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Is Goodwin the right guy?  

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2 hours ago, Dr.D said:

Mistakes Goodwin made today:

- He went head to head with the dogs midfield. He made no changes despite in the first half our midfield was getting smashed!

-  A real opportunity to put Harmes on Bont who was torching us. But no.

- Defensive zone after a behind was non existent. Time and time and time and time and time and time and time again the dogs would find so many open men after we ķicked a behind. Sometimes despite having 30 second goal reviews. Disgrace.

- The selection  of Tom McDonald. Why? oh why does Goodwin rate him. 

You're a real struggler, Doc.

Our midfield got smashed in work rate. That's not coaching. That's work rate.

You say the defensive zone was non existent. So you think Goodwin and the coaches said, 'hey guys, how about we change it up today and play no defence or defensive system. Sound good, guys?' You have to be kidding, right?

Goodwin rates the two talls. So if it wasn't McDonald, who would you have in instead? Brown? 

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Only 3 clubs have clocked an average running speed quicker in defence than in attack for both games. Richmond WB and Melbounre. We are running harder defensively than we have previous season

You're good at making sweeping generalisations.  And yes, there's unquestionably areas where the team needs to improve.  But I don't agree with your assessment of Goodwin.  We're lucky to have him.

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41 minutes ago, Pollyanna said:

The Dogs are a very good side at full strength when they're on.  They're currently better than us. We've still got scope for improvement.

Appreciate this and have also heard this for two years. Nothing wrong with being beaten by good teams when you show real effort like against Brisbane. But the Dogs are on a level playing field. We can’t keep saying we got beaten by a better team, because how do you become a better team when you can only beat up on lowly or injured sides? 
At what point do we stop waiting for the improvement and admit that it’s not going to happen with the current coaching group? 
If it’s not Goodwin, than certainly he needs better support in the box. Hard to know what Richardson has brought to the table looking from the outside, but honestly we’ve had the same glaring issues for 3 seasons. We outplayed ourselves in 2018 and have been declining rapidly since. 2019 could be excused due to injuries, but [censored] it’s getting hard to find excuses these days. 

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2 hours ago, Redleg said:

I suppose you can ask what were  the tactics we came up with today to negate the assets of the Dogs. We needed to stop their spread at stoppages and run from Defence. What was the plan, I saw nothing?Bevo  clearly did things to upset our game and got the win. 

I couldn't see anything either. I would have loved to see the stoppage plans, but given our mids were nowhere, it was pretty difficult to assess.

46 minutes ago, Patches O’houlihan said:

Dogs are a good side, with a deep and well balanced midfield and highly skilled half backs who taught us a lesson today, no doubt. 

but we were up at half time, and Bevo threw Bruce into the ruck and it totally changed the look of the game. 

when was the last time Simon Goodwin made a move like that that turned a game on it's head?

This is a philosophy thing IMO. Would you prefer Clarkson or Hardwick? One plays rigidly to a system and the other changes things up. Neither one is better necessarily. Both methods have had success.

Oliver (23), Petracca (24), Brayshaw (24), Lever (24), Lagndon (24) and Weideman (23). That's the core that we agree on. None of them are in the sweet spot for experience, games played. We still have lots of improvement to come in the next 2-3 years. I'm of the view now that we need to hold course.

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2 minutes ago, Jaded said:

Appreciate this and have also heard this for two years. Nothing wrong with being beaten by good teams when you show real effort like against Brisbane. But the Dogs are on a level playing field. We can’t keep saying we got beaten by a better team, because how do you become a better team when you can only beat up on lowly or injured sides? 
At what point do we stop waiting for the improvement and admit that it’s not going to happen with the current coaching group? 
If it’s not Goodwin, than certainly he needs better support in the box. Hard to know what Richardson has brought to the table looking from the outside, but honestly we’ve had the same glaring issues for 3 seasons. We outplayed ourselves in 2018 and have been declining rapidly since. 2019 could be excused due to injuries, but [censored] it’s getting hard to find excuses these days. 

It's still a work in progress, May and Lever are just getting some continuity this year and Langdon and Tomlinson have just arrived.  Add to that the ballsy recruiting of Jackson and Pickett and the vast improvement of Petracca and I can see it's not static.

Look I can totally understand people losing patience.FWIW, Barring unforeseen obstacles I think we need to make finals or go mighty close.

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29 minutes ago, A F said:

You're a real struggler, Doc.

Our midfield got smashed in work rate. That's not coaching. That's work rate.

