark Neeld's tenure and funniest depending on how you do your humour. It came after a 79-point Rd 1 smashing at the MCG to Port Adelaide in 2013 and followed a dismal pre-season where similar beltings had ensued. Blind Freddie could have seen it coming, but not Mr Neeld.

Simon Goodwin faces a similar moment in the next two games - assuming we survive the first one, which I think we will.

The bandwagon is rolling and the wave of euphoria is hitting everyone - even our coach. It was the same in 1987 and it was similar for the Dogs in 2016 and Tigers of 2017.

One of the hardest things for any coach is to make changes in September unless they are forced on them. The side's momentum is growing, everyone is putting in and it's blood hard to make a tough call on a player for team balance. You got a glimpse of how hard it was when JKH was left out for the skipper and Goody's presser became a virtual JKH eulogy.

Last week he must have been secretly hoping Dom Tyson hand wouldn't have come up, just so that he could make the call that he wanted to do - the Joel Smith call. But then the Cats realised that Esava wasn't ready and pulled the pin on a third tall forward and the Joel Smith call wasn't needed.

The next two week's Goody has no such luxury. He can stick with the status quo and if he loses a big forward or defender (injuries do happen, just ask Brad Sheppard or Ben Stratton), he then has to put up with a wave of criticism about why he didn't have a back-up plan. Of course if we win, all is forgiven. But if we lose, we all jump up and down like armchair experts do in between stubbies and say: "You'd think he would have organised that better."

Making the situation worse is that Hawthorn and West Coast have adopted big sides - we aren't playing a bunch of pesky little midgets like the Tigers.

The Hawks will have Roughead, Gunston and most likely Schoenmakers (Ceglar will be chopped) for us to combat. The Eagles go even bigger - Kennedy, Vardy and Darling.

Now I know we all love Jetta and Hibberd, but seriously they cannot be expected to outmark giants and in Jetta's case he has already got key match-ups awaiting him - Breust and Rioli.

So with Frosty (Gunston and Kennedy) and O-Mac (Roughy and Darling) already occupied, Goody is wanting to take out insurance more than the Indian call centre operator that rings me almost every week.

Joel Smith is his man and for those of you who have forgotten what he was doing just five weeks ago before his injury, he not only solves the height problem, he also is quick and loves to tackle, something which is critical at this time of year and throwing forward to a potential Tiges game, imperative. Sure he is inexperienced, sure he is not as precise as Jordy or Christian with his kicking, but he is needed. He brings enough to the table that makes him a MUST in.

But we are talking finals now. With no injuries, how do you make room for him?

That's what the coach is there for with their selection panel to help advise. And it won't be easy, just as it wasn't pulling the pin on our underacheiving golden boy Jack Watts at the end of last season, although I suspect Goody will now say that was way easier for him.

To me there are three options, but some of you have more. It should be noted that none of the following players deserve to be omitted in normal circumstances and in the event of injury, they may yet get another crack this year. In the meantime one of them will have to console themselves with a leading role in claiming Casey's first premiership. It is a tough call. 

1) Bayley Fristch - No I hear some of you say. Clearly Smith will slot into our back seven and there's only one player currently back there that can make room - Fritta. I watched him train last week and  he was going head-t-head with Jack Viney for much of it and I was so impressed with how his game had developed physically this season. But he is not quite tall enough for the role that we need down back so he has to either be omitted or returned to the wing spot where he performed so admirably mid-season. He's also a first-year player which means it's easier to tell him he's out and explain it. But when you weigh it up, it would be a massive call to omit him. 

2) Charlie Spargo - No I hear some of you say. Our little dynamo teenager has a cult following like Ricky Jackson did in 1987. He's not as quick as Ricky but he's highly-skilled and he's already shown he can read a crumb coming his way better than my dog. Sure his lack of size presents some obstacles, but he's a goer. And taking him out of that role for a defender means we have to send a midfielder forward and which one - Jones (he's too slow, you say), Oliver (why waste your best mid you say). The balance is right with him in the side. Some will argue that he's a kid and will understand his omission better and get over it. But when you weigh it up, it would be a massive call to omit him. 

