Bombers scandal: charged, <redacted> and <infracted>

[Gorgoroth 12,969]

I hope ASADA and WADA take what Essendon are doing and agree that once two players are found guilty that they hammer the club and get the club banned.

[old dee 23,797]

I hope ASADA and WADA take what Essendon are doing and agree that once two players are found guilty that they hammer the club and get the club banned.

Unfortunately I cannot see it happening

[Barney Rubble 1,576]

It's not good for Australian football codes anywhere so hopefully, and I say this without a great deal of confidence, our Socceroos can give us a bit of a boost over the coming few hours.

That last wish isn't happening Jack 0-2 at the 20 min mark

[old dee 23,797]

That last wish isn't happening Jack 0-2 at the 20 min mark

Totally expected Chippy

[jazza 1,323]

I think I heard on SEN that when ASADA issue notices that they have about 80-90% chance of making them "stick" so to speak.

Basically IMO they don't issue notices unless they are sure they can see it through.

It doesn't look good with that sort of record.

96% actually.

[Crompton's the man 659]

I read all of that including the article in today's Age entitled "Essendon should let go and admit error of its ways " but in spite of these things all I can say is : facts ceased to make any impression long ago and Essendon's position WILL NOT CHANGE no matter what

[jnrmac 20,104]

The second last refuge of the scoundrel is to blame the process. Its absolute desperation.

ASADA has no rights under its charter to conduct a joint investigation. Aside from being the ultimate red herring (and if it does get thrown out it simply drags the situation for another 3 years) I wouldn't have thought this is relevant in any way.

Its a bit like saying the police and your employer co-operated to find out if you were stealing money from your employer. "Oh but he police have no rights to conduct a joint investigation.

If Little categorically believes they haven't taken anything illegal (which he does) then attack the evidence ASADA has in court - not the process (that they agreed with) or the way it was collected.

Interesting article in The AGE today where it quotes the journo who interviewed Dank.

We took T4

Thymosin 4 has been banned by WADA

When did that happen?

2011

They must have changed it retrospectively

Oh, and we took Thymomodulin which is different

They have texts from Dank to the Weapon saying its T4 they want, they have the T4 orders to the CHinese drug company. They have the orders to the compounding chemist in South Yarra for T4. And most importantly they don't have to prove the players took the drugs. They only have to prove there was an intent to order them.

ASADA are giving the players a lifeline to avoid a 2y penalty by saying - step up now. The club is panicking that one will crack.

They are cooked.

As for Captain Narcissus, his $2m contract buys a lot of mirrors.

Edited June 13, 2014 by jnrmac

[John Crow Batty 8,871]

Kyle Reimers according to The Age is one of very few players who have not yet received a Show Cause Notice. Could he be a major weapon for ASADA?

[Maple Demon 449]

The Mark Knight cartoon in the Sun is so apropot, oui?

[Redleg 40,948]

What were they signing agreement to? Has anyone got a copy of the actual consent form?

ASADA has plenty of copies.

[mauriesy 7,299]

However, ASADA has no evidence at all of any player having any banned substance in their system at any time. The cases against the 34 players are all 100% circumstantial. So it's a very different situation from the start.

You don't need a positive drug test. Lance Armstrong didn't have one positive test in his career. Yet he was found out by a massive amount of corroborated evidence and data.

The evidence is not particularly 'circumstantial' if the weight of it points to a breach. I'm assuming the 300+ interviews and 150,000+ documents that ASADA have collected point towards definite use.

[Redleg 40,948]

Given that the ASADA CEO is basically offering 6 month bans, with some of the ban in season and some out, to players who aceept a no fault finding, any half sensible lawyer would be telling his client to grab it ASAP.

That means that a player could be banned for the rest of this season and half the pre season training, have no finding as a drug cheat and be free to resume his career at the start of 2015.

If I was a player with a Notice i would be at the front door of ASADA now asking for a pen to sign the deal.

This will drive a huge wedge between the club and players IMO.

This is the chance to end this and the club and its former Coach are doing the opposite.

I suggest the entire Essendon Board and its Doctor, think seriously about immediately retiring.

[deanox 9,935]

Redleg I agree entirely. I was very surprised to hear Watson's comments about what McNevit said. I don't think he understood them. He seemed to get angry and argue.

