Adios Brian Royal

[T-34 409]

Good, bad or indifferent I would like to take this opportunity to thank those assistant coaches who will no longer be with us.

Having had the opportunity to attend practice sessions regularly over the past two seasons, it staggers me to see some of the rubbish being put forward regarding the input that assistant coaches have had in our poor performances.

They have worked diligently following the plans put into place by the head coach with a midfield group clearly substandard in comparison with everyone elses.

They should be thanked that they didn't just throw the hands in the air and give up.

Having said that it was time for them to move on, giving Roos the chance to work with a team he is comfortable with.

This club has been far too ready to kick someone on the way out the door and to not do so in this instance shows an improvement in culture and a step in the right direction.

[ignition. 1,413]

So following your line of thinking - with a percentage of 56% last year - Leigh Brown deserves to go but equally so does Rawlings ?

Please advise if you want Todd Viney gone - he is in charge of player development and strategy - you must surely rate him the worst of all in the football department - considering we have had no strategy since his arrival and players development has gone backwards ?

Edit - if we are to judge anyone in the club with the same insight displayed on here then after the last two years absolutely no one would survive.

Now your just drawing a long bow.

If you have read any of my previous posts discussing Brown, I find him too hard to judge. Simply because the ball wasn't in the forward line enough to see that outfit perform, and that is a reflection of the poor midfield under Royal's guidance.

Similar goes with the defense under Rawlings, although on the contrary they got a workout week after week, the lack of midfield leading and work ethic provided poor options as a result shocking rebound 50 efficiency statistics.

With an appalling midfield (clearly Melbourne's weakest link stated everywhere) carries detrimental effects on both the forward line and defense. So how can we properly judge Rawlings and Brown?

As for Todd Viney, the overall development of the players has progressed reasonably. I consider him having the Mitus touch, I feel any job he does he does to the best of his ability and generally does it very well.

It's not as bad as those that ponce around that they can evaluate someone's performance when in truth they can't.

You have perfectly demonstrated the very point rpfc, myself and others are saying about judging assistant coaches.

I am judging Royal based on the on field performance I have seen from his work over the past three years, under two horrible senior coaches, although with the same crop of players and each time he took over the defense or midfield it regressed further. The proof there is in the pudding. I can not judge him on his character or work ethic.

Do you think I am one of those supporters? Or are you just advancing a stereotype that, if muttered by another, you would dismiss as readily as you have put it forward here?

I disagree that you can judge Assistants as wholly as you have done here - but they will be tarred nonetheless.

And people thank recently departed staff for their service because that is what good, solid organisations do - they don't shite on them on the way out. The club sent out a press release and a tweet thanking them and some supporters have concurred. The players thanked them at the B+F.

It isn't a laughable trait or sign of anyones weakness - it is just an honourable thing to do for people that will attempt to move forward in a career that has been tarred by this club over the last 2 years - most of it not in their control.

No I do not think you are one of those supporters, it was a sarcastic remark if I was to agree with you based on my post you insinuated as being embarrassing, laughable and confusing.

Generally speaking I agree with you and like the vast majority of your posts, I find you to be one of the more switched on or intellectual members of this forum, although this time we share different views. However to discuss these is one of the main purposes of a forum.

I understand the points you have made and I agree that generally speaking one cannot solely judge an assistant coach based on the team as a whole, although with regards to Royal's incredibly poor record over the last 10 years and regression of both the defense and midfield shortly after he took over certainly suggests to me that at the very most he is a B grade assistant coach and that I for one will not be thanking him for his paid efforts of poor performances during this era of pain and suffering.

Should the club thank him for his efforts... absolutely! In any organization particularly those within the public eye like AFL should thank their staff when moved on based on just terms, it is the honorable thing to do from the clubs perspective in order to further his career elsewhere and I agree with it. Although I didn't speak on behalf of the club I spoke on behalf of myself as a supporter and didn't understand how other supporters can applaud him based on the results of his outfit/s. So please don't take my words out of context.

