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Demon3564

Leadership Group 2017

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Correct me if I'm wrong but I recall Garland and the Prince being in last year's group?

I'm thinking this year's group will be: Jones, Viney, Gawn, Lewis, Jetta, T McDonald &... Watts

Can anyone improve on this?

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Not sure that we need Jetta necessarily in the 'leadership group'; certainly we need him as a player. I'd be happy to leave if at six!

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2016 Melbourne leadership group

  • Nathan Jones (captain)
  • Colin Garland
  • Max Gawn
  • Tom McDonald
  • Bernie Vince
  • Jack Viney

Garland will go out. 

We might have Vince or Lewis, both or neither.  Lewis has had a significant impact and will play an even greater leadership role (especially as on filed General) when games start whether he is official in the LG or not.  Vince, I think is similar. 

While we have a lot of good young players there aren't any who are pushing the door down to be in the official leadership group.  Watts has always been one of my favourite players but not sure the leadership group is for him.

Edited by Lucifer's Hero

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54 minutes ago, Demon3564 said:

Correct me if I'm wrong but I recall Garland and the Prince being in last year's group?

I'm thinking this year's group will be: Jones, Viney, Gawn, Lewis, Jetta, T McDonald &... Watts

Can anyone improve on this?

 

Watts has had single year of consistent AFL-standard football. Why on earth would he be given a golden ticket into the group on the back of that? That's 'Melbourne of old' nonsense. He just needs to concentrate on backing up the year he just had and improve again. 

Gawn is in the same boat. Back it up next year. How many past players have rotated through the 'leadership group' only to show anything but leadership?

I'd like it to be a small but tight group of Jones, Lewis, Vince (he needs to take control of games next year given his age and games experience), T-Mac, Jetta and Viney.

And yeh Saty, I'm completely aware that none of our opinions 'matter' so save yourself the post.

Edited by stevethemanjordan
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Captain Jones

VC Viney

LG: T Mac, Gawn, Lewis

5 will do it IMO

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1 hour ago, stevethemanjordan said:

 

Watts has had single year of consistent AFL-standard football. Why on earth would he be given a golden ticket into the group on the back of that? That's 'Melbourne of old' nonsense. He just needs to concentrate on backing up the year he just had and improve again. 

Gawn is in the same boat. Back it up next year. How many past players have rotated through the 'leadership group' only to show anything but leadership?

I'd like it to be a small but tight group of Jones, Lewis, Vince (he needs to take control of games next year given his age and games experience), T-Mac, Jetta and Viney.

And yeh Saty, I'm completely aware that none of our opinions 'matter' so save yourself the post.

Gawn was in the leadership group last year and is a leader of this group. He made it last year after half a season of good footy. He'll make it this year after adding an All Aus.

Whilst I agree about Watts only playing 1 good year of footy I'll say he's also been a leader of the playing group in many ways for a while now. He's king of the kids - both in terms of fans and in terms of being popular with the younger players. If there's belief that he's turned the corner for good with his footy then I could understand him being picked in the leadership group. It might even help him go to another level. I don't think it's the same as Melbourne of old, I actually think it's a little alternative and a bit like Adelaide picking Tex Walker as captain when Sloane was available.

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Jones, Viney and Gawn are locks. Hard to see T Mc missing out. Hard to see Lewis missing out.

Jetta, Vince, Watts and I'd add Tyson are probably the obvious contenders if they want to go 6 or 7 strong.

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1 hour ago, stevethemanjordan said:

 

Watts has had single year of consistent AFL-standard football. Why on earth would he be given a golden ticket into the group on the back of that? That's 'Melbourne of old' nonsense. He just needs to concentrate on backing up the year he just had and improve again. 

Gawn is in the same boat. Back it up next year. How many past players have rotated through the 'leadership group' only to show anything but leadership?

I'd like it to be a small but tight group of Jones, Lewis, Vince (he needs to take control of games next year given his age and games experience), T-Mac, Jetta and Viney.

And yeh Saty, I'm completely aware that none of our opinions 'matter' so save yourself the post.

I normally don't read your posts anymore, but I agree with you on Watts but not Gawn, Gawn drives the standards at training alongside Lewis Jones and Viney, he deserves his place in the leadership group, T-mac has leader written all over him, personally not sure that Bernie is that interested in being in leadership group same with Nev

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Straight swap Garland for Lewis, vince is definitely a leader and one of our more experienced. 

