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Is Goodwin the right guy....


Dees2014

Is Goodwin the right guy?  

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37 minutes ago, BDA said:

I was voicing my worst MFCSS laden fear T_U. Losing an elim final to any team would be crushing. But the thoughts of losing to Essendon bring me out in a cold sweat  

And if we are beaten in an elim final this year, no matter who beats us, I reckon the heat will come back on Goody

True, losing to Essendon would be a disastrous end to this season. Still think Richmond will finish 8th but will have to see.

If we finish 5th and lose the elimination final this board will blow up in calling for Goodwin to be sacked.

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4 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

True, losing to Essendon would be a disastrous end to this season. Still think Richmond will finish 8th but will have to see.

If we finish 5th and lose the elimination final this board will blow up in calling for Goodwin to be sacked.

If only Goodwin was smart enough to ensure we never got to sit on top of the ladder for 3 months, he'd have understood that people will feel their expectations haven't been met - and of course, that is career suicide!

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I really think that we have a good list. I really do think that a decent coach would've got this list to top 4 three seasons in a row. 

I do think that though that many supporters glossed over the tight wins as 'It's just how we play', '4 points is 4 points' sort of mentality and it takes all sort of analysis out of the season. The truth is that the writing was on the wall way back when north smashed us in that first half. Even Round 1 against freo we were average. We were also average in the hawthorn win, and also not very good against carlton and essendon. 
 

Many fans i suspect assumed we'd make top 4. And i suspect the players and coaches did too. 

So consistency needs to be a focus in pre-season and I don't believe the players anymore when they drop the corporate line 'we haven't achieved anything yet'. Many games this year they've played as if they have. 

 

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6 minutes ago, Demonic said:

I really think that we have a good list. I really do think that a decent coach would've got this list to top 4 three seasons in a row. 

I do think that though that many supporters glossed over the tight wins as 'It's just how we play', '4 points is 4 points' sort of mentality and it takes all sort of analysis out of the season. The truth is that the writing was on the wall way back when north smashed us in that first half. Even Round 1 against freo we were average. We were also average in the hawthorn win, and also not very good against carlton and essendon. 
 

Many fans i suspect assumed we'd make top 4. And i suspect the players and coaches did too. 

So consistency needs to be a focus in pre-season and I don't believe the players anymore when they drop the corporate line 'we haven't achieved anything yet'. Many games this year they've played as if they have. 

 

Yep. This list is going to waste. Petracca, Gawn, Salem, May, Lever, Brown, Viney, all in their prime. Older heads like Hibberd coming to an end. We are in our prime and it’s going to waste. We are playing dumb footy. Working so hard in general play only to not have scoreboard reflection. I feel sorry for this list. They are playing their heart out, but they lack the guidance of a really astute football department. 

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2 hours ago, The heart beats true said:

Just curious, is top 4 after 19 rounds mediocrity? At the start of the year there wouldn’t have been a supporter here who wouldn’t take our current situation.

Goodwin has got a lot right this year. He’s over performed. You have to give credit where it’s due - although I acknowledge Demonland on a Sunday after a loss is not the audience for any reasonable conversation.

Luckily for us Richmond and West Coast have fallen off the map.
The backline have played well and stemmed the bleeding.
The front 2/3rds of the ground have mostly been terrible.
The mids cannot deliver it to the forwards and when the forwards do get it they're like dear in the headlights.

I've seen this movie before.
When the heat comes on we'll fold.
And we've been slowly but surely folding since we played Brisbane.
In a way I'm thankful my expectations have been tempered before the finals.


 

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6 hours ago, Fork 'em said:

Also see there are those still content with the mediocrity of the last 50yrs.

Who said I was content with the last 50 years, I am merely pointing out that after a loss or two some people go into hysterical mode.

This site would be last place I would look to get an opinion on whether Goodwin can coach or not, I have had conversations with family friends over the last few years since Goodwin took over as to their opinions on whether he can coach and their opinion is that he can.

These people include a current assistant at the bulldogs who played over 300 games with them, another member of their 2016 coaching panel, another 300 plus game player for the bulldogs, my grandson's godfather who played for the bulldogs and saints and also won a j j liston trophy with werribee and an old friend of mine of over 50 years who last year was named coach of the century in the Northern Territory plus other ex-players .

