Islam in the West

[drysdale demon 4,146]

4 hours ago, Ethan Tremblay said:

Sounds like something a leftie would say... 

(Joking) 

You may be joking, but just for the record I am an atheist, i actually detest any type of religion and have been a conservative voter all my life much to the disgust of all mates from Braybrook where I am originally from.

[Gator 16,891]

16 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

You may be joking, but just for the record I am an atheist, i actually detest any type of religion and have been a conservative voter all my life much to the disgust of all mates from Braybrook where I am originally from.

Just as an aside, atheism is far more dangerous than religion.

If the entire world was atheist it would be bedlam.

[Jara 1,149]

2 minutes ago, ProDee said:

Just as an aside, atheism is far more dangerous than religion.

If the entire world was atheist it would be bedlam.

What religion do you follow?

[drysdale demon 4,146]

1 minute ago, ProDee said:

Just as an aside, atheism is far more dangerous than religion.

If the entire world was atheist it would be bedlam.

I don't care, I have no time for religion at all, if others want to be led like  sheep in any area of religion that is up to them. This is the last post on this matter by me. I just don't wish to see any type of religious or political threads on a football forum.

[Gator 16,891]

Just now, drysdale demon said:

I don't care, I have no time for religion at all, if others want to be led like  sheep in any area of religion that is up to them. This is the last post on this matter by me. I just don't wish to see any type of religious or political threads on a football forum.

I admire tremendously the conservative American Jewish commentator Dennis Prager, who started life on the Left.

He sums up my views on religion and atheism perfectly in this article.  I'm interested in your thoughts on his views.

http://www.dennisprager.com/a-response-to-richard-dawkins-2/

[dieter 3,325]

2 hours ago, drysdale demon said:

You may be joking, but just for the record I am an atheist, i actually detest any type of religion and have been a conservative voter all my life much to the disgust of all mates from Braybrook where I am originally from.

Drysdale, I was brought up in Sunshine. Played under 16 footy for Sunshine against Braybrook. Saturday morning, the stench of the abattoirs hovering. A guy called Peter Ponton, a Braybrook boy, coached me in my last year there.. 

[DEE fence 4,446]

@Mods, i have no trouble with banning political/religious discussion on here, maybe it is the best, is clear mature debate doesn't exists on a forum and people are operating fact free, there is only so long you can play the ball.

God I wish people could see past their fear. 

[Gator 16,891]

8 minutes ago, DaisyDeeciple said:

God I wish people could see past their fear. 

This is a ridiculous assertion.

If you don't think there are literally millions of Islamic followers living in the West who wish harm on Jews, Christians, etc. and who aren't undermining Western civilisation at Mosques you're completely delusional.

Imam Tawhidi knows there are, because he was one of them !!  This is why he fights against radical Islam here in Australia.  It's so important he accepts he's going to get death threats, which he regularly does.

I can only assume the Left are obtuse.  For the sake of soldiers who fought for the freedom you enjoy these types of discussions should never be shut down.

Edited May 30, 2018 by ProDee

[DEE fence 4,446]

19 minutes ago, ProDee said:

This is a ridiculous assertion.

If you don't think there are literally millions of Islamic followers living in the West who wish harm on Jews, Christians, etc. and who aren't undermining Western civilisation at Mosques you're completely delusional.

Imam Tawhidi knows there are, because he was one of them !!  This is why he fights against radical Islam here in Australia.  It's so important he accepts he's going to get death threats, which he regularly does.

I can only assume the Left are obtuse.  For the sake of soldiers who fought for the freedom you enjoy these types of discussions should never be shut down.

It is the fascists that keep me up nights, a bunch of disenfranchised kids don't worry me, but i get that you scare easily. Get worried about something serious, there are about 20 more serious issues in Australia before religious extremism, but quake with fear if you must, nothing i can do to change it, would give you a cuddle if it would help. 

[Gator 16,891]

7 minutes ago, DaisyDeeciple said:

It is the fascists that keep me up nights, a bunch of disenfranchised kids don't worry me, but i get that you scare easily. Get worried about something serious, there are about 20 more serious issues in Australia before religious extremism, but quake with fear if you must, nothing i can do to change it, would give you a cuddle if it would help. 

Leftism is a mental disease.

Good luck.

[Jara 1,149]

32 minutes ago, ProDee said:

Leftism is a mental disease.

Good luck.

This is the new, mature Pro, with the rational conversations he promised us. 

 

Don't worry about him, Daisy - he's a weird little guy who lives in a dark room jumping at shadows. His only communication is with a monitor.

 

Good for a laugh sometimes.

[Trisul 636]

From the timestamp, 10 minutes relevent to the discussion:

 

[Gator 16,891]

Denmark Just Became the Latest European Country to Ban Burqas And Niqabs

Denmark became the latest European country to ban full-face veils on Thursday, effectively outlawing the burqa and niqab worn by some Muslim women.

The country’s parliament voted 75 to 30 to implement a law that prohibits wearing veils in public, the BBC reported. The law does not specifically mention burqas or niqabs, but it is commonly known as the “burqa ban,” according to The Guardian, and is seen as being aimed at Muslim women.

http://time.com/5298049/denmark-ban-burqa-niqab-face-veils/

[Jara 1,149]

11 hours ago, Trisul said:

From the timestamp, 10 minutes relevent to the discussion:

 

Hi Trisul - that was an interesting interview. Ferguson's an eloquent speaker (and writer), for sure. What are the main points you got from it that you think are relevant to our topic? 

[Jara 1,149]

3 hours ago, ProDee said:

Denmark Just Became the Latest European Country to Ban Burqas And Niqabs

Denmark became the latest European country to ban full-face veils on Thursday, effectively outlawing the burqa and niqab worn by some Muslim women.

