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Is Goodwin the right guy....

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6 hours ago, Pickett2Jackson said:

Good.

The article says it would cost us approx $1.4 million to pay him out if sacked end of season.    One of our ultra rich supporters could easily foot that bill.

Or the board could all dip into their own pockets after stupidly extending his contract for so long, with still another year to go on his existing contract at the time.

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1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

Oliver needs to pulled out of the middle though, Its not working with he and Viney. See ball get ball.

Oliver is ineffective at the moment. Viney can't oplay anywhere else.

 

Oliver to fwd line. Brayshaw and Salem to the middle.

I agree with all this. I'd also try Fritsch on the wing if we are not playing Tomlinson. He's lost a little confidence shooting for goal,  I still think he is one of the better kicks in the team.

Effectively a 3 way change Oliver from mid to forward, Fritsch fwd to wing,  Gus wing to mid. 

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I suppose now the heat will be taken off Goodwin due to the latest covidiot in Buckley.

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I've just finished catching up with postings on this site. What I've learnt is we fluked the win against West Coast, fluked the win against GWS, Fluked the win against Geelong and fluked the win against Hawthorn. What an amazing run of flukyness. And what a load of rubbish, players come in and out of sides all the time and when you get to play them is just the luck of the draw same as the AFL fixture. Did West Coast fluke Geelong last night because Ablett and Selwood weren't playing. FFS

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The most perplexing part of all this is that we have a full list. Last year was explained away by injuries and yet here we are. And, where is the player development? - all our 2018 draftees are treading water if not going backwards.

I am always mindful that coaches have families and a sacking has great personal consequences but it is crisis time and I fear that Goodwin won’t be able to come back from this. There is no spinning the loss on Thursday. It seems to have become a watershed because it highlighted systemic flaws in the game plan, inability to execute basic skills and lack of pride and passion.

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The calls for Salem to move into the midfield are misguided. Too soft and in the heat, he's never demonstrated good decision making. It's precisely why we play him behind the ball where he has more time.

Meanwhile, we want to take our best ball winner out of the middle and play him forward? How about we keep our best ball winners in the middle and get our structures, stoppages and defence set up properly so we can take proper effect of Gawn's dominance?

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30 minutes ago, chook fowler said:

The most perplexing part of all this is that we have a full list. Last year was explained away by injuries and yet here we are. And, where is the player development? - all our 2018 draftees are treading water if not going backwards.

I am always mindful that coaches have families and a sacking has great personal consequences but it is crisis time and I fear that Goodwin won’t be able to come back from this. There is no spinning the loss on Thursday. It seems to have become a watershed because it highlighted systemic flaws in the game plan, inability to execute basic skills and lack of pride and passion.

Certainly the President getting involved changes things. Mud sticks. Now someone like Clarko is tough and confident enough to carry on and back himself with Kennett having a crack, but can Goodwin.  

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10 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

Certainly the President getting involved changes things. Mud sticks. Now someone like Clarko is tough and confident enough to carry on and back himself with Kennett having a crack, but can Goodwin.  

I doubt it.

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50 minutes ago, A F said:

Meanwhile, we want to take our best ball winner out of the middle and play him forward? How about we keep our best ball winners in the middle and get our structures, stoppages and defence set up properly so we can take proper effect of Gawn's dominance?

That would certainly make more sense.

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4 hours ago, jnrmac said:

TMac kicked the ball over his head with 23 seconds left.

I'd say we fluked that game Jack Viney was immense in the last qtr though..

TMac kicked that goal in R14 2017. That was the game Viney cleaned up Hurn and Schofield got done for flicking chin of Oliver (who was accused of staging).

Under enormous pressure, we again won in R22 2018 (during the day) to seal a spot in the finals.

Both wins were not lucky. They were sensational.

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13 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

That would certainly make more sense.

It's a bit like kicking the can down the road / bringing forward tax cuts. 

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1 hour ago, A F said:

The calls for Salem to move into the midfield are misguided. Too soft and in the heat, he's never demonstrated good decision making. It's precisely why we play him behind the ball where he has more time.

Meanwhile, we want to take our best ball winner out of the middle and play him forward? How about we keep our best ball winners in the middle and get our structures, stoppages and defence set up properly so we can take proper effect of Gawn's dominance?

I don't want him out of there permanently AF but we need to change things up far more often than what we do and Clarrys ball winning ability could have a big impact if he's forward a bit more.