 

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1 hour ago, KingDingAling said:

Yep. This list is going to waste. Petracca, Gawn, Salem, May, Lever, Brown, Viney, all in their prime. Older heads like Hibberd coming to an end. We are in our prime and it’s going to waste. We are playing dumb footy. Working so hard in general play only to not have scoreboard reflection. I feel sorry for this list. They are playing their heart out, but they lack the guidance of a really astute football department. 

This. Anyone think that Clarkson would have done better over last three years with our list?

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2 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

Who said I was content with the last 50 years, I am merely pointing out that after a loss or two some people go into hysterical mode.

This site would be last place I would look to get an opinion on whether Goodwin can coach or not, I have had conversations with family friends over the last few years since Goodwin took over as to their opinions on whether he can coach and their opinion is that he can.

These people include a current assistant at the bulldogs who played over 300 games with them, another member of their 2016 coaching panel, another 300 plus game player for the bulldogs, my grandson's godfather who played for the bulldogs and saints and also won a j j liston trophy with werribee and an old friend of mine of over 50 years who last year was named coach of the century in the Northern Territory plus other ex-players .

 

Ok I respect that   opinion

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1 hour ago, drysdale demon said:

Who said I was content with the last 50 years, I am merely pointing out that after a loss or two some people go into hysterical mode.

This site would be last place I would look to get an opinion on whether Goodwin can coach or not, I have had conversations with family friends over the last few years since Goodwin took over as to their opinions on whether he can coach and their opinion is that he can.

These people include a current assistant at the bulldogs who played over 300 games with them, another member of their 2016 coaching panel, another 300 plus game player for the bulldogs, my grandson's godfather who played for the bulldogs and saints and also won a j j liston trophy with werribee and an old friend of mine of over 50 years who last year was named coach of the century in the Northern Territory plus other ex-players .

 

And yet here you are after a loss checking on opinions whether Goodwin can coach or not.

Goodwin got us into the finals on the back of some late season form in 2018.
He then spent the next 2 seasons with an absolutely clueless expression at postgame press conferences.
He's had 4years to coach some consistency into this side and correct some serious deficiencies.
Apart from the backline .... He hasn't.
Gawn still taps it to the opposition.
When the mids do get it they still blindly bang it forward just hoping.
And the forwards run around like chooks with their heads cut off trying to scrub a few through and are 50/50 set shots at goal regardless of the distance and angle.

Your last paragraph is just funny.
Couldn't care less who your sons wifes brothers anonymous friends who you might've had a drunk conversation with at a wedding once are.
 
It's time Goodwin, in Dennis Pagans words .... "Shows us the baby."

 

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2 hours ago, frankie_d said:

This. Anyone think that Clarkson would have done better over last three years with our list?

But Clarkson wasn’t our coach and was never going to be, so not really relevant. Most clubs could hypothesise this.

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6 hours ago, titan_uranus said:

Essendon's flaky - will jeopardise their chance to make it as well as their chance to win a final.

Richmond is by far the scarier threat. If they get a run on and finish 8th...

NOPE!

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1 hour ago, Fork 'em said:

And yet here you are after a loss checking on opinions whether Goodwin can coach or not.

Goodwin got us into the finals on the back of some late season form in 2018.
He then spent the next 2 seasons with an absolutely clueless expression at postgame press conferences.
He's had 4years to coach some consistency into this side and correct some serious deficiencies.
Apart from the backline .... He hasn't.
Gawn still taps it to the opposition.
When the mids do get it they still blindly bang it forward just hoping.
And the forwards run around like chooks with their heads cut off trying to scrub a few through and are 50/50 set shots at goal regardless of the distance and angle.

Your last paragraph is just funny.
Couldn't care less who your sons wifes brothers anonymous friends who you might've had a drunk conversation with at a wedding once are.
 
It's time Goodwin, in Dennis Pagans words .... "Shows us the baby."

 

well done put the [censored] back in his box

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Such glorious fodder. Keep posting here please peoples. Can't wait for the post-flag forensics. Expect a public dossier. 

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5 hours ago, Engorged Onion said:

The difficulty now is that some Demonlanders have expectations that we win every game. You know, like all other premiership favourites throughout eternity who have never lost a match on their way to winning such premiership.