N.jones captain

j.viney vice captain 

leaders: t mac, Lewis, vince, Gawn 

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If Gawn was in the leadership group last year and had an AA year and from my view appears to be driving harder this year its a no brainer. 

Watts should just continue to focus on playing good footy. Vince should focus on regaining form and removing the brain fades that cost him the odd report.

Lewis in is a given on what he brings and what has already been observed and mentioned over preseason. 

Jones, Viney and T-Mac re-select themselves. 

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3 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Gawn was in the leadership group last year and is a leader of this group. He made it last year after half a season of good footy. He'll make it this year after adding an All Aus.

Whilst I agree about Watts only playing 1 good year of footy I'll say he's also been a leader of the playing group in many ways for a while now. He's king of the kids - both in terms of fans and in terms of being popular with the younger players. If there's belief that he's turned the corner for good with his footy then I could understand him being picked in the leadership group. It might even help him go to another level. I don't think it's the same as Melbourne of old, I actually think it's a little alternative and a bit like Adelaide picking Tex Walker as captain when Sloane was available.

 

3 hours ago, Satyriconhome said:

I normally don't read your posts anymore, but I agree with you on Watts but not Gawn, Gawn drives the standards at training alongside Lewis Jones and Viney, he deserves his place in the leadership group, T-mac has leader written all over him, personally not sure that Bernie is that interested in being in leadership group same with Nev

 

 

Genuinely forgot that he was in it last year which clearly changes things. Obviously he won't be going anywhere after the year he had.

 

However, I still don't feel entirely comfortable with players being voted in without at least two solid years of consistent form. It's contributed to poor on-field performance in the past, having players come in who underperform. 

Anyway, what will be will be. But that's my take.

Edited by stevethemanjordan

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I hope the LG is a small number his year. Like Steve said, I want players to earn a spot in there, not just be given it

Max Gawn earnt Leadership Group status last year

Watts is close

But games like Round 2 and 22 cost us so deeply, we still lack a truckload of leadership when the game is on.

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Lewis is clearly a leader at the club.

Co-captains: Jones and Lewis. (Will ensure that Lewis is thoroughly invested in this club AND he deserves it AND I've no doubt the rest of the player group think of him in that light anyway including Jones.)

Vice captains: Viney and Vince.

Others: Gawn, T Mac and Watts.

 

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12 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Lewis is clearly a leader at the club.

Co-captains: Jones and Lewis. (Will ensure that Lewis is thoroughly invested in this club AND he deserves it AND I've no doubt the rest of the player group think of him in that light anyway including Jones.)

Vice captains: Viney and Vince.

Others: Gawn, T Mac and Watts.

 

Ron, mate, I usually like your posts: but there is absolutely no way that Lewis will be co-captain with Jones.

Jones has earned the right to captain the club on his own two feet, and making Lewis captain diminishes this. It also smacks of the 'Melbourne of old' STMJ was referring to: a premiership gun falls in our laps and is made captain without playing a game. I actually think even including him in the leadership group is a bit of a stretch (but understand where the sentiment comes from).

In all honesty, I think he would refuse if he were offered co-captaincy anyway (which he won't be).

Edited by Thrice
Grammar patrol
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28 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Lewis is clearly a leader at the club.

Co-captains: Jones and Lewis. (Will ensure that Lewis is thoroughly invested in this club AND he deserves it AND I've no doubt the rest of the player group think of him in that light anyway including Jones.)

Vice captains: Viney and Vince.

Others: Gawn, T Mac and Watts.

 

Bizarre post, Ron. Lewis a Co-captain? No chance. 

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Lots of candidates with real credentials.

Getting better every year along with improved performances.

No complaints and for once not too concerned about the LG make-up.

The clear admission is Garland. Raplace with Lewis.

Proceed.

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1 hour ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Lewis is clearly a leader at the club.

Co-captains: Jones and Lewis. (Will ensure that Lewis is thoroughly invested in this club AND he deserves it AND I've no doubt the rest of the player group think of him in that light anyway including Jones.)

Vice captains: Viney and Vince.

Others: Gawn, T Mac and Watts.

 

I'm not a fan of co-captains and even less of importing a player from another club and making him captain no matter how good his resume. I'm all for Lewis to be in the leadership group but not in either of the two top positions. 

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7 hours ago, fndee said:

I'm not a fan of co-captains and even less of importing a player from another club and making him captain no matter how good his resume. I'm all for Lewis to be in the leadership group but not in either of the two top positions. 