EDIT: Spelling

Edited September 12, 2013 by ignition.

[Satyriconhome 9,982]

Now your just drawing a long bow.

If you have read any of my previous posts discussing Brown, I find him too hard to judge. Simply because the ball wasn't in the forward line enough to see that outfit perform, and that is a reflection of the poor midfield under Royal's guidance.

Similar goes with the defense under Rawlings, although on the contrary they got a workout week after week, the lack of midfield leading and work ethic provided poor options as a result shocking rebound 50 efficiency statistics.

With an appalling midfield (clearly Melbourne's weakest link stated everywhere) carries detrimental effects on both the forward line and defense. So how can we properly judge Rawlings and Brown?

As for Todd Viney, the overall development of the players has progressed reasonably. I consider him having the Mitus touch, I feel any job he does he does to the best of his ability and generally does it very well.

I am judging Royal based on the on field performance I have seen from his work over the past three years, under two horrible senior coaches, although with the same crop of players and each time he took over the defense or midfield it regressed further. The proof there is in the pudding. I can not judge him on his character or work ethic.

No I do not think you are one of those supporters, it was a sarcastic remark if I was to agree with you based on my post you insinuated as being embarrassing, laughable and confusing.

Generally speaking I agree with you and like the vast majority of your posts, I find you to be one of the more switched on or intellectual members of this forum, although this time we share different views. However to discuss these is one of the main purposes of a forum.

I understand the points you have made and I agree that generally speaking one cannot solely judge an assistant coach based on the team as a whole, although with regards to Royal's incredibly poor record over the last 10 years and regression of both the defense and midfield shortly after he took over certainly suggests to me that at the very most he is a B grade assistant coach and that I for one will not be thanking him for his paid efforts of poor performances during this era of pain and suffering.

Should the club thank him for his efforts... absolutely! In any organization particularly those within the public eye like AFL should thank their staff when moved on based on just terms, it is the honorable thing to do from the clubs perspective in order to further his career elsewhere and I agree with it. Although I didn't speak on behalf of the club I spoke on behalf of myself as a supporter and didn't understand how other supporters can applaud him based on the results of his outfit/s. So please don't take my words out of context.

EDIT: Spelling

What a load of self righteous twaddle, pain and suffering, what the sun doesn't come up each day for you?

Brian Royal had a crack, and gave it his best effort, I will thank him for his effor for my Club

I suppose you are perfect every day are you?

Edited September 12, 2013 by Satyriconhome

[Guest]

Brian Royal and Dale Weightman were unstoppable as rovers, changing in a pocket, for Victoria in the mid 80's.

Very good player. Spectacular mullet too.

He was a good player in his time at the bulldogs. He probably played against us that beautiful day in 1987 when we won at the Western Oval to make the finals. Ah yes-I remember it well.

[ignition. 1,413]

What a load of self righteous twaddle, pain and suffering, what the sun doesn't come up each day for you?

Brian Royal had a crack, and gave it his best effort, I will thank him for his effor for my Club

I suppose you are perfect every day are you?

Yeah I am, when I'm daydreaming about the 50's and 60's.

[Machsy 2,856]

Only play a small part in stoppage work? What about clearances, and working the ball inside 50? I haven't seen much of that the last two years.

I find it embarrassing, laughable, and confusing that people on here thank and applaud previous staff who have contributed to this appalling era.

To make it laughable should I thank him whilst sticking to the Demon supporter sterotype by swiftly clapping my hands together in a short manner and poshly saying "go deeeessss"?

Do we really need to belittle people the do fit the stereotype?

I know some who come close to fitting that and they ride the emotions just like the rest of us and aren't any less committed.

In fact, we need them to grow the club.

I don't see the point in being derogatory because they are less knowledgeable about the game.

Or rather, don't have the same misplaced belief that they're better informed, as this thread may show...

[ignition. 1,413]

Do we really need to belittle people the do fit the stereotype?

I know some who come close to fitting that and they ride the emotions just like the rest of us and aren't any less committed.