This is garbage

We have right to expect that:

  • problems that have been around for some time are fixed - ie goal kicking and forward '"connection"
  • Work is put into the oppositions best player
  • Our ruck dominance actually translates into an advantage
  • Our 'star studded' midfield actually plays unconditionally and gives us an advantage
  • the pressure on our defence is alleviated by our star studded midfield
  • Our coaches know how to coach
  • Our pathetic showings against wealer opposiotion we are expected to beat is fixed

Not too much to ask.

we're 18 games in and problems haven't beed fixed.

We have a golden opportunity with a really strong start and few injuries yet here we are battling to make the top 4

 

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5 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

This is garbage

We have right to expect that:

  • problems that have been around for some time are fixed - ie goal kicking and forward '"connection"
  • Work is put into the oppositions best player
  • Our ruck dominance actually translates into an advantage
  • Our 'star studded' midfield actually plays unconditionally and gives us an advantage
  • the pressure on our defence is alleviated by our star studded midfield
  • Our coaches know how to coach
  • Our pathetic showings against wealer opposiotion we are expected to beat is fixed

Not too much to ask.

we're 18 games in and problems haven't beed fixed.

We have a golden opportunity with a really strong start and few injuries yet here we are battling to make the top 4

 

And losing to the weaker teams. Losses to Adelaide, Collingwood, and a draw against Hawthorn. If we miss top 4 it will be because of our losses to bottom teams. North shook us early in the year as well. We currently sit inside the 4, after dropping games against teams we shouldn’t. Our midfield isn’t working, we are wasteful moving the ball forward, and our back line practically saves us each week. This team desperately needs some good teaching. It’s lacking. Needs a quality experienced midfield coach, and our forward line needs to function. Goal kicking is deplorable. It’s only through luck we reside in the 4. We won’t last there long and won’t do anything come finals.

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19 minutes ago, KingDingAling said:

And losing to the weaker teams. Losses to Adelaide, Collingwood, and a draw against Hawthorn. If we miss top 4 it will be because of our losses to bottom teams. North shook us early in the year as well. We currently sit inside the 4, after dropping games against teams we shouldn’t. Our midfield isn’t working, we are wasteful moving the ball forward, and our back line practically saves us each week. This team desperately needs some good teaching. It’s lacking. Needs a quality experienced midfield coach, and our forward line needs to function. Goal kicking is deplorable. It’s only through luck we reside in the 4. We won’t last there long and won’t do anything come finals.

Fair dinkum, 17 other clubs were dreaming of having Yze as a midfield coach & getting Williams was a masterstroke.

Pull your head out of your backside you winging whining pathetic excuse of a supporter, we're 2 points off being on top of the ladder & yet you still carry on as if the clubs fighting for the wooden spoon

 

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5 hours ago, Demonic said:

I really think that we have a good list. I really do think that a decent coach would've got this list to top 4 three seasons in a row. 

I do think that though that many supporters glossed over the tight wins as 'It's just how we play', '4 points is 4 points' sort of mentality and it takes all sort of analysis out of the season. The truth is that the writing was on the wall way back when north smashed us in that first half. Even Round 1 against freo we were average. We were also average in the hawthorn win, and also not very good against carlton and essendon. 
 

Many fans i suspect assumed we'd make top 4. And i suspect the players and coaches did too. 

So consistency needs to be a focus in pre-season and I don't believe the players anymore when they drop the corporate line 'we haven't achieved anything yet'. Many games this year they've played as if they have. 

 

You assume many thing incorrectly. Not many supporters thought we would make top 4, quite a few not even finals. 

we slipped into finals early in 2018 and our prime years with this list are now and the next 3-5. Hibberd getting old is irrelevant. 

when we were 11-1. Yze and Choco got the credit from some on here. Have they gone somewhere?

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27 minutes ago, jnrmac said:

This is garbage

We have right to expect that:

  • problems that have been around for some time are fixed - ie goal kicking and forward '"connection"
  • Work is put into the oppositions best player
  • Our ruck dominance actually translates into an advantage
  • Our 'star studded' midfield actually plays unconditionally and gives us an advantage
  • the pressure on our defence is alleviated by our star studded midfield
  • Our coaches know how to coach
  • Our pathetic showings against wealer opposiotion we are expected to beat is fixed

Not too much to ask.

we're 18 games in and problems haven't beed fixed.

