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Engorged Onion

Critiquing the content not the person

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59 minutes ago, Skuit said:

As a recent arrival to this site you have no right to comment on its culture. Why don't you just go back to where you came from.

Funny you should say that...

I asked all of my black and minority ethnic friends if they thought I was racist or not, and they both said that I wasn't 

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16 minutes ago, Earl Hood said:

Que?

Cambodian in-joke.

:ph34r:

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I feel for the most part this site is very well run in this respect. A lot of the time if moderators notice things straying away from debate of a topic and into personal attack they step in. 

Obviously I don't think personal attacks are on but at the same time I feel people can be baited into back and forth responses. We're all here (or at least 99% of us) are here because we love the Dees, common ground is always a great place to start when arguments get out of control so let's always remember that. 

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12 hours ago, Danelska said:

Some friday musings over a coffee or 4...

We bang on about mental health on here, yet numerous posters prefer to attack the man vs the content. Now I'm not coming from a holier than thou perspective, I am coming from a compassionate perspective and we've no idea really how someone feels when their attacked - even if their response would suggest they're cool with it.

Personally, I get quite upset (angry AND sad) when I see some posters critiquing others on here rather than the content. Would love a 3 strikes and you're banned for a bit rule.

 

I'm with you Denaleska, though I do think where we need to be is somewhere inbetween what you suggest and where we are at now. You won't be popular in your view on here. People will say harden up princess, when really there's just a bunch of keyboard heroes making themselves feel better. And a lot of sooks. I'm not often offended, but I do think there are some guys who play the man who just make the site a mess. Threads are tougher to read when individuals target each other and reference things others weren't a part of. It just stinks the place up. That's the main reason I want to see things changed. That said... you can't really do anything. 3 strikes and out wouldn't work at all. People have to be free to express themselves.

I don't actually think you can change the nature of posting on the internet. I will say though that I reckon all along demonland has stayed ahead of the junk other fan sites come up with. Man. Take a look at Bigfooty. We've got it easy here.

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I reckon playing the man has dropped off not only because we are winning but it is a seasonal event. It always used to ramp up during the Pre-Season training reports.

Each training post is 90% vigorous argument/debate, 5% Banter and 5% actual training report.    

But it does make for some entertaining reading that's for sure.

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12 hours ago, Moonshadow said:

PJK was a master of one liners, witty retorts and cutting put downs. It's a pity we only have vanilla politicians these days

Barneby Joyce can be quite colourful.  His face starts to look like a beatroot when he gets worked up.  He and PJK are definitely on opposite ends of the scale on intelligence though.

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@Danelska, I'm generally ok with what you are saying.  I don't think it's a big ask to be polite and respectful of other contributors to the forum and it's personally my modus operandi on this forum, as it is in life.  That said, I do also quite like a bit of good spirited banter, but if someone bites hard, I am going to bite back.  I also think the moderators do a pretty well of what is a tough job and I wouldn't want to make that harder by introducing the pretty hard core approach your initial post suggested.

The mental heath/depression issue is sadly and frighteningly real though as you say and it is something we should all be mindful of.  In this respect, I was pretty proud of the Demonland community rallyed round, when an individual contributor admitted they were in a bad place in a post sometime in the past 12 months or so.

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14 minutes ago, Rodney (Balls) Grinter said:

@Danelska, I'm generally ok with what you are saying.  I don't think it's a big ask to be polite and respectful of other contributors to the forum and it's personally my modus operandi on this forum, as it is in life.  That said, I do also quite like a bit of good spirited banter, but if someone bites hard, I am going to bite back.  I also think the moderators do a pretty well of what is a tough job and I wouldn't want to make that harder by introducing the pretty hard core approach your initial post suggested.

The mental heath/depression issue is sadly and frighteningly real though as you say and it is something we should all be mindful of.  In this respect, I was pretty proud of the Demonland community rallyed round, when an individual contributor admitted they were in a bad place in a post sometime in the past 12 months or so.

I would say 90%+ of the time its polite, and the banter is superb - and only at times does it cross a line (at least in my perception) - of course this may not be the other persons experience - but who's to say it isn't either.  Further, the process to deal with repeat offenders would clearly be up to the mods (who by everyones account do a great job of accountability) and not driven by my suggestion..it was simply that, a suggestion. 