3) Dom Tyson - No I hear some of you say. Dom has had to adjust to a new role as an outside mid this season and was a big factor in wins against WC and GWS (until Gawny kicked him). Goody decided that against the Cats he would wear an extra mid to give him options against their strength (mids) and he showed amazing courage to get back and play. Had he kicked a couple of his his shots on the run he would have been in our best. His long-kicking can be a huge bonus to our side on the break, but with Viney back, Jonesy now spends more time on the wing and you have to wonder if we can afford that. And Dom has never really shown he can play anywhere else except as a mid, which is why Fritta rotating from wing to high half-forward is appealing. Already Trac has been returned to more a permanent forward role because Viney, Harmes, Angus and Olly are first choice centre square options. Can we afford to play an extra mid and forsake either Smith or Spargo or Fritta? Can we afford to not have him linking up so well with deft handballs. Unlike Spargo and Bayley, he's not a first-year player, so it would not be easy for Goody to justify his omission. But when you weigh it up, it would be a massive call to omit him. 

But one trigger has to be pulled ... anyone think Goody has an easy job?

[chook fowler 18,161]

No dilemma- no change.

[Diamond_Jim 11,670]

An excellent post.... will be interested to see the response of those who are more tactically minded.

The intercepting backman is an important player as is negating that player.

[Jibroni 4,016]

If you want one of your suggested players to be dropped then you do not understand the benefits they bring to the team.

Our defence has been one of the best in the comp over the last month, why change it?

[durango 1,976]

Back in 1984 the reserves coach Ray Jordan had to pick a team to playi in the grand final and he had to make a decision to drop Greg Hucthison who was the Captain of the reserves or some other player. He decided to play the other player and Greg was devastated but knew the team and victory came first.

I was there and the devastation on Greg's face said it all, the coach has to make a decision and live by its consequences.

[forever demons 1,795]

1 hour ago, 000 said:

000

• Demon
•  
• 
• Members
•  695
• 164 posts

•  
•  
•  #100

Posted Saturday at 10:58 PM

We also have Cam Pederson if we need some height and a strong body

noooo love pedo would love see him in but not tall for small

[deanox 8,502]

1 hour ago, Deespicable said:

...

Last week he must have been secretly hoping Dom Tyson hand wouldn't have come up, just so that he could make the call that he wanted to do - the Joel Smith call. 

...

Joel Smith is his man and for those of you who have forgotten what he was doing just five weeks ago before his injury, he not only solves the height problem, he also is quick and loves to tackle, ... He brings enough to the table that makes him a MUST in.

But we are talking finals now. With no injuries, how do you make room for him?

...

To me there are three options, but some of you have more. 

1) Bayley Fristch 

2) Charlie Spargo 

3) Dom Tyson

...

But one trigger (may) has to be pulled ... anyone think Goody has an easy job?

I agree that no one wants to drop any of the players listed,  but I also agree they are probably the ones in the gun if the coach wants to bring Smith in as cover. 

AVB is the other on the list but I think despite the concerns about his disposal, his physical presence sets him above these guys for now as it is a unique and important edge in finals. 

I think Goodwin's plan all along was to only have two talls, with one of them Lever. That took a while to warm up and it will be interesting to see what his thoughts are for 2019 and beyond. Joel Smith was the back up to Lever but couldn't hold down the spot, Frost has been a revelation.

So if in 2019 Goodwin see's Lever replacing Frost we will see no change this week. If he thinks Lever will play with Frost and OMac, then Smith is likely an "in" this week. 

 

As per your discussion, players currently playing that role are Hibberd and Fritsch, and Hibberd is a lock so let's consider Fritsch. He offers more in disposal than Smith and is also more versatile in moving to the wing or forward.  In reality he is being played out of position. 

So if Goodwin wants the third tall in Smith,  Frisch is the swap out of the back 7.

The next question is whether you prefer switching Fritsch forward and dropping Spargo? Personally I think Spargo stays because he adds distance, while Fritsch  players a similar role to Hannan.

Unfortunately I think we are actually an inside midfielder too heavy and Tyson will be squeezed out (edit: this is my opinion on team balance).  I'm not convinced Tyson or Jones can play on a flank/wing, and Oliver/Harmes/Viney/Brayshaw are already competing for those centre spots and are all above Tyson in the order. 