If they respond to the show cause notice by saying "this may have happened but we had no idea or was happening", given their previous cooperation ASADA may settle for 6 months.

If they for it in the Federal Court, I can't see ASADA being so lenient.

The court action serves Essendon only, not the players, but the players haven't realised that yet.

[Redleg 40,948]

And, perhaps most shamefully, it sees the experienced club doctor who was so concerned about the drugs program he wrote a heartfelt letter to the coach and the football boss complaining about it. And then continued to work at the club without further official complaint as the program intensified. A doctor who went unpunished and still runs the medical program at the club.

Read more: Time to put players, club and the game ahead of lengthy legal stoush

This is one Wilson article I agree with entirely.

[beelzebub 23,380]

Read more: Time to put players, club and the game ahead of lengthy legal stoush

This is one Wilson article I agree with entirely.

Have I not maintained all along he should be struck off for this disgraceful episode?

[beelzebub 23,380]

I still dont understand the part of WADA's code that refers to 2 or more strikes within a team results in a team infractionnot being talked about.

[whatwhat say what 22,783]

It's really not going to end well.

[Dees2014 2,377]

I read all of that including the article in today's Age entitled "Essendon should let go and admit error of its ways " but in spite of these things all I can say is : facts ceased to make any impression long ago and Essendon's position WILL NOT CHANGE no matter what

Caroline Wilson and Patrick Smith are the only two major journalists who really understand this issue. Caroline ' s piece in today's Age was again spot on. Basically, Hird and Essendon will try absolutely any avenue to get out of this no matter how tenuous. What surprises me though is that the EFC and Hird are taking joint action yet again. A friend of mine who claims to know Paul Little very well says he is scathing in private about the Hirds in general and particularly about Tania Hird. Apparently she is a serial offender not just on the Drug scandal but on her influence on Jame's general behavour. This I believe just points to what I have believed for a long time - Hird has something either on Essendon or on senior people at Essendon and has no hesitation to threaten disclosure of it if they don't support his narcissistic and delusional behavior. What other explanation could there be for an organization which has had long term success to behave so irrationally against their own best interests. If Hird had have accepted full responsibility and been forced to fall on his sword rather than fighting ASADA every inch of the way, the EFC would have been well out of this by now.

Edited June 14, 2014 by Dees2014

[chook fowler 19,459]

This episode highlights the view that a favourite son as a coach has many pitfalls. I remember Leigh Matthews saying this and was a reason he never coached the Hawks. Voss is another good example. Buckley may be the exception, mainly due to his strength of character. A football club is a fishbowl and it's easy to get caught up in your own mythology and have that sense of entitlement and invincibility. Also when things go wrong the club is in the bad position of having to sack or sanction one of its legends. There are no winners there.

[beelzebub 23,380]

No...its really just that James Hird is a fruitcake

[chook fowler 19,459]

No...its really just that James Hird is a fruitcake

he's that as well

[Whispering_Jack 30,228]

Given that the ASADA CEO is basically offering 6 month bans, with some of the ban in season and some out, to players who aceept a no fault finding, any half sensible lawyer would be telling his client to grab it ASAP.

That means that a player could be banned for the rest of this season and half the pre season training, have no finding as a drug cheat and be free to resume his career at the start of 2015.

If I was a player with a Notice i would be at the front door of ASADA now asking for a pen to sign the deal.

This will drive a huge wedge between the club and players IMO.

This is the chance to end this and the club and its former Coach are doing the opposite.

I suggest the entire Essendon Board and its Doctor, think seriously about immediately retiring.

I agree with what you say and I'm staggered that McDevitt has made the offer in that way because my understanding is that previously you needed to show co-operation with ASADA and that a result of that co-operation other anti doping violators are punished.

The other factor in this is how would WADA react?

[beelzebub 23,380]

Essentially the EFC is going the Lewinsky defence

[chook fowler 19,459]

If the sentiment on this forum is representative of the general football community Hird and Essendons are in a very lonely place.

[beelzebub 23,380]

If the sentiment on this forum is representative of the general football community Hird and Essendons are in a very lonely place.

Yes, but it will never occur to these narcissists that that's the case. They don't think they have done wrong and feel slighted for this attention

(typos)

Edited June 14, 2014 by beelzebub