We have a golden opportunity with a really strong start and few injuries yet here we are battling to make the top 4

 

When you use language like 'pathetic' and label my post as 'garbage' - I already understand that responding to your post, with counterpoints, is unlikley to change your opinion, but as a condescending person that I am, when someone is condescending to me,  I'll walk you through why I think it's not garbage.

Firstly, you and I don't have the right to expect anything of the people within the 4 walls of MFC.  They're not playing for you Jnr, nor are they playing for me.

Seriously, it'll help you immensely if you come from a place of curiosity as to why things the way they are, rather than rage, sadness, and expectation.

Here are my thoughts on your points.

  • Like all teams (bar Geelong at this stage) - all teams have forward connection issues. If by problems you mean, players not delivering the ball on the chest, over kicking it, under kicking it, having oppositions mark it.   You may not have noticed it, but all our opponents do the same thing - either with more or less efficiency. We don't have forward connection issues - we have conversion issues. If we had our last 6 weeks conversions back to the mean of 53% for the league - this is what we would have kicked. (yes yes, if my aunty was my uncle)... 
  1. Collingwood 9.9 at 50% becomes 10.7 at 53% or thereabouts - so we still lose.
  2. Essendon 9.14 = 12.11 we still win
  3. GWS = 7.13 becomes 11.9 we win by 9 points
  4. Port 12.14 becomes 14.12 we win by 41 points
  5. Hawks 11.13 becomes 13.11 we win by 10 points
  6. Bulldogs 9.11 becomes 11.9 and we lose by 10 points to the Dogs, whom we have already beaten.
  • I'll say it again, connection is no more of an issue for us than any other team. 
  • Work is put into opposition players and structures. We oestensibly went head to head - and with 10 minutes to go we were 4 points down, and could have gone 2 up. Lapses happen from players all.the.[censored].time - it doesnt mean work hasn't gone into opposition playres
  • It's been discussed a lot - but if you think by merely having a dominant ruckman means that you're going to win more clean possessions by your own midfielders - you are severely underestimating the rest of the competition (and the work THEY put in) or a best naive to how difficult constant clearances are.
  • Who thinks our midfield is star studded? Do you? I know the media bangs on about it when we are winning... do you suspect (or know) that the players also think it's star studded - and does that therefore mean they rest on their laurels, or does that mean to you they should win every clearance (you seem to write in black and white terms, so I assume that's how you think).I'd suggest you lower your expectations and not buy in to what the media says. Or has Petracca, Oliver and Viney said they're star studded and I've missed the correspondence?
  • The pressure on our defence is alleviated by the midfielders...at least some of the time... otherwise we wouldn't have been on top of the ladder for 3 months of the year.
  • I'm not sure how to respond to - coaches know how to coach? That seems to be such a strange response when for the first time in 2 decades, we're locked into a finals berth by round 17/18.
  • Your last point around pathetic, is merely a judgement from yourself due to your own expectations. I'll say it for the last time, it's such a close industry - all players and coaches pay respect to all opposition, for you to infer that they don't is all your own stuff as a way to make sense of why 'your' team has lost when you expected them to win, based merely on ladder position.

We're 18 games in and the problems as per, are addressed weekly, and things are tweaked, and sometimes the work, and not to the full extent that we wish, sometimes they don't and other times they're fantastic. 

So what is unhelpful Jnr, is your expectation, but that's your own doing, and if you can disentangle yourself from it, you may be able to see the woods for the trees.

I don't at all expect you to take on board anything I've written. Nor do I care.

 Finally what is offensive to me, is the way you led off your response to me, but having seen how you post, I'm not surprised.

Have a good Sunday night.

Go Dees.

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, leave it to deever said:

A change will be for the best.

Your to set in your ways goody

 

Too set in his ways? It’s his first time in the top job. 
were you complaining at 11-1?

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2 hours ago, Sir Why You Little said:

Adelaide worked us out in Round 10 and we have been very average since then, particularly up forward

Sweet Jesus, who did we play in the fortnight immediately after the Adelaide game

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