Generically, I agree with you, Thrice and Wiseblood on the issue of Co-Captains. I didn't even consider it as a possibility until I read some suggestion on another thread that McCartney had apparently floated the idea as a possibility.

Relevantly, I have absolute respect for Jones - I love the bloke and his commitment to this club. My view here is not intended to be a slight on him or his Captaincy - he deserves the position and I think that he should, and obviously will, be maintained in the gig.

That said, we have super unusual circumstances here. It is extremely rare that a senior and super well credentialled leader from a highly successful club with potentially more success in front of it, and with that player genuinely having gas left in the tank for at least another three years, seeks out a developing (and let's face it, criminally unsuccessful club over the past 10 years) and says 'I want to join you guys, help you with your development and share in the success over the next few years that we will achieve'. 

It seems clear that Lewis has joined the club for legitimate reasons. It also seems clear that he commands the respect and ear of the entire player group, including Jones.

I however want to see him empowered. For the very reasons each of you are concerned about the Co-Captaincy piece, ironically I think it's a good idea. What I would not like to see is for Lewis not talk to the group at the huddle at 3/4 time in a tight final even though:

- he should because he has stacks of experience in such a situation but doesn't want to be seen to be usurping Jones' authority as Captain; and

- Jones himself would probably want Lewis to talk to the group but doesn't want to appear to the player group as an impotent Captain in the circumstances.

Having Lewis as a Co-Captain negates this. Think about it.

We are developing club with aspirations to play finals, and not just one of them. Our leaders including Jones have little to no experience in this zone. Lewis has it in spades.

And I want him, and others like Jones, to feel that they have unrestricted access to that knowledge and experience. I suspect Jones would actually be slightly relieved with such an appointment. It's no slight on him, just recognition that we have a new Centurion in the group who needs to be properly empowered for the benefit of everyone.

One cannot under-estimate the importance of Lewis to our future success in the coming years. Let's just embrace it.

 

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remember when we were so desperate for leadership the caption had to be out of Davey, Green or Moloney?   fook me.  No offence to those 3, solid players but not natural leaders by any stretch

things have finally turned around!!!

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Capt - Jones

V/C - Viney

LG - Gawn, Lewis, McDonald, Vince

That's all it needs to be (I would actually give Vince the opportunity to decide if he wants to be in it or not).

Lewis doesn't need to be in the top 2 positions to still be able to use his voice.  I'm sure any player is encouraged to speak up at any time, especially if they are walking the talk.

Edited by billy2803
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1 hour ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Generically, I agree with you, Thrice and Wiseblood on the issue of Co-Captains..........

Relevantly, I have absolute respect for Jones ............

That said, we have super unusual circumstances here. .....................

One cannot under-estimate the importance of Lewis to our future success in the coming years. Let's just embrace it.

 

I agree with you Ron and understand the way you are looking at it. I also believe for instance that had Lewis been in the side when we played St Kilda two seasons ago we would not have got rolled in the last few seconds as he would have had us better organised. 

Having said that I'm still for the one captain model and would prefer to just have Lewis in the leadership group but can understand your point of view too. 

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7 minutes ago, fndee said:

I agree with you Ron and understand the way you are looking at it. I also believe for instance that had Lewis been in the side when we played St Kilda two seasons ago we would not have got rolled in the last few seconds as he would have had us better organised. 

Having said that I'm still for the one captain model and would prefer to just have Lewis in the leadership group but can understand your point of view too. 

The leadership group Lewis will be in is the 22 on match day

don't put him on a pedastal

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2 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

 

I however want to see him empowered.

Firstly, great response Ron.  

But I'm still on the opposite side of the discussion.  I've highlighted this small aspect of your post as I believe this is the reason why Lewis won't be a co-captain of the club.  He shouldn't need it to be empowered - he said when he arrived at the club that our list excited him the most, and that's all the empowering he should need.  He can still lead, support, encourage etc without the title, and to jump over the top of others may be unsettling.  

Let him do lots of good for the club as just Jordan Lewis; he doesn't need a title to go with that.  We'll get invaluable leadership and experience from him anyway.

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21 hours ago, Gorgoroth said:

Jones, Viney, Gawn, Lewis, Watts, Jetta, Vince.

 

21 hours ago, CBDees said:

Not sure that we need Jetta necessarily in the 'leadership group'; certainly we need him as a player. I'd be happy to leave if at six!

On the seventh day, Gawn rested forward.

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