If anything, I just wanted to highlight some concerns of mine and promote some discussion. I work daily in mental health and it felt remiss of me for what I stand for to not put in on the table - its clearly up to each individual to do what they want with my thoughts.

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Relax. The mods have this.

 

But seriously, they really do. I am a member of a lot of forums, some really well modded, some ok, and some badly, and I think this place has worked it out the best. 

 

There is leeway: football is an emotional game. People get fired up if their favourite player is bagged or somebody defends their whipping boy. It's understood and accepted, but there is a line.

The line: When arguments degenerate into name calling and idiocy the posters are given a rap over the knuckles and told to pull their heads in. The posts are also quickly deleted to stop the 'third man in' from seeing it later and picking up the argument again.

The slaps: if the combatants or others want to continue the blue in that thread then the thread is locked and people given a good foot up the arse, the severity of which depends generally on the history of the posters (mostly) or in some cases a particular post that went way over the line. Small bans for those that need to know that they are heading down the wrong path. Medium bans for those that don't seem to get that they aren't just crossing the line, but are starting to [censored] on it, and perma bans for those that have no interest in following even basic civility.

 

I've modded and admin'ed forums, and I can tell you that striking the line between letting people vent or tell another poster that they think they are a scrawling abortion and an idiot so stupid they make stupid idiots look smart, and the need to be able to step in at the right moment and stop that without losing good posters, is bloody hard. And that's just as one person. It gets a lot bloody harder when you have 3,4,5,6 people doing it and all of them have different ideas on where the lines are. Here, it seems to me, that the staff are all on the same page, and I haven't seen much in the way of inconsistency since that trumped up Hitler Rhino got the boot. That's a pretty good effort.

 

There is one personal bugbear that I do have here when it comes to personal attacks, and that is the constant and unrelenting attacks on Saty. I'm sure some people no longer read his posts, but instead see the username and immediately go into attack dog mode. Yes he is a pain in the bum with his delusion that coaches and players give him secret inside information. Yes, he is a pain in the bum when he defends players that everyone else can see are running around like headless chooks. Yes, his talk of sunshine and rainbows when all we can see is rainclouds make many of us want to bang our heads on our keyboards.

 

BUT - the man is one of the most one eyed demon supporters I've seen. He loves his team to the nth extreme, and will not listen to anything that dares suggest that every player on our list is a superstar in the making; that all our coaches are tactical geniuses that make Alexander the Great look like a lolligagger; and that our recruiters have just given us a couple of Don Bradmans of football with our rookie picks. I wish I could believe like he does. Unfortunately most of us have had cynic beaten into us. Let him go. Let him enjoy his club. A lot of what he says is good oil, you just have to ignore the sprinkles.

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20 minutes ago, Uncle Fester said:

Relax. The mods have this.

There is one personal bugbear that I do have here when it comes to personal attacks, and that is the constant and unrelenting attacks on Saty. I'm sure some people no longer read his posts, but instead see the username and immediately go into attack dog mode. Yes he is a pain in the bum with his delusion that coaches and players give him secret inside information. Yes, he is a pain in the bum when he defends players that everyone else can see are running around like headless chooks. Yes, his talk of sunshine and rainbows when all we can see is rainclouds make many of us want to bang our heads on our keyboards.

 

BUT - the man is one of the most one eyed demon supporters I've seen. He loves his team to the nth extreme, and will not listen to anything that dares suggest that every player on our list is a superstar in the making; that all our coaches are tactical geniuses that make Alexander the Great look like a lolligagger; and that our recruiters have just given us a couple of Don Bradmans of football with our rookie picks. I wish I could believe like he does. Unfortunately most of us have had cynic beaten into us. Let him go. Let him enjoy his club. A lot of what he says is good oil, you just have to ignore the sprinkles.

I disagree about the training reports guy.

He attacks others far more needlessly than he is needlessly attacked (for want of a better word).

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It's certainly a tough gig posting on Demonland.

I suppose it's fortunate that so many Demons' supporters are such hard men.

PS. I just find '[censored] for tat' personal posts between certain posters annoying to read, nothing more.

 

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Uncle Fester, it's a two way street. People are perfectly capable of having a discussion or view on a situation or player, without being told that they shouldn't because one non-mod poster believes so. Apart from training reports, saty's posts are mostly interjections purely aimed to denigrate the discussion, the poster or demonland posters collectively. Darwin thread is a classic case, didn't like the topic so had to clog it with unecessary put downs and belittling. I rarely reply to him anymore, mainly because it's boring and I've had warnings from mods. But I can understand frustrated posters that do.