We have a 3rd place getter in the Brownlow becoming a complete liability as he's had zero impact on the wing and looks disinterested. He can win plenty of his own ball if we get him in there. 

No doubt we have to capitalise on Gawns dominance. We should be smashing teams out of the middle. 

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On 7/31/2020 at 9:43 PM, titan_uranus said:

Why the revisionism?

We didn't fluke anything. We beat West Coast in Perth under enormous pressure (the net effect of the sides' missing players doesn't change that at all), then followed it up with three incredibly strong wins.

We won more games against the top 8 in 2018 than Collingwood did.

It was a good season.

Just because it's fallen apart since then doesn't change the fact we were good in 2018.

Good stuff, Titan. I’m also tired of this maudlin revisionist tripe. We were a good side in 2018, beating top 8 sides WC, GWS, Geel and Haw.

Our fixture wasn’t as hard as last year’s but it was not as easy as some would think either. Yes, we played GC and StK twice (not Carl though) but we had away games against Bris and both Adel teams and, as usual, played Geel at Kardinia Park and WC in Perth. The Hawks played at Kardinia Park for the first time in 15 years earlier this season, an absolute joke.

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59 minutes ago, drysdale demon said:

That would certainly make more sense.

Who are you blaming for the stoppages and set ups? Players or coaches DD?  Do I sense a crack in the dam wall?

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Posted (edited)
36 minutes ago, Hell Bent said:

I don't want him out of there permanently AF but we need to change things up far more often than what we do and Clarrys ball winning ability could have a big impact if he's forward a bit more.

We have a 3rd place getter in the Brownlow becoming a complete liability as he's had zero impact on the wing and looks disinterested. He can win plenty of his own ball if we get him in there. 

No doubt we have to capitalise on Gawns dominance. We should be smashing teams out of the middle. 

I agree with need to use Brayshaw better, but I don't think we're going to get more out of Clarry from sending him forward. We'll just get less of him in his best spot. As for Gus, I'm not sure what's going on there. He doesn't play a lot of TOG and clearly isn't particularly good at the wing either. There's something strange going on there. 

Petracca's midfield minutes have reversed his midfield / forward time from last year, playing in the midfield 70% and forward 30%. As far as I'm concerned, Gus should be playing in the middle for that 30% that Petracca isn't and the time that Oliver and Viney aren't attending stoppages too.

I think we need to be smarter there, but it sounds like people want Oliver to spend a lot more time forward. He's the best contested ball winner we've ever had (arguably). Certainly in the modern era. I think we're lesser if he's not attending stoppages. It'd be like trying to play Sam Mitchell forward, because Brad Sewell could only play midfield.

I don't believe it's the best move. Only an opinion though.

Edited by A F
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12 minutes ago, Half forward flank said:

Who are you blaming for the stoppages and set ups? Players or coaches DD?  Do I sense a crack in the dam wall?

Mostly the players.

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On 8/1/2020 at 11:15 AM, SFebes said:

jesus, i have 60 pages to catch up so I'll just post this here as well.

Reluctant to post as it’s all too depressing our current state. I’d hate to say it but it seems to me like Goodwin has lost the players and there’s definitely fractures within the club. For Bartlett to come out like this screams of panic, it’s unusual, he tried to create stability for once sticking with Goodwin and extending his contract after scraping into finals but he’s just the wrong coach. 

These issues haven’t just started either, I’ve been banging on about them for a couple of years. Goodwin was the wrong choice as coach considering his background (gambling and injections), the club couldn’t and can’t afford another rookie. Camp, Brayshaw issue, Hogan, ridiculous contract extensions, McCartney, Jones should’ve retired two years ago, captaincy x 2, recruits - May and Lever have been a fail so far and cost us $1.5m pa, Tomlinson and Langdon fails also, no gameplan - same crap every single week, it’s like pulling teeth...this has been going on for years! There’s only so much bash and crash and bruising you can take as a player before it becomes enough, great we win contested footy and get the most entries but we are so poorly coached it isn’t funny. It’s the same issue week after week. There is no tactical nous from Goodwin, his one and only saviour was TomMc forward which worked for a while but he just doesn’t do anything as coach. Don’t even get me started on team selections over the last few years (yes years).

2018 we got on a roll but had an easy draw and from memory didn’t beat a top 8 side all year at time of playing them. The same issues were there all of that year also. 

