Changes for Round 4

[Dr. Gonzo 23,723]

Really? That high?

The point is that he will be defined by metrics other than Split Uncontested Marks on Half Back that Directly Lead to Goals.

He needs to lift - he has been just going for the first three weeks of the season but he isn't alone. Garland is spasmodic with the footy, Dunn hasn't been as damaging with the footy as he has been, Jones is getting too many Handballs While Standing Still or Moving the Wrong Way, Howe is kicking dangerous 'one-steppers' into dangerous spots to dangerous players, Dawes has zero confidence in his ability to take a grab, Tyson needs to graduate from a few of the 'slam it on the boots' he does, Hogan, Garlett and Kent need to make the opposition pay or know their current limitations, etc.

There are, and one can take heart form this, very few players running at full capacity at the moment and yet we are stuck on Watts?

He has been poor this season so far (even his first game was 'just going' for him) but I am more interested in the exciting possibility of getting the other top 15 Demons to lift a little bit - that we know they can - and see where that takes us...

The reason Watts cops it is because of application, something that is non-negotiable and is also the easiest to fix. The other stuff is skill/decision making which still needs to be improved but is secondary to application which is the number 1 non-negotiable.

[DeeSpencer 24,784]

The question I have with bringing any midfielders in is are they better than:

Jones, Tyson, Vince, vandenBerg or Brayshaw in the middle?

OR

Cross, Lumumba, Newton on the outside?

OR

Watts, JKH or Kent as half forwards.

Personally I was impressed by what seemed like vandenBerg's first trial with more midfield minutes. I definitely think he's worth another run in that role. It's definitely time for Brayshaw to have another full game. I don't think it's time for Toump yet so I don't think anyone will come in for a wing role. Nor do I think anyone at Casey would provide more than Watts, JKH and Kent do in terms of giving us speed, creativity and skill up forward.

So the presumably forced change for Frost would have to be the player who gives us the most as either a 2nd ruck, 2nd ruck/forward or as the sub.

I can live with Pedo or Gawn, although my preference is probably throwing Dawes in for 1 game. Then I'd have Michie as sub.

It's not that I don't want to see Michie/Riley/Toumpas etc picked, it's just I don't think anyone in their corresponding positions and roles are worthy to be dropped.

[chook fowler 19,264]

In: Michie and Fitz

Out: Frost and JKH

[stuie 7,374]

OUT: Frost (inj)
IN: Michie

Not like for like, but I think we functioned better with the amount of talls in round 1. Dawes can do some backup ruck work seeing he's not providing a lot inside 50 right now.

[Deespicable 2,682]

In: Michie and Fitz

Out: Frost and JKH

Sorry Chook, but there's no chance Fitz will play, unless you are going to make a case for sending Garland, Tom Mac or Dunny forward.

But he's certainly showing something as a VFL defender and could get a call up later in the year.

The most likely ins are our three emergencies who all apparently did well in VFL again, albeit against weak opposition - Michie, Spencer and Grimes.

Frost sounds like he'll be out, Watts will be named on Thursday night so that Roosy doesn't cop a stack of phone calls, but will be a late withdrawal and Vince may yet face some form of disciplinary action from MRP, although he'd be stiff to cop a week.

Michie is a certain in and a decision will be made on whether to go big (adding Spencer) or small (adding Grimes) and that will be made on the night, depending on the conditions.

There's an outside chance that Spencil will come in for Jamar anyway, given the Russian's heavy workload the past two weeks, but I doubt he'll want to rest up against a big Croat.

The Tiges only play with two bigs up forward - Riewoldt and Griffiths - so Tom Mac and Dunny will get that role with Garland on Lloyd and Howey picking up Gordon.

Edwards is the danger man and will get Jetta. Salem gets Newman or if they go back to Morris.

I like our chances although the Tiges will be confident after their win and will probably start well.

Should be a very exciting night and I think JKH might find himself as the sub this week, allowing Brayshaw a gig - possibly even on Cotchin for a fair chunk of the night,

Vince on Martin

[1964nowMORE 477]

Hampson bog in vfl. We may need Pedo.

[DeeSpencer 24,784]

Come to think of it the 1 situation where a mid comes in to the side and starts is probably where vandenBerg goes back to a more permanent marking forward alongside Watts and Hogan, Dawes second rucks. But then I'm still thinking if it's Michie he's the sub because we still need the pace and outside run more than the ball winner.

The big question is can the 193cm Chris Dawes without a great leap be trusted to do 20% of the game in the ruck, whilst at the same time can Hogan/Watts/vanders hold up the forward line and Jamar do the other 80% in the ruck.

Ben Griffith's isn't much of a ruckman but he is 200cm.

Gawn and Pedersen must both be in the frame. I don't know what the right answer is.

[Je Roos Salem 661]

Bring in Pedo as a swingman/2nd ruck. Frost and Dawes both miss and we add a trash sub in order to give Brayshaw a full game

[Deespicable 2,682]

Having just watched a fair bit of the VFL replay (streaming) it's fair to say Viv is in the best form I've seen him in since he came to the club.

Sure the opposition wasn't great and he knew Spencer and Gawny would get the tap, but he read the clearances exceptionally and was the standout.

So following on from the previous comment, he is a certain in no matter what the situation or team balance.

I'm predicting the following line-up, assuming Frost is out injured - yet to read any update on the details yet:

B: Salem (Newman/Morris) Tom Mc (Riewoldt) Garland (Lloyd)

HB: Howe (Gordon) Dunn (Griffiths) Jetta (Edwards)

C: Lumumba N.Jones Newton

HF: Tyson Dawes Garlett

F: Kent Hogan Vandenberg

Ru: Jamar Vince (Martin) Cross (Cotchin)

Int: Brayshaw, Michie, Spencer, JKH (sub)

23rd man: Grimes

If Vince gets suspended then Grimes will play.