In fact, we need them to grow the club.

I don't see the point in being derogatory because they are less knowledgeable about the game.

Or rather, don't have the same misplaced belief that they're better informed, as this thread may show...

Who did I belittle? Unfortunately for us that is our stereotype, although I would much rather that over Collingwood's, Calrton's or Essendon's stereotype.

Prior to the last few years I was like that, I remember going to the games and simply enjoying it, loving it, even if we lost I was disappointed but still recall being pleased they were having a crack or blaming the umpires - you know the standard blames after a game.

Although now it's nothing but frustration, and I can't see myself applauding mediocrity. I guess its because I have only become more involved. To be honest I wish I could, but it just winds me up (^^,)

Hopefully sooner rather than later we won't have to worry for these kinds of discussions as we will hopefully be riding the highs.

[rpfc 27,391]

I don't really give a flying, ignition.

I just find little desire in hitting abloke on the way out - whether or not he was any good, do you think we were as bad for him and Leigh Brown as they were to us?

We have been a club where careers come to die.

So I am not about to curse the cursed.

That's where I stand on that - happy to dismember those who have the power to cause change, and lenient and understanding of the underlings.

[nutbean 8,837]

Now your just drawing a long bow.

If you have read any of my previous posts discussing Brown, I find him too hard to judge. Simply because the ball wasn't in the forward line enough to see that outfit perform, and that is a reflection of the poor midfield under Royal's guidance.

Similar goes with the defense under Rawlings, although on the contrary they got a workout week after week, the lack of midfield leading and work ethic provided poor options as a result shocking rebound 50 efficiency statistics.

With an appalling midfield (clearly Melbourne's weakest link stated everywhere) carries detrimental effects on both the forward line and defense. So how can we properly judge Rawlings and Brown?

As for Todd Viney, the overall development of the players has progressed reasonably. I consider him having the Mitus touch, I feel any job he does he does to the best of his ability and generally does it very well.

I am judging Royal based on the on field performance I have seen from his work over the past three years, under two horrible senior coaches, although with the same crop of players and each time he took over the defense or midfield it regressed further. The proof there is in the pudding. I can not judge him on his character or work ethic.

No I do not think you are one of those supporters, it was a sarcastic remark if I was to agree with you based on my post you insinuated as being embarrassing, laughable and confusing.

Generally speaking I agree with you and like the vast majority of your posts, I find you to be one of the more switched on or intellectual members of this forum, although this time we share different views. However to discuss these is one of the main purposes of a forum.

I understand the points you have made and I agree that generally speaking one cannot solely judge an assistant coach based on the team as a whole, although with regards to Royal's incredibly poor record over the last 10 years and regression of both the defense and midfield shortly after he took over certainly suggests to me that at the very most he is a B grade assistant coach and that I for one will not be thanking him for his paid efforts of poor performances during this era of pain and suffering.

Should the club thank him for his efforts... absolutely! In any organization particularly those within the public eye like AFL should thank their staff when moved on based on just terms, it is the honorable thing to do from the clubs perspective in order to further his career elsewhere and I agree with it. Although I didn't speak on behalf of the club I spoke on behalf of myself as a supporter and didn't understand how other supporters can applaud him based on the results of his outfit/s. So please don't take my words out of context.

EDIT: Spelling

I dont think it is self righteous at all. A tad delusional tis all.

So the problem with our forwards was the midfield and the problem with our backs was the midfield..hmm ok... and over the past two years our players have developed reasonably ?? seriously ?? Our players have gone so far backwards it is mind boggling - Nathan Jones would be the only footballer you would consider has made good progress over the past two years and gone from an adequate to a really consistent performer and has won two B&F's ( remind me if he played in the midfield and if Royal coached him ? Maybe Royal got lucky with Jones).