None of us are angels, im certainly not, but it's the one aspect of demonland that I know many posters are annoyed with.

I appreciate the difficulty of the mod's job and am grateful for the site.

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42 minutes ago, ProDee said:

I disagree about the training reports guy.

He attacks others far more needlessly than he is needlessly attacked (for want of a better word).

He's not innocent, but one against 30 is boring, especially when it's easier to let him bounce in his bubble.

In a slightly offbeat way he reminds me a little of my dear deceased nana. My dear old church going, cake baking, garden loving nana, who loved the MFC more than anything else in her life. When I was about ten years old I saw her round on a bunch of twenty something year old Collingwood blokes on the train home from Jolimont. The poor buggers were doing nothing more than talking about the game and said that one of their players had taken one of ours to the cleaners (2017 speak - something like 'Geez Elliot played well today. Melksham didn't seem to know what to do with him and looked rattled all day'). Completely innocent. Well, she rounded on them, this sweet church going nana: 'You mongrels only won because you are a bunch of thugs! That's all you've ever been! You've never won a game fairly in your life! All you so and so's (she liked that word when she was angry) are good for is belting players that are better that you...' and so on. It was pretty awesome. Don't you ever say a bad thing about her boys.

Geez she would have loved this place. She either would have been perma banned or made a mod.

Edited by Uncle Fester
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For the first dozen or so years I doubt I'd put a poster on ignore.  I now have 11, although I think 3 of those have been permanently banned (Stuie, Deeluded, and Curry).  So if you quite often quote me and get no response it's a fair chance you're on my list : )

The only reason I ban posters is if they lose all objectivity and continually bait or respond to the name more than the post itself.  I love robust conversation, but those that can't argue on merit get 'ignored'.  If you're not sure if you're on the list send me a pm.  Oh, that's right, you can't.  

It makes this place far more enjoyable.

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21 hours ago, Grapeviney said:

The latest statistics show the forum is ticking along just nicely since the departure of Stuie.

The number of reported posts has fallen by 84 per cent.

Unnecessary argument escalations have dropped 92 per cent, and unwarranted sarcastic replies are down 89 per cent.

Remember when the board used to be filled with exchanges such as this?:

Poster: "I'm a big fan of Stretch but he needs to go back to Casey to find a bit of form."

Stuie: "So Stretch should be delisted and deported back to SA, should he? Righto...."  

That's gold

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1 hour ago, Uncle Fester said:

 

There is one personal bugbear that I do have here when it comes to personal attacks, and that is the constant and unrelenting attacks on Saty.

 

With you on that one, Uncle.

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1 hour ago, ProDee said:

I disagree about the training reports guy.

He attacks others far more needlessly than he is needlessly attacked (for want of a better word).

This is the kettle calling black a pot.

Edited by dieter

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21 hours ago, Grapeviney said:

The latest statistics show the forum is ticking along just nicely since the departure of Stuie.

The number of reported posts has fallen by 84 per cent.

Unnecessary argument escalations have dropped 92 per cent, and unwarranted sarcastic replies are down 89 per cent.

Remember when the board used to be filled with exchanges such as this?:

Poster: "I'm a big fan of Stretch but he needs to go back to Casey to find a bit of form."

Stuie: "So Stretch should be delisted and deported back to SA, should he? Righto...."  

lol

A post attacking a poster in a thread about not attacking posters.

And yet. In this case. Noone seems to mind.

Edited by Dappa Dan
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5 minutes ago, Dappa Dan said:

lol

A post attacking a poster in a thread about not attacking posters.

And yet. In this case. Noone seems to mind.

How is using facts attacking another poster?  That's exactly what he used to do.

16 minutes ago, dieter said:

With you on that one, Uncle.

I'll never understand why people defend him.  I don't jump into arguments with him much anymore, but he constantly gets stuck into other posters and then throws his arms up in the air and claims innocence when others bite back, which then results in people like you sticking up for him.  

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This site is full of arrogant bastards.

Why should I be any different?

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The world is a better place when we can talk here, openly about pretty much anything... 

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29 minutes ago, willmoy said:

The world is a better place when we can talk here, openly about pretty much anything... 

except hwfua

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