Time to show Oscar some respect!

[beelzebub 22,225]

47 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

His first half was the worst he's ever played, his second half was the best.

Id concur.

His first half all but single handedly ( or rather... single footedly ) paved a way for a loss.

His second half, whilst being his best was just adequate ( look it up folks ). Commensurate with doing a job , neither exceptional nor poorly. ( Yes arguably an improvement )

No idea what some fawn over. Has still a long way to go.

[rjay 23,852]

56 minutes ago, Clint Bizkit said:

His first half was the worst he's ever played, his second half was the best.

Nup, made 2 disposal errors centring the ball early but apart from that held up well when our midfield were being smashed and the defence were under siege.

It was a good 4 Q game from Oscar.

 

[Bay Riffin 1,413]

2 minutes ago, rjay said:

Nup, made 2 disposal errors centring the ball early but apart from that held up well when our midfield were being smashed and the defence were under siege.

It was a good 4 Q game from Oscar.

 

Yep credit where credit is due. We just want to see it more than one week. big game against the doggies, so we will see if he can back it up.

[Akum 2,660]

59 minutes ago, jacey said:

His 1st quarter was atrocious. He was good in the second half. Made key plays n looked organised. 

Had a great passage of play in the first quarter where he made three or four great efforts in succession and was rewarded with a free.

Made a couple of mistakes in the first, hacking it about 30m up the ground with his left foot under pressure, instead of kicking it with his right foot out long to an unguarded flank. Then again, if he'd done that and it had rolled out, prob would have been pinged for deliberate OOB, and this might have been on his mind.

Some of his other kicks under pressure were very good. Kicking it to space in front of Harmes (instead of kicking it straight to Harmes) was the perfect play, to allow him to run on to it and move it on to Watts for THAT goal.

Edited June 13, 2017 by Akum

[HBDee 343]

1 hour ago, Dee Dee said:

Yelled at him in the first half.

Yelled for him in the second. (Sh*t I'm a contrarian)!

 

Completely agree with you. First half I cringed whenever the ball went near him. Did some very good things in the second half. He did do some good things in the first half, but they were marred by his errors....still a long way to go with O-Mac.

[Jaded No More 57,630]

After a facepalm worthy first half, he really lifted his intensity and played a lot better in the second and was instrumental in not just stopping goals but actually creating some forward drive from the back half.

We forget how young he is, and realistically he would not be playing AFL if we did not need Tom to ruck and play forward in the absence of both a ruckman and our key forward. 

Good for him for sticking to the task, despite always being weaker and less experienced than his opponent. Playing in the backline is a tough gig, and he never drops his head, which is a credit to him and our coaching staff.

I still think he needs to go back to the VFL when Max and Hogan are back, but this game would give him a lot of confidence. I strongly believe both he and Weids will make it, but they need time and experience and many burgers! 

[picket fence 15,046]

4 hours ago, Nasher said:

Nah, I reckon it's yet another soft effort from PF. The time to show Oscar some respect was before, when he was struggling a bit, rather than laying in to him excessively. Supporting players when they play well is the easy bit.

So when he plays well and I acknowledge it isn't right??? Ok Ill shut up about Oscar then and let others decide!

[binman 37,763]

28 minutes ago, rjay said:

Nup, made 2 disposal errors centring the ball early but apart from that held up well when our midfield were being smashed and the defence were under siege.

It was a good 4 Q game from Oscar.

 

Exactly. Two mistakes, both leading to a goal in the first quarter but did some other excellent things, including a fantastic goal saving spoil running back with the flight of the ball. Salem made a a couple of howlers, Frost twice ran himself into trouble and trac missed two dees players 30 metre out and kicked it straight to a pies player. All cost us goals. M

Those two poor kicks were the only clangers he made all game. He saved a number of goals through great defensive efforts and helped set up the match winning goal. Played a big chunk of the second half injured.Salem made others and short armed a contest that cost us a goal. Frost was shaky at times and Hunt coughed up forward entries with really poor kicks all day. Meanwhile in that first half Lewis and Harmes might well have not played.

As you say a good  4 Q game from Oscar.

[binman 37,763]

18 minutes ago, Jaded said:

We forget how young he is, and realistically he would not be playing AFL if we did not need Tom to ruck and play forward in the absence of both a ruckman and our key forward. 

 

As i have been at pains to point out this is simply wrong. They didn't need him this week as they only have Moore and in any case Spencer was fit enough to play if they really felt OMac should not be playing.

It also completely ignores the fact that at the start of the season when we had Hogan AND Gawn fit and playing he was selected, just as he was all last year. 

And next week Gawn or Spencer comes back so Tmac can go back with Pedo playing as the key forward as he did in the second half yesterday.  Does anyone seriously think he will get dropped this week?

Talk about damning with faint praise

[Jaded No More 57,630]

44 minutes ago, binman said:

As i have been at pains to point out this is simply wrong. They didn't need him this week as they only have Moore and in any case Spencer was fit enough to play if they really felt OMac should not be playing.