I absolutely get that Roos wants his own people - I also would agree that if you asked Royal himself how he would rate his years at the MFC he would rate them as a fail. Im sorry but if you want to judge these insiders with little insight then go for it but hold every one of them to the same standard and if you do every single one of the coaches would fail miserably and with no insight you would also conclude that Viney and Craig are miles away from a pass mark for their respective results of their areas of responsibilities

[Demon Dynasty 15,212]

I'm as happy as anyone that we have Roos, but we heard this when Bailey and Neeld were hired.

Not from me you didn't CB

[Demon Dynasty 15,212]

What a load of self righteous twaddle, pain and suffering, what the sun doesn't come up each day for you?

Brian Royal had a crack, and gave it his best effort, I will thank him for his effor for my Club

I suppose you are perfect every day are you?

Are you insinuating that the sun once shone out of Brian's....ummm?

Edited September 12, 2013 by Rusty Nails

[Scipio 5,868]

What a load of self righteous twaddle, pain and suffering, what the sun doesn't come up each day for you?

Brian Royal had a crack, and gave it his best effort, I will thank him for his effor for my Club

I suppose you are perfect every day are you?

He doesn't have to thank him.

Sure Royal had a go but the fact of the matter is that performance went backwards while he was midfield coach. I'm not saying he was to blame but somewhere along the line he had to be accountable and I'm glad he is now gone. I'm looking forward to seeing someone else in the role and hopefully a better credentialed candidate.

[dbj1983 138]

How this guy kept his job for so long is beyond me. Finally people making good decisions at the club.

[nutbean 8,837]

How this guy kept his job for so long is beyond me. Finally people making good decisions at the club.

agreed...its beyond you.

[Wadda We Sing 10,685]

How this guy kept his job for so long is beyond me. Finally people making good decisions at the club.

The light at the end of the tunnel is officially back on!

[angrydee 842]

The light at the end of the tunnel is officially back on!

We've only just found the tunnel. Ther's a bend or two to go before we can be sure about the light.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

He doesn't have to thank him.

Sure Royal had a go but the fact of the matter is that performance went backwards while he was midfield coach. I'm not saying he was to blame but somewhere along the line he had to be accountable and I'm glad he is now gone. I'm looking forward to seeing someone else in the role and hopefully a better credentialed candidate.

Churlish and unnecessary. You are trying to butter your bread on both sides by stating a "fact" and then saying Royal was not to blame.

Royal is smart enough to realise that his position like a number of others was in jeopardy given the train wreck that is MFC on and off the ground

As has been pointed out by others Royal may or may not be a great midfield coach. I don't know the answer and the heroes potting him have proven they don't know.

His role as midfield coach occurred between two failed coaches and a playing list that was significantly midfield talent deficit with an overall standard barely north of VFL standard. He and coaches like Leigh Brown are on a hiding to nothing.

[Scipio 5,868]

Churlish and unnecessary. You are trying to butter your bread on both sides by stating a "fact" and then saying Royal was not to blame.

Royal is smart enough to realise that his position like a number of others was in jeopardy given the train wreck that is MFC on and off the ground

As has been pointed out by others Royal may or may not be a great midfield coach. I don't know the answer and the heroes potting him have proven they don't know.

His role as midfield coach occurred between two failed coaches and a playing list that was significantly midfield talent deficit with an overall standard barely north of VFL standard. He and coaches like Leigh Brown are on a hiding to nothing.

Once again you fail to read something properly.

The fact is that we went backwards while he was midfield coach. I stated that 'I'm not saying he was to blame' not that I don't blame him at all. There clearly have been other factors, therefore I wouldn't blame him entirely (because that would be stupid) but yes, he has had a hand in it, in my opinion.

[nutbean 8,837]

Once again you fail to read something properly.

The fact is that we went backwards while he was midfield coach. I stated that 'I'm not saying he was to blame' not that I don't blame him at all. There clearly have been other factors, therefore I wouldn't blame him entirely (because that would be stupid) but yes, he has had a hand in it, in my opinion.

In herein lies the problem ( and I somewhat think that RR and I are arguing this to death).