It still makes me wonder why Roos left in a hurry and didn’t take up his role overseeing Goodwin, then Roos’ team left when he did. 

He might be a nice bloke, I don’t know, but he’s certainly an incapable AFL coach. We need Clarkson or Lyon. And it needs to happen before it’s too late. Goodwin is way out of his depth. 

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I think a very great number of people agree with you fully.

We have seen it all - from ridiculous and continuous team selections, a complete lack of strategies for any particular game/opposition, a noticeable breakdown in communication and spirit between team members, under-performance in the development of talented but raw players, and so the story goes. We have provided a need in major footballing skills personnel to seek alternative employment with other clubs - their attrition proved to be so fatal that most cannot get a regular game, elsewhere.

Wasted footballing careers and members'/supporters' expectations - these hopes are not unreasonable - static incompetence across the FD amateur array, that now reflects the poor decision-making of the MFC Board and its leadership.

Next season, in footballing terms, is still a long, long way off to achieve just some of the remediation that is long overdue (years) and thus, in the eyes of the beholders, it is time, this week, to sack Goodwin and re-appoint a whole FD to begin the process of re-establishing our dignity and due entitlement. 

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10 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Oliver needs to pulled out of the middle though, Its not working with he and Viney. See ball get ball.

Oliver is ineffective at the moment. Viney can't oplay anywhere else.

 

Oliver to fwd line. Brayshaw and Salem to the middle.

Agree with you on one part but...

I would do the opposite.

I think Oliver is much better as a mid than Viney.

I expect some like yourself wouldn't agree.

I think Viney is the main culprit in upsetting the midfield balance.

We play as individuals and not as a team midfield.

Jack tries to do too much and it brings the whole midfield structure undone.

Viney getting in there and hitting up the ball may look good to the fan but in reality it's often bad for the team.

He can and does compete with his teammate for the same ball when not in position to do it.

He also doesn't give off when he should.

My starting 3 would always be Oliver, Trac & Brayshaw...those 3 can and have worked well together.

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, rjay said:

Agree with you on one part but...

I would do the opposite.

I think Oliver is much better as a mid than Viney.

I expect some like yourself wouldn't agree.

I think Viney is the main culprit in upsetting the midfield balance.

We play as individuals and not as a team midfield.

Jack tries to do too much and it brings the whole midfield structure undone.

Viney getting in there and hitting up the ball may look good to the fan but in reality it's often bad for the team.

He can and does compete with his teammate for the same ball when not in position to do it.

He also doesn't give off when he should.

My starting 3 would always be Oliver, Trac & Brayshaw...those 3 can and have worked well together.

Agree...way I look it at, you need a mid who is the extractor (Oliver), you need one who can break the lines and be extremely damaging (Trac) & you need the third to be a combination of both dependant on the situation (Brayshaw), with Viney in the mix, it upsets the balance.

Edited by adonski
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10 hours ago, jnrmac said:

TMac kicked the ball over his head with 23 seconds left.

I'd say we fluked that game Jack Viney was immense in the last qtr though..

That was at Subiaco in 2017

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12 minutes ago, rjay said:

Agree with you on one part but...

I would do the opposite.

I think Oliver is much better as a mid than Viney.

I expect some like yourself wouldn't agree.

I think Viney is the main culprit in upsetting the midfield balance.

We play as individuals and not as a team midfield.

Jack tries to do too much and it brings the whole midfield structure undone.

Viney getting in there and hitting up the ball may look good to the fan but in reality it's often bad for the team.

He can and does compete with his teammate for the same ball when not in position to do it.

He also doesn't give off when he should.

My starting 3 would always be Oliver, Trac & Brayshaw...those 3 can and have worked well together.

I really like the idea of viney as a forward. So much of his great clearance work from the centre is wasted with his disposal.

And the fact he so often turns it over with the kick inside 50 means creayes opportunities for opposition teams to launch attacks from defence.

Play him near goal. And tell him to go nuts. Ground ball gets, tackles inside 50 and foreard pressure are all super critical and he would excel with all of them.

He roves well from marking contests and of also from course stoppages and throw ins.

He has a pretty good pair of hands and his poor kicking isn't really a worry inside 50. Or at not as much a worry. And from set shots he is not too bad.

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I still really like the idea of playing Viney deep forward. just give him the single goal in every game 

chase, tackle, harass. 

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