It also completely ignores the fact that at the start of the season when we had Hogan AND Gawn fit and playing he was selected, just as he was all last year. 

And next week Gawn or Spencer comes back so Tmac can go back with Pedo playing as the key forward as he did in the second half yesterday.  Does anyone seriously think he will get dropped this week?

Talk about damning with faint praise

Firstly we did not play Spencer this weekend because we obviously felt he wasn't ready in terms of fitness. In my opinion that was almost a very costly mistake, as we got smashed in the ruck and at the contest in the first half. It was something like 11 clearances to 2 in the first quarter alone!

Secondly we played Oscar and Weids at the start of the year which was obviously a tactic to give them some development time and a taste of AFL but both were subsequently dropped. They were only recalled out of necessity, and I feel the one tall who will make way for the two talls returning, will be Oscar.
You wouldn't drop Tom or Frost, and it would be stupid and unfair to drop Pedo, as he gives us a lot up forward and allows Watts to not be the backup ruck to Gawn.
Unless we are playing a team with 3 genuine tall forwards, you wouldn't want to carry Tom, Oscar and Frost in the backline. I'd rather an extra runner.

Edited June 13, 2017 by Jaded

[binman 37,763]

23 minutes ago, Jaded said:

Firstly we did not play Spencer this weekend because we obviously felt he wasn't ready in terms of fitness. In my opinion that was almost a very costly mistake, as we got smashed in the ruck and at the contest in the first half. It was something like 11 clearances to 2 in the first quarter alone!

Secondly we played Oscar and Weids at the start of the year which was obviously a tactic to give them some development time and a taste of AFL but both were subsequently dropped. They were only recalled out of necessity, and I feel the one tall who will make way for the two talls returning, will be Oscar.
You wouldn't drop Tom or Frost, and it would be stupid and unfair to drop Pedo, as he gives us a lot up forward and allows Watts to not be the backup ruck to Gawn.
Unless we are playing a team with 3 genuine tall forwards, you wouldn't want to carry Tom, Oscar and Frost in the backline. I'd rather an extra runner.

You ignored two of my key points. Firstly, even with no Spencer they did not need to play him this week. They could have played Wagner who was dreadfully unlucky to be dropped. They only have one tall so no issue there. They didn't not because they had no option as some would like to believe but because he is in their best 22 and want him in the team not because of development but because they obviously think by having in the team it improved our chances of winning this critical match.  

And they played OMac all last season because.......

 

Edited June 13, 2017 by binman

[Cheesy D. Pun 1,762]

First half was poor, second half was magnificent.

Even during that first half with the errors and dump kicks out of the back half, I could still see why we persist with him. He positions himself beautifully and is a very good (if not elite) spoiler.

I can't help but feel we need to take a short term hit and pump games (and gym time) into him. 

[binman 37,763]

20 minutes ago, WAClark said:

First half was poor, second half was magnificent.

Even during that first half with the errors and dump kicks out of the back half, I could still see why we persist with him. He positions himself beautifully and is a very good (if not elite) spoiler.

I can't help but feel we need to take a short term hit and pump games (and gym time) into him. 

Insert GIF of head exploding.

FIRST HALF WAS NOT POOR!!!!!

[TeamPlayedFine39 8,150]

Racking my brain for the specific things he did wrong in the first half outside of the two poor kicks in the first quarter... (dare I say the first half of the first quarter)

[qwerty7 315]

OMac I believe has the potential to be a really talented key position defender and we saw glimpses as to why in the second half of that game. 

He has all the qualities and skills to be a star but he just lacks confidence at this very moment. I have a feeling Goodwin must have said to OMac at half-time that he needs to stop panicking and to just back himself because the Oscar we saw in the first half was just a shadow of the one we saw in second. He fought hard to make a contest and showed great composure in what was a really frantic last half of footy. 

The truth of the matter is that key position players take time to develop and it's rare that they are born stars. We let players like Dunn go and persevere in giving OMac games to hopefully fast track his development and it is slowly starting to pay off. I hope this is a turning point for Oscar as yesterday's game will only enrich him with confidence and belief that he really can take on his opponents and win contests. Goody made deliberate mention of Oscar's game in the press conference and for good reason, he deserved it! 

I think the issue is we are expecting too much of players like Oscar and Weideman who are only still early in their development. Their inexperience will sometimes frustrate us, but giving the games is the best way we are going to see improvement and build a strong future - particularly for Oscar as we desperately need to improve our backline.

 

 

[DeeZone 7,661]

Could not agree more PF his best game by far and he was relishing it, well done Oscar!!!

[Nasher 33,047]

3 hours ago, picket fence said:

So when he plays well and I acknowledge it isn't right??? Ok Ill shut up about Oscar then and let others decide!

No, it's bagging him incessantly when he isn't playing well that isn't right. Your claim that now is the time to show respect nearly made me throw up - it's always time to show respect, and you don't.