You say the defensive zone was non existent. So you think Goodwin and the coaches said, 'hey guys, how about we change it up today and play no defence or defensive system. Sound good, guys?' You have to be kidding, right?

Goodwin rates the two talls. So if it wasn't McDonald, who would you have in instead? Brown? 

huh? Our midfield got smashed so you need to change things up. I.e. Harmes onto Bont. These things are easy decisions. 

No, I think Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent. or worked on but not executed. regardless, that's on the coach. 

And yeah, anyone on our list is better than McDonald. But yes, Brown is miles ahead.

 

Surely coming 17th then outside the 8 proves that Goodwin can't coach? Or do you want more time?

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Just now, Dr.D said:

huh? Our midfield got smashed so you need to change things up. I.e. Harmes onto Bont. These things are easy decisions. 

No, I think Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent. or worked on but not executed. regardless, that's on the coach. 

And yeah, anyone on our list is better than McDonald. But yes, Brown is miles ahead.

 

Surely coming 17th then outside the 8 proves that Goodwin can't coach? Or do you want more time?

Two things.

One, our defensive structure this year has been excellent.  Today wasn't a problem either.  You could have had the greatest back six of all time down there today and they would have been beaten with the ease with which the ball came in during the third term.

Second, if coming 17th in 2019 proves he can't coach, what does a Prelim in 2018 prove?  You can't have one but totally ignore the other.

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On 7/30/2020 at 11:59 PM, The heart beats true said:

My well meaning partner said the same thing tonight while I yelled at the TV.

I politely responded that it doesn’t seem to be impacting Port Adelaide. 

This year the MFC are out of excuses. They used them all up last season. The current situation is unique, but it is unique for all (except the Brisbane teams which are obviously advantaged). 

If that game tonight was at the MCG you’d have seen members booing the club off at half time. It was a disgrace.

It affected Port when they played Geelong!

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14 minutes ago, Dr.D said:

huh? Our midfield got smashed so you need to change things up. I.e. Harmes onto Bont. These things are easy decisions. 

No, I think Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent. or worked on but not executed. regardless, that's on the coach. 

And yeah, anyone on our list is better than McDonald. But yes, Brown is miles ahead.

 

Surely coming 17th then outside the 8 proves that Goodwin can't coach? Or do you want more time?

How is moving one player into a midfield mix of at least 5 or 6 others (whose work rate is not up to scratch), going to change things? We're not playing footy in the 90s anymore. Not as simple as moving one player in or out.

And to say Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent, I mean I'm staggered. I probably shouldn't be, but this is nonsense.

Don't get me wrong on McDonald, he's very ordinary, but I'd have him in the side ahead of Brown, he's also a better bet in the ruck than Brown.

We're 9th with plenty of games to come. You sound ridiculous. Do I want more time? I want to see the season play out. You've had a holiday the last few weeks so clearly we were going okay and actually, if you looked at the ladder prior to the game, you would have seen we were in the 8. 

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We need an experienced coach. 
 

Our club eats up rookie coaches and spits them out. 
 

Lyon or Clarkson would be a priority. We cannot afford to keep Goodwin. He seems to really struggle on game day when teams pressure us. 

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7 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

We need an experienced coach. 
 

Our club eats up rookie coaches and spits them out. 
 

Lyon or Clarkson would be a priority. We cannot afford to keep Goodwin. He seems to really struggle on game day when teams pressure us. 

I think some of our supporters might be trying to eat up the coach, rather than the club. 

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3 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

We need an experienced coach. 
 

Our club eats up rookie coaches and spits them out. 
 

Lyon or Clarkson would be a priority. We cannot afford to keep Goodwin. He seems to really struggle on game day when teams pressure us. 

Daniher went alright for a rookie. It was a roller coaster ride, but he sure as hell brought the excitement and hope as a demon supporter compared to Neeld and Bailey.

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49 minutes ago, Graeme Yeats' Mullet said:

First foray into this thread since page 97 2 years ago....

Has the question been answered yet?

Yes. But it might change if we beat St Kilda.

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4 minutes ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Daniher went alright for a rookie. It was a roller coaster ride, but he sure as hell brought the excitement and hope as a demon supporter compared to Neeld and Bailey.

True but that was a long time ago dd. 
 

The position we are in with the current list we have I think we would benefit immensely from an experienced coach such as Lyon/Clarkson. 

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22 minutes ago, A F said:

How is moving one player into a midfield mix of at least 5 or 6 others (whose work rate is not up to scratch), going to change things? We're not playing footy in the 90s anymore. Not as simple as moving one player in or out.