Cross and Brayshaw to work in tandem on Cotchin.

[Wunders 395]

Having just watched a fair bit of the VFL replay (streaming) it's fair to say Viv is in the best form I've seen him in since he came to the club.

Sure the opposition wasn't great and he knew Spencer and Gawny would get the tap, but he read the clearances exceptionally and was the standout.

So following on from the previous comment, he is a certain in no matter what the situation or team balance.

I'm predicting the following line-up, assuming Frost is out injured - yet to read any update on the details yet:

B: Salem (Newman/Morris) Tom Mc (Riewoldt) Garland (Lloyd)

HB: Howe (Gordon) Dunn (Griffiths) Jetta (Edwards)

C: Lumumba N.Jones Newton

HF: Tyson Dawes Garlett

F: Kent Hogan Vandenberg

Ru: Jamar Vince (Martin) Cross (Cotchin)

Int: Brayshaw, Michie, Spencer, JKH (sub)

23rd man: Grimes

If Vince gets suspended then Grimes will play.

Cross and Brayshaw to work in tandem on Cotchin.

I like the idea of it but i cant see us playing two ruckman, unless its Gawn and Jamar. Gawn kicked 1.4 on the weekend and rucked well. Spencer rucked well, but what does he offer up forward (nothing)? I think either Gawn/Pedo or Watts will be in Spencer's position (i hope Dawes is the second ruck so we go with more of a running team (as mentioned earlier richmond only has 2 tall forwards, so they will apply a lot more pressure I50, and i want us to be able to do the same up the other end).

[CBDees 3,165]

I doubt that Watts will be dropped if you go back and look at his goal assists. There is more to team value than merely selecting your 22 hardest players!

[Dinosaur Rover 197]

In: Michie and Fitz

Out: Frost and JKH

Play fitz on grifiths as frost on jenkins

[Dr. Gonzo 23,723]

I doubt that Watts will be dropped if you go back and look at his goal assists. There is more to team value than merely selecting your 22 hardest players!

There is no way in hell Watts will get dropped.

Those talking about Newton getting dropped, that's not gonna happen either. He has an ability we've sorely lacked over the years, the ability of a mid to kick goals.

We'll probably see one forced change, Frost for Michie that's it.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

Kent any chance of being suspended?

[Fat Tony 5,090]

B Garland, T McDonald, Jetta
HB Howe, Dunn, Salem
C Vince, Cross, Lumumba
HF Watts, Hogan, Kent
F Vandenberg, Pedersen, Garlett
Fol Jamar, Tyson, N Jones
Int Brayshaw, Michie, Kennedy-Harris, Newton (Sub)

Emg Bail, Dawes, M Jones

• Dawes for Pedersen.
• Frost for Michie.
• I think we look a better balanced side with one less tall.
• I went for Pedersen over Dawes because he holds his marks more often and because he is a better option as a second ruckman.
• Michie’s form in the VFL has been consistent and he deserves to come into the side.

[w00dy 146]

Michie in for Frost seems the smart move, liked our balance in round 1.

Anyone think that Howe could take the centre bounce when Jamar is resting? I imagine he could jump over most ruckman. It's a bit out there, but could work for short periods. Then use Dawes/Dunn around the ground to nullify the opposition ruck.

[rjay 24,615]

Michie in for Frost seems the smart move, liked our balance in round 1.

Anyone think that Howe could take the centre bounce when Jamar is resting? I imagine he could jump over most ruckman. It's a bit out there, but could work for short periods. Then use Dawes/Dunn around the ground to nullify the opposition ruck.

No

[Mad_Melbourne 872]

OUT: Frost, JKH

IN: Pederson, Michie

although the fact that Richmond really only play Ivan Maric in the ruck is a major benefit to us for selection this week.

Michie is the only certainty and should come in due to exposed form, if Frost is out maybe we will bring Pederson in, but could also be Gawn in an attempt to ensure we stretch both their defense but also try to dominate through the stoppages.

[M_9 1,986]

I liked the game of Watts playing in the guts in round 1 last year. From memory he was one of our best, and one of his best games for the year. Roos had gone into the season saying he was going to play him in the mid-field. I know he had other games where he was found wanting when he played in the mid-field, but I'd like to see him given another crack.

[olisik 4,060]

I wouldn't mind seeing Ro Bail come in for Kent. His 3 goals and forward pressure in the 2nds could be worth a recall. Getting tired of Kent missing opportunities and killing momentum.

[jumbo returns 6,703]

I wouldn't mind seeing Ro Bail come in for Kent. His 3 goals and forward pressure in the 2nds could be worth a recall. Getting tired of Kent missing opportunities and killing momentum.

So true!

He and Garlett have really killed momentum two weeks in a row, with their yips in front of goal...

[dazzledavey36 52,884]

Frost confirmed out of 4-6 weeks with a broken toe.

[jumbo returns 6,703]

Frost confirmed out of 4-6 weeks with a broken toe.

Of course.

Ffs....any chance we can have a change of luck and keep an unchanged team for a while??

[Bang Bang Bang 5,767]

Of course.

Ffs....any chance we can have a change of luck and keep an unchanged team for a while??

Every team gets injuries.

Frost is probably the most replaceable of anyone in the 22. He's athletic, hard at it and versatile. But he is hopeless as a forward (can't kick) and is not needed in defence at the moment. Pedersen has less upside but will be a more than useful replacement.

[Guest]

Frost confirmed out of 4-6 weeks with a broken toe.

4-6? We'll see him next year then.