Firstly the whole club went backwards whilst all our coaches were onboard so by your criteria every ass't and line coach had "a hand in it" and all failed. Lack of development means Viney had a large hand in it and the debacle of the whole footballing organisation means that Craig was spectacular failure.

An assistants coach role is not to teach the players his game plan and strategies but to impart the head coaches strategies and game plan - I am sure that a good assistant will bring ideas to the table but they would certainly be ticked off by the head coach and not implemented without authority.

So how do you judge a good assistant coach ? It is pretty simple.

1/ If he keeps getting a gig (which the head coach dictates) - he is probably ok

2/ If he gets the flick from a "Sitting" coach then he is either no good or the head coach has found someone better

3/ New coaches usually bring in new assistants

So yeah - Royal had a hand in coaching the worst midfield in the AFL with players who wouldnt play for the head coach (apparently) and with a game plan from head coach that everyone is still scratching their head trying to figure out exactly what it was.

Edited September 13, 2013 by nutbean

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Once again you fail to read something properly.

The fact is that we went backwards while he was midfield coach. I stated that 'I'm not saying he was to blame' not that I don't blame him at all. There clearly have been other factors, therefore I wouldn't blame him entirely (because that would be stupid) but yes, he has had a hand in it, in my opinion.

No I get you clearly. I don't know why you keep emphasise your "fact" when it's a self serving less than half truth about a greater malaise that inflicted and still inflicts MFC.

The entirety of the mess that is MFC, the ignorance and lack of knowledge of posters to the interplay of the head coach's apparent game plan, the lack of cattle and poor recruiting and development makes it impossible to make a rational, sensible judgment on the performance of assistant coaches. There are too many variables at play from where you, me and the average supporter sits to make an informed decision. I know I can't and I have tried. And you and I know you can't and you have tried.

But that does not stop the village idiot witch hunts that persist on this site of crucifying or potting the performance of club officials when the critics despite their foolhardy and silly bluster just don't have a clue.

[Sir Why You Little 34,420]

Paul Roos said last week.

"My Job as a coach is to make these players the best they can be..."

So as a coach did Royal achieve this?

Sadly one has to say no, our midfield got worse (Both with and without Moloney)

Now i am not suggesting that Royal didn't try his best, but i still say he did not improve any ofour midfield.

Why? Only insiders could answer that.

I wish Brian Royal all the best but i certainly donot rate him as a good assistant coach, because he failed.

He sure could play the game.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Paul Roos said last week.

"My Job as a coach is to make these players the best they can be..."

So as a coach did Royal achieve this?

Sadly one has to say no, our midfield got worse (Both with and without Moloney)

Now i am not suggesting that Royal didn't try his best, but i still say he did not improve any ofour midfield.

Why? Only insiders could answer that.

I wish Brian Royal all the best but i certainly donot rate him as a good assistant coach, because he failed.

He sure could play the game.

You're a perfect example of what I have been saying. Resolute conviction without knowledge.

It's amazing you can determine an outcome but admit only insiders could work why. Then again no it isn't.

Edited September 13, 2013 by Rhino Richards

[Sir Why You Little 34,420]

You're a perfect example of what I have been saying. Resolute conviction without knowledge.

It's amazing you can determine an outcome but admit only insiders could work why. Then again no it isn't.

did i ask for your opinion??

And who says you are correct anyway???

Did Royal make our midfield the best it could be??

My answer is no.

The shocking discrepancy in our overall possessions everyweek is a very good indicator.

But feel free to twist meanings around Rhino. I am sure you will all afternoon.

It's your job.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Did Royal make our midfield the best it could be??

My answer is no.

The shocking discrepancy in our overall possessions everyweek is a very good indicator.

.

Once again thanks for proving my position correct.

And thanks for the faux indignation as well.

[Sir Why You Little 34,420]

Once again thanks for proving my position correct.

And thanks for the faux indignation as well.

your position as an ex moderator and general sh!t stirrer.

My pleasure.

You still haven't answered the question though.

One More Time....Did Brian Royal as the midfield coach get the best out of his players?

I say no.