Glad you were happy with his output yesterday.

[picket fence 15,046]

2 hours ago, Nasher said:

No, it's bagging him incessantly when he isn't playing well that isn't right. Your claim that now is the time to show respect nearly made me throw up - it's always time to show respect, and you don't.

Glad you were happy with his output yesterday.

So Nasher, I call it as I see it and in my opinion he has been very ordinary and I have said so, I hadn't until yesterday seen anything that would make me think he will be any good. That is my right to express a footy view, after all isn't this why the forum exists?? We don't live in a fairy tale world unfortunately. He still might not make it , but yesterday He played his best game and I said as much. Pity that my comments nearly made you throw up! Tell you what, many of Melbourne footy clubs efforts over the past 50 years have made me nearly throw up as well. Now that is a real reason to chuck! 

Edited June 13, 2017 by picket fence

[jnrmac 18,914]

Good second half. Abominable first half.

One swallow does not a summer make...

[poita 3,573]

I've been saying it all year, 90% of what Oscar does is excellent, 10% is atrocious. There is so much positive stuff in his game, he just needs to eliminate the bad stuff, and that will come with experience and confidence.

Yesterday he didn't go hard enough at marking contests a couple of times early. Thereafter he was excellent. I fully expect him to play each week, irrespective of match ups. If anything, Frost or Tom can play on the smaller forwards, eg Dickson this week.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

3 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Good second half. Abominable first half.

One swallow does not a summer make...

 

Apparently it does around here.

It's odd that a player who plays to the standard you expect from someone playing in that position gets his own congratulatory thread. I'm talking about basic spoiling in the air and hitting basic targets by both foot and hand. He showed that he was competent in the second half without staring or doing anything particularly special. I saw him take a good intercept mark. But I genuinely can't recall anything other than him not making mistakes in the second half? (After making quite a few in the first).

I mean, the very creation of this thread is proof that he has been under-performing. 

Congratulations Oscar for not making any diabolical errors in the second-half.

If you are able to reproduce that effort, you may be considered a future star in the making on demonland. 

I'm more than happy to discuss in detail what it was about his second-half that posters think was anything other than solid.

Edited June 13, 2017 by stevethemanjordan

[Chris 2,892]

15 minutes ago, stevethemanjordan said:

 

Apparently it does around here.

It's odd that a player who plays to the standard you expect from someone playing in that position gets his own congratulatory thread. I'm talking about basic spoiling in the air and hitting basic targets by both foot and hand. He showed that he was competent in the second half without staring or doing anything particularly special. I saw him take a good intercept mark. But I genuinely can't recall anything other than him not making mistakes in the second half? (After making quite a few in the first).

I mean, all it proves is that he has been under-performing .

Congratulations Oscar for not making any diabolical errors in the second-half.

If you are able to reproduce that effort, you may be considered a future star in the making on demonland.

I'm more than happy to discuss in detail what it was about his second-half that posters think was anything other than solid.

The thing I noticed, and liked, was that he seemed to start having confidence to crash packs. A few times he flew and made a real impact to bring the ball to ground/get it out of bounds. In the past I have noticed him either hesitating or not going hard enough to make a real impact. he seemed to really throw himself at it quite a bit. He was also more composed with the ball. You are right though in that he wasn't outstanding, he was just very good which is what he should always be and is working towards. The potential is there to see, Oscar just needs to really commit to throwing himself at it in order for the rewards to truly come. 

[Webber 9,964]

4 hours ago, binman said:

Insert GIF of head exploding.

FIRST HALF WAS NOT POOR!!!!!

For some on here binman, Oscar's card is stamped. They'll never see beyond his imperfections, but will nevertheless expect something closer to perfection than for other 'favoured' players. As you so accurately make the point, some of those other favoured players made mistakes that were just as significant yesterday. There's just no eliminating subjective bias, so Oscar will continue to get a bagging unless he miraculously morphs into a cross between Matthew Scarlett, Glen Jakovich and Gary Hardeman.  

[Redleg 37,474]

1 hour ago, poita said:

I've been saying it all year, 90% of what Oscar does is excellent, 10% is atrocious. There is so much positive stuff in his game, he just needs to eliminate the bad stuff, and that will come with experience and confidence.

 

Interesting two statements. The first you have him at 90% of his output excellent and 10% of his output atrocious. When I contrast that with Tyson, who I would put at 30-40% atrocious, Melksham at 50% atrocious, ANB at 30% atrocious and his brother Tom, at 20% atrocious, he stacks up ok. As you say given his youth and inexperience 90% excellent is a good grade and perhaps you have been a little generous. I would have thought you could easily find 10% of Viney's output atrocious on a subjective analysis so it is an interesting point.

As to the second statement, read my answer above and you will see that it doesn't just follow that with experience and confidence, you eliminate the atrocious part of your game.

[Redleg 37,474]

You now the simplest thing to do, is for us all to get behind him and give him support and hopefully he develops into a very good player for the Dees.