And to say Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent, I mean I'm staggered. I probably shouldn't be, but this is nonsense.

Don't get me wrong on McDonald, he's very ordinary, but I'd have him in the side ahead of Brown, he's also a better bet in the ruck than Brown.

We're 9th with plenty of games to come. You sound ridiculous. Do I want more time? I want to see the season play out. You've had a holiday the last few weeks so clearly we were going okay and actually, if you looked at the ladder prior to the game, you would have seen we were in the 8. 

 

22 minutes ago, A F said:

How is moving one player into a midfield mix of at least 5 or 6 others (whose work rate is not up to scratch), going to change things? We're not playing footy in the 90s anymore. Not as simple as moving one player in or out.

And to say Goodwin came up with a defensive structure that was non existent, I mean I'm staggered. I probably shouldn't be, but this is nonsense.

Don't get me wrong on McDonald, he's very ordinary, but I'd have him in the side ahead of Brown, he's also a better bet in the ruck than Brown.

We're 9th with plenty of games to come. You sound ridiculous. Do I want more time? I want to see the season play out. You've had a holiday the last few weeks so clearly we were going okay and actually, if you looked at the ladder prior to the game, you would have seen we were in the 8. 

This is interesting. Genuine question, if one midfield move won’t have an effect, how come beveridge’s move of Bruce into the ruck in the third, proved to be the difference. 
And, if that wasn’t the difference, what was the Bevo move that did make it?
Our midfield work rate wasn’t fantastic in Q2 but it was ok. 

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7 minutes ago, KLV said:

 

This is interesting. Genuine question, if one midfield move won’t have an effect, how come beveridge’s move of Bruce into the ruck in the third, proved to be the difference. 
And, if that wasn’t the difference, what was the Bevo move that did make it?
Our midfield work rate wasn’t fantastic in Q2 but it was ok. 

Because their midfield was working hard. Ours wasn't.

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38 minutes ago, A F said:

Because their midfield was working hard. Ours wasn't.

Yes and no AF.  You can work hard and still stuff it as we saw today (and have in the past) with Viney.  It can throw the system right out.

Bringing Harmes on to try and quieten the Bont couldn't have hurt give  he has not had an impact so far at HB and we'd lost Sparrow.

Harmes in for Sparrow and push Viney foward.  More time for Gus who tends to share the ball and spread better as a mid vs Viney and who knows.

We could have also dropped a mid back as a sweeper when they started to spread so well in the 3rd.

Instead there was no changes and we stayed the same while they kicked 6 on the trot.

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36 minutes ago, KLV said:

 

This is interesting. Genuine question, if one midfield move won’t have an effect, how come beveridge’s move of Bruce into the ruck in the third, proved to be the difference. 
And, if that wasn’t the difference, what was the Bevo move that did make it?
Our midfield work rate wasn’t fantastic in Q2 but it was ok. 

Hi @KLV I think you are right that Beveridge made moves in the third but I don't think the difference maker was Bruce (but good catch). The 3rd qtr was where we were annihilated from which the Bulldogs scored 4 goals from defensive 50 rebounds, 1 goal from a silly 50m penalty by Melksham and 1 from a stoppage. Our initial stoppage work was great but the Bulldogs mids swarmed the ball carrier forcing hacked kicks inside 50.  Where they smashed us is their extra man in defense and their wingers/mids spreading. Part of this can be blamed on mid work-rate but primarily their extra in defense was having significantly more influence than ours. At times we have multiple extras behind the ball when we launch into 50 and Beverage's system picked this a part. There are multiple levers that could have been pulled that would have reduced the rebound 50s to scores...camera work doesn't allow us to make definitive judgments but Goodwin didn't appear to have answers to this. 

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1 hour ago, Wiseblood said:

Two things.

One, our defensive structure this year has been excellent.  Today wasn't a problem either.  You could have had the greatest back six of all time down there today and they would have been beaten with the ease with which the ball came in during the third term.

Second, if coming 17th in 2019 proves he can't coach, what does a Prelim in 2018 prove?  You can't have one but totally ignore the other.

2018 was a roll over effect of Roos.

There was about 5 or 6 times when the bulldogs were kicking in after a behind, often after a lengthy review, only for them to find completely open men all over the park. That's structure, nothing to do with chasing. 

Edited by Dr.D
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No we have a better list than what it is performing. If we don't make the 8 which is very possible we only have to lose one more game and it will be very hard he must pack his bags.

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