The country’s parliament voted 75 to 30 to implement a law that prohibits wearing veils in public, the BBC reported. The law does not specifically mention burqas or niqabs, but it is commonly known as the “burqa ban,” according to The Guardian, and is seen as being aimed at Muslim women.

http://time.com/5298049/denmark-ban-burqa-niqab-face-veils/

Maybe I come from the wrong side of town, but I can't remember when I last saw somebody wearing a burqa (except for that neurotic goose Poorline Hanson - what a train wreck she's turning into - you acolytes must be so proud)

 

Plenty of niqabs, of course - almost all worn by international students pumping millions of dollars into our economy. I like them - they're interesting - you learn to read people by the expression in their eyes.

[Gator 16,891]

10 hours ago, Jara said:

Maybe I come from the wrong side of town, but I can't remember when I last saw somebody wearing a burqa (except for that neurotic goose Poorline Hanson - what a train wreck she's turning into - you acolytes must be so proud)

 

Plenty of niqabs, of course - almost all worn by international students pumping millions of dollars into our economy. I like them - they're interesting - you learn to read people by the expression in their eyes.

You like women being oppressed ?

Interesting. 

[Jara 1,149]

Not sure what you're getting at. The ones i meet are the ones fighting for change. Have you ever actually spoken to someone wearing a burqa or even a niqab?

[dieter 3,325]

Ban the Bomb. 

[Gator 16,891]

1 hour ago, Jara said:

Not sure what you're getting at. The ones i meet are the ones fighting for change. Have you ever actually spoken to someone wearing a burqa or even a niqab?

The ones fighting for change do it in a burqa ?  That's an oxymoron.

And no.  I haven't had the pleasure.

[Trisul 636]

On 6/1/2018 at 9:21 PM, Jara said:

Hi Trisul - that was an interesting interview. Ferguson's an eloquent speaker (and writer), for sure. What are the main points you got from it that you think are relevant to our topic? 

Hey Jara.  

I could summarise the interview, but I don't think that's what you're after.  Islam(/Islamism) in the West is a very specific topic, though specifics are actively discouraged these days in favour of the excessive pursuit of tolerance.  (Cue Aristotle)

It requires specific and analytical discussion of sharia and its outcomes without instant dismissal as prejudice, an acknowledgement of the harm that has beset countries and their populace after the ascendancy of Islamic autocracy, and therefore an examination of the clear path to Islamic totalitarianism that is defined within the religion and emboldens extremists and fundamental adherents alike.  

That is what I took from the interview that relates to the topic.  

[DEE fence 4,446]

15 hours ago, Trisul said:

Hey Jara.  

I could summarise the interview, but I don't think that's what you're after.  Islam(/Islamism) in the West is a very specific topic, though specifics are actively discouraged these days in favour of the excessive pursuit of tolerance.  (Cue Aristotle)

It requires specific and analytical discussion of sharia and its outcomes without instant dismissal as prejudice, an acknowledgement of the harm that has beset countries and their populace after the ascendancy of Islamic autocracy, and therefore an examination of the clear path to Islamic totalitarianism that is defined within the religion and emboldens extremists and fundamental adherents alike.  

That is what I took from the interview that relates to the topic.  

I don't agree with much of this bloke, but I agreed with how described the implementation of theocracies as 'an extreme version of Sharia' so he obviously gets that there are different versions of Islam. No one on hear is arguing for the taliban or republican guard as an example of liberty. He also quotes  Iran 1971, pity he didn't have the grace to acknowledge that the yanks and brits fostered one of the nastier theocracies by getting rid of a democratic government https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/19/cia-admits-role-1953-iranian-coup installing a Shah who was an evil SOB, thus generating much resentment which gets us to today, with the Iranian government fostering all sorts of nastiness. So often you can draw a line from western meddling to the extreme versions of Islam in Somalia - (Shabaab), Egypt (Muslim Brotherhood), and Iran (Republican Guards).

[dieter 3,325]

28 minutes ago, DaisyDeeciple said:

I don't agree with much of this bloke, but I agreed with how described the implementation of theocracies as 'an extreme version of Sharia' so he obviously gets that there are different versions of Islam. No one on hear is arguing for the taliban or republican guard as an example of liberty. He also quotes  Iran 1971, pity he didn't have the grace to acknowledge that the yanks and brits fostered one of the nastier theocracies by getting rid of a democratic government https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/19/cia-admits-role-1953-iranian-coup installing a Shah who was an evil SOB, thus generating much resentment which gets us to today, with the Iranian government fostering all sorts of nastiness. So often you can draw a line from western meddling to the extreme versions of Islam in Somalia - (Shabaab), Egypt (Muslim Brotherhood), and Iran (Republican Guards).

And Saudi Arabian Wahhabism fostered by the Brits....

[Gator 16,891]

A reformed radical shares this.  He understands the dangers that lurk within.  Radicalisation starts in mosques.

The Left ?  Nothing to see here.

 

[Jara 1,149]

On 6/2/2018 at 10:33 AM, ProDee said:

The ones fighting for change do it in a burqa ?  That's an oxymoron.

And no.  I haven't had the pleasure.

Hey Pro the other thing I was wondering - have you ever discussed your views of Islam with a practicing Muslim? 

[Jara 1,149]

Oh and re your comment on the burqa. See my earlier post. The women i meet who come here from Saudi Arabia are definitely leading the push for change in their own country. Ive heard hundreds of examples over the years - women pushing for  (and winning ) the right to drive,  to vote;  to have fulfilling careers  I know they've got a long way to go but you have to start somewhere ☺. (Oh and they don't wear burqas)