Now it's time for the serious question

[praha 11,240]

Is 2012 one of the club's worst years ever?

I don't personally know the answer to that question. At first I would think, "Hell yes!", mainly out of frustration, but I would probably like to see it compared to other bad years, with all issues factoring in (including things like the passing of a prominent club figure and the implications that death might have on the club).

I thought this would be an interesting discussion, one that can hopefully remain open but at the same time diverse in constructive debate!

But seriously, this is the worst year I have ever witnessed, although I admittedly only started supporting in 1990, probably passionately in 1994. Compared to the best, this is smack bag down there in the muddy dirty unknown at the bottom of the barrel in years I've supported.

[angrydee 842]

1981 when our only win came from a goal after the siren

[P-man 13,366]

Without question the worst year in my time. But I won't say the only way is up, cause I've been saying that since 08 and keep getting proven wrong.

[Madness 44]

Pretty damn close. Let's be honest, if it wasn't for the franchise teams we would be rock bottom, with that win against essendon being are only fluke.

[McQueen 17,864]

Depends on how you want to frame it.

I still believe we're on the right track and this season is a necessary evil.

Not pretty, but necessary for the long term prospects of this great club.

[Madness 44]

Depends on how you want to frame it.

I still believe we're on the right track and this season is a necessary evil.

Not pretty, but necessary for the long term prospects of this great club.

I believe you've had one to many frothies mate!

[McQueen 17,864]

I believe you've had one to many frothies mate!

Funny. I was having a dry July and doing it easy until half time.

[Madness 44]

Haha,i was good until about then too, then my good mate Jimmy gave me a visit...

[Nasher 33,615]

It's the worst year ever! Except for all those other years we were crap. For example, I wasn't born in 1981, where we dropped 21 out of 22 games and our one win was against Footscray who themselves weren't a lot better, and we won that match by 1 point. On paper, that year looks as big a trainwreck as this year.

But you don't have to go that far back. I don't think we're any worse now than we were in 2008 - I reckon that year scarred me as a supporter forever. Sad that that was supposed to be the start of a rebuild and four years on we're right back to square one, but there's not much point dwelling on that now; we are where we are and we can't change history.

I reckon asking this question immediately after a poor loss is also going to produce very biased results. When people are still fuming about the recent result, of course they're not going to see beyond (in either direction) how we're travelling right now. The most recent pain always seems like the worst one. Objectively, I don't think this is the worst, but it's pretty painful all the same.

[praha 11,240]

Depends on how you want to frame it.

I still believe we're on the right track and this season is a necessary evil.

Not pretty, but necessary for the long term prospects of this great club.

I'll drink to that But it's pretty bad right now

[stuie 7,374]

May or may not be our worst year, but I've NEVER in my 30 years of being a Demon been as without hope as I am this year.

It feels like I'm not even following footy this year, and like my team doesn't have a soul at all.

I've never had a season before where my mood is so effected by it on non-game days.

[baysidedave 246]

Is 2012 one of the club's worst years ever?

I don't personally know the answer to that question. At first I would think, "Hell yes!", mainly out of frustration, but I would probably like to see it compared to other bad years, with all issues factoring in (including things like the passing of a prominent club figure and the implications that death might have on the club).

I thought this would be an interesting discussion, one that can hopefully remain open but at the same time diverse in constructive debate!

But seriously, this is the worst year I have ever witnessed, although I admittedly only started supporting in 1990, probably passionately in 1994. Compared to the best, this is smack bag down there in the muddy dirty unknown at the bottom of the barrel in years I've supported.

IMO yes it is the worst year l have ever seen, l was a kid growing up in 70's and early 80's and we were rubbish then but at least we had a go. This team is the most spineless gutless bunch of human beings ever to play for Demons, they need to clear out about a dozen players.

[Bring Back Barassi 552]

'78 was pretty tragic

[stranga 328]

Absolutely yes. not only the insipid football played but the lack of hope for the future on top of it ( I have no faith in the draft anymore).

[keep13alive 78]

They have all blurred into the same nothingness since '64.I really can't tell anymore.With the occasional punctuation it hasn't been good.Damn close to giving it away and investing my time and money into something enjoyable.

I find blokes on drugs riding bikes through the French country side absolutely stimulating compared to the MFC.