That being said, the arm was agood reason to drop him. Even if declared fit, "we don't want to take the risk in finals" is an easy statement. And they didn't take that option, so I suspect it will be Fritsch for Smith (edit: my opinion of what staff will do). 

Edited September 10, 2018 by deanox

[Diamond_Jim 11,670]

5 minutes ago, deanox said:

  so I suspect it will be Fritsch for Smith. 

Big call and well argued.... would you consider Fritsch to replace Hannan thus freeing up a spot for Smith

[Deespicable 2,538]

Thanks DeanOx,

To me this is the only issue of the week and well worthy of its own topic but the moderators have decided my comments need to be buried amid page 8 of our usual diatribe.

[Deespicable 2,538]

3 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Big call and well argued.... would you consider Fritsch to replace Hannan thus freeing up a spot for Smith

Ad DeanOx says, Hannan and Fritsch are the same sort of player, but Mitch is quicker, Bayley a better mark and more relaxed and developing into a mid - albeit one that has been sent to defence.

I haven't included Mitch in my questions for a reason - it won't happen. The other three may and the fourth option is not even picking Joel. That is why it is such a good debate and I'm sure the selectors get it. 

[Deemania since 56 6,119]

18 hours ago, djr said:

I think Hannan is our x-factor. 

Actually, near goals, Hannan is our X, Y and Z factor!

[In Harmes Way 7,477]

5 hours ago, pinkshark said:

I'm 45ish in age.  I'm running late for work.  I just picked up my boys soft 'inside' footy.  I turned, lowered my eyes, spotted a leading T-Mac coming up the passage way, defensive pressure made me go onto my left, I skewed it...hit my wife's newly potted succulent on her desk, the pot fell, hit her warm coffee, coffee spills, soil mixes in with this, on the macbook...as she is working at her desk she's not happy.  Said I'm worse than the kids, threw the ball at me...I caught it on the turn, I snapped right...GOAL! 

The computer is [censored]!

It’s great you could block the crowd noise out and convert under pressure.

[forever demons 1,795]

the coaches would already know the team

[Superunknown 3,307]

31 minutes ago, deanox said:

I agree that no one wants to drop any of the players listed,  but I also agree they are probably the ones in the gun if the coach wants to bring Smith in as cover. 

AVB is the other on the list but I think despite the concerns about his disposal, his physical presence sets him above these guys for now as it is a unique and important edge in finals. 

I think Goodwin's plan all along was to only have two talls, with one of them Lever. That took a while to warm up and it will be interesting to see what his thoughts are for 2019 and beyond. Joel Smith was the back up to Lever but couldn't hold down the spot, Frost has been a revelation.

So if in 2019 Goodwin see's Lever replacing Frost we will see no change this week. If he thinks Lever will play with Frost and OMac, then Smith is likely an "in" this week. 

 

As per your discussion, players currently playing that role are Hibberd and Fritsch, and Hibberd is a lock so let's consider Fritsch. He offers more in disposal than Smith and is also more versatile in moving to the wing or forward.  In reality he is being played out of position. 

So if Goodwin wants the third tall in Smith,  Frisch is the swap out of the back 7.

The next question is whether you prefer switching Fritsch forward and dropping Spargo? Personally I think Spargo stays because he adds distance, while Fritsch  players a similar role to Hannan.

Unfortunately I think we are actually an inside midfielder too heavy and Tyson will be squeezed out.  I'm not convinced Tyson or Jones can play on a flank/wing, and Oliver/Harmes/Viney/Brayshaw are already competing for those centre spots and are all above Tyson in the order. 

That being said,  the arm was agood reason to drop him. Even if declared fit "we don't want to take the risk in finals" is an easy statement. And they didn't take that option,  so I suspect it will be Fritsch for Smith. 

good insight.

assuming smith in - fritsch to wing , tyson out. (or fritsch fwd and spargie pants out :sadface: )

[kev martin 8,804]

Tough call for the selection committee. Hope they use commonsense and pick the team that matches up to the opposition and the way we want to play.

I get a feeling the players are really supportive of each other. They seem to know that this years hard work has been a team effort, on and off the track. It would be difficult for those not picked or dropped but we will be there and about for a while now. Chances will still be there in the future.

Good work Deespicable.

No change for me.Unless an injury or we need a better balance to dominate the game.

We are rolling.

Go Dees.