[Gorgoroth 12,950]

You can't shine [censored] and that is what Neeld is trying to do.

I'm over it as much as the next bloke, but I try and hold back and let Neeld have this draft to cut some deadwood and add some new players and I will judge them after a second preseason.

Mission did say we were 2 years behind elite fitness and unlike Essendon we did not over push our players.

[reynolds46 1,237]

Very hard question to answer as we have so many to choose from

[Dee Fan 3,247]

It's the worst year ever! Except for all those other years we were crap. For example, I wasn't born in 1981, where we dropped 21 out of 22 games and our one win was against Footscray who themselves weren't a lot better, and we won that match by 1 point. On paper, that year looks as big a trainwreck as this year.

But you don't have to go that far back. I don't think we're any worse now than we were in 2008 - I reckon that year scarred me as a supporter forever. Sad that that was supposed to be the start of a rebuild and four years on we're right back to square one, but there's not much point dwelling on that now; we are where we are and we can't change history.

I reckon asking this question immediately after a poor loss is also going to produce very biased results. When people are still fuming about the recent result, of course they're not going to see beyond (in either direction) how we're travelling right now. The most recent pain always seems like the worst one. Objectively, I don't think this is the worst, but it's pretty painful all the same.

That may be so, but last night our skill (?) level was as bad as I've ever seen it and it doesn't seem to be getting any better, in fact it seems to be deteriorating. Quite a few of the players we have will either have to be given a skill transplant or delisted. It's also our decision making; there doesn't seem to be a hell of a lot of our players capable of making decent decisions.

Is it the worst; maybe not, though I can't think of many worse skilled teams that have represented us but this lot are way up there. I will get back to the recruiting and the type of player we have at the club, also how easily our club and supporters are satisfied with our recruiters decisions and the late B grade players we pick up from time to time.

[JJJ 1,274]

This is the worst for me in my time (86 onwards)

97 was bad but at least we had some nice young players coming through and the glimmer of Jeff white and the 1st pick in the draft.

It's gotten to the point that I no longer battle with the wife to attend games at all costs.

[bing181 9,219]

That may be so, but last night our skill (?) level was as bad as I've ever seen it and it doesn't seem to be getting any better, in fact it seems to be deteriorating. Quite a few of the players we have will either have to be given a skill transplant or delisted. It's also our decision making; there doesn't seem to be a hell of a lot of our players capable of making decent decisions.

The two are not mutually exclusive. Throw into that lack of fitness (either for the kicker or the receivers), lack of confidence, lack of experience, and lack of stability (in the team) etc. etc., and you have all the recipes needed for poor skill execution. You're right about making bad decisions - but they should hardly need to be making decisions at all if everyone was doing what they're supposed to, and getting to where they should be (for which, see above re fitness, confidence, stability in the team, experience etc.)

It's all interrelated, and it only needs a couple of those components to be a little out of kilter to see the kind of performance we saw last night.

[Retrospective 104]

It is not just how bad are we now.....I'm more depressed by the complete absence of improvement....I reckon we are worse now than we were at the start of the season.

[Good Times Grimes 2,396]

It is not just how bad are we now.....I'm more depressed by the complete absence of improvement....I reckon we are worse now than we were at the start of the season.

I disagree. Round 1 against Brisbane was one of the worst performances I have seen a team put in. Follow that up with the big loss to West Coast and we were looking like a real wooden spoon possibility. Over the last couple of months we have seen some improvements from certain players and have seen an overall improved effort than what we were seeing at the start of the year. This weekend's game was a setback, but I do think we are better of than we were at the beginning of 2012.

*This is by no means saying that I have faith in the direction we are headed, or that I am happy with where we are at the moment. All I am saying is that Current Demons > Start of Season Demons.

[Diablo Deemon 220]

Hope is gone.

In 2008 I had hope.

They have taken that now and all I know is apathy.

We are absolutely pathetic its hard to concieve it's even possible how bad we are.

In fact I contend that to be this bad you actually have to work at it because it's not possible to be so shite without effort.

[Demon2 58]

All i know after this season so far........is that i will now no longer believe any pre season hype....from now on i am going into each season with the expectations that we will win 4 games.....that way i won't be disappointed when seasons like this happen again.

[daisycutter 29,613]

It looks like the demons have infected their aami stable-mate